Best Way To Play This Shot?

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DrCue'sProtege

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
which way do you posters think is the best way to get position on the '2' Ball? would you prefer high right? or low left?

i guess my only concern would be if you played it with low left you could possibly bring the side pocket into play.

DCP

CueTable Help

 
Neither ...

You will not get the english to get to point A .... period

On point B, you cut down the angle off the 2nd rail, and probably would
bump into the 9 ball.

I would shoot as for point B, but using more english coming down on the
other side of the 2 (opposite of where point B is).
 
can't?

what about bottom right? would that not get you 'close' to point A with enough speed?
 
I would think that if you could get there with high right, then you would take the side pocket scratch out of the equation. I can put some unusual amounts of draw on the cue and would be scared of comming off the 5 into the side.
 
briandlau said:
what about bottom right? would that not get you 'close' to point A with enough speed?
Click to expand...

Wouldn't that kill it and just send it back and forth??
 
Personally, I would shoot this with extreme bottom left english and make dam sure that I came below the side pocket.

I'm not sure your 2nd rail point of contact is accurate on the top right english shot. That seems kind of short to me.
 
if...

Hal said:
Personally, I would shoot this with extreme bottom left english and make dam sure that I came below the side pocket.
Click to expand...


If i had to go this way, i would use more left then bottom and take the speed down a notch. i think i could get to the first to second diamond on the bottom rail doing this. I'm still learning myself how to talk and coach certain shots. when i'm at the table myself, I do what tends to work for me.
 
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briandlau said:
If i had to go this way, i would use more left then bottom and take the speed down a notch. i could get to the first to second diamond on the bottom rail doing this.
Click to expand...
Right. That's kinda what I was thinking. You could almost get on the other side of the 2ball. I've shot this a few times and can get to the middle diamond easily.
 
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DrCue'sProtege said:
which way do you posters think is the best way to get position on the '2' Ball? would you prefer high right? or low left?
[...]
Click to expand...

The ease of the draw shot depends on the age of the cloth. In particular the draw shot is much easier on new cloth because new cloth is slick. This means the backspin will not get wiped off the cueball on its way to the object ball. Pros have an advantage here (as if they needed one) because they play on new cloth in many tournaments.

I learned a useful rule of thumb from Ron Shepard. He said that if you are staring at a shot like this on slick (new ) cloth, pretend the cueball is halfway to the object ball. If you do that here, the draw shot looks clearly like the way to go. Of course ymmv, but the cueball hit with some backspin from the longer distance on slick cloth will react similarly to a cueball hit the same way on sticky (well worn) cloth from the shorter distance.

mike page
fargo
 
Snapshot9 said:
You will not get the english to get to point A .... period

On point B, you cut down the angle off the 2nd rail, and probably would
bump into the 9 ball.

I would shoot as for point B, but using more english coming down on the
other side of the 2 (opposite of where point B is).
Click to expand...

Exactly. The yellow line shown for the 3-railer is not possible for ordinary mortals, and I'm not sure that even Buddy Hall could make the cueball hit the second rail at the point show in the diagram, and even if he could, the cb would be spinning so hard that it might bring the 6 ball into play. The shot would have to be nearly straight in for the yellow line to be a possibility. The two-railer with draw is the best option, but the cueball is going to turn over after that second rail which will take it very close to the 9. You're better off juicing it a little more and staying on the bottom side of the 2.

Good luck!
 
briandlau said:
what about bottom right? would that not get you 'close' to point A with enough speed?
Click to expand...

The idea's a good one, but there's a catch 22 there. What you're trying to accomplish by using low right is a cueball that (after contact) has very little speed but a ton of spin. That will create an extreme angle off of the first rail (like the one shown here), but then you're relying on your spin to carry you all the way around the table. I don't think you could get there with spin alone, and if you shoot that shot hard enough to get around the table with speed, then your low english is just going to flatten your angle off of the first rail so much that you will end up over by the 6-ball.

The shot you're talking about is VERY useful in certain situations, however.

Good luck!
 
I would play to position B. I know the 9ball is in play and will possibly block my shot, but I don't care. I'd do it anyway.
 

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Aaron_S said:
The idea's a good one, but there's a catch 22 there. What you're trying to accomplish by using low right is a cueball that (after contact) has very little speed but a ton of spin. That will create an extreme angle off of the first rail (like the one shown here), but then you're relying on your spin to carry you all the way around the table. I don't think you could get there with spin alone, and if you shoot that shot hard enough to get around the table with speed, then your low english is just going to flatten your angle off of the first rail so much that you will end up over by the 6-ball.

The shot you're talking about is VERY useful in certain situations, however.

Good luck!
Click to expand...

you really don't need THAT much speed assuming that the cloth is in relatively good condition. while using the inside, you'll be aiming to slightly overcut the ball which means that the cue will already have some speed behind it. my only concern would be coming up too close to the third diamond on the top rail and perhaps hooking yourself behind the 4.
 
another alternative that you might want to consider here.

The inside english line is impossible on a medium-slow table unless your name is larry nevel and you happen to like smacking balls with tons of english.

With the outside english line, you risk hitting the 5 (in a bad way)

START(
%Am1E1%BE2O0%C]7J9%DN5L3%Ee7E3%Fp7W0%Hf9Q2%IH5P4%P]6S4%QJ8D5
%RF4H6%Ui7D4%Vl2E3%Wr1D2%Xn0D8%eC0`4%_k4E8%`d1L4%a^2R6%b`8D1
%cf0D7%dh4C7
)END
 
Aaron_S said:
Exactly. The yellow line shown for the 3-railer is not possible for ordinary mortals, and I'm not sure that even Buddy Hall could make the cueball hit the second rail at the point show in the diagram, and even if he could, the cb would be spinning so hard that it might bring the 6 ball into play. The shot would have to be nearly straight in for the yellow line to be a possibility. The two-railer with draw is the best option, but the cueball is going to turn over after that second rail which will take it very close to the 9. You're better off juicing it a little more and staying on the bottom side of the 2.

Good luck!
Click to expand...


forgive me for the diagram, i just meant to give the general idea of the high right shot, thats all. i wasnt trying to use pin point celestial mechanics on the high right line when i drew it up, so sorry.

DCP
 
briandlau said:
you really don't need THAT much speed assuming that the cloth is in relatively good condition.
Click to expand...

I don't know man. I've seen plenty of "impossible" shots pulled off, and I definitely wouldn't call this one impossible, but it is asking a whole lot of yourself and the felt. For a while I played quite a bit on GCIV's with 760 on them, and I might have been able to pull this shot off on those tables because they were lightning fast, and the side spin took like crazy. On those tables, you could shoot this shot fairly softly:

http://CueTable.com/P/?@3HWMd1PIAB3cWMd2cdxC1kIAB3kUYm3kbeW4kbHL4kCrj3kbgx1kadg1uCES@

and still get around the table using mostly spin. You'd break your wrist trying that on most of the tables I play on now. :D

Good luck!
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
forgive me for the diagram, i just meant to give the general idea of the high right shot, thats all. i wasnt trying to use pin point celestial mechanics on the high right line when i drew it up, so sorry.

DCP
Click to expand...

Sorry, after re-reading my post, I think I came off too harsh. Nobody can achieve pinpoint accuracy on these diagrams, but this just happens to be one of those shots where a couple of inches here or there can make a HUGE difference. With the position of the balls, the three-railer going forward just isn't an option for most people, so it kind of changes the situation altogether.

Love your situational questions, though. Keep 'em coming.
 
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