Guy Manges
Registered
Could the force of stroke, Hard or soft, Hurt the Billiard industry ? Can nothing be left alone... Guy
Breaking Force ?
- Thread starter Guy Manges
- Start date
There’s casual and savvy fans/viewers. And if the industry does its job, casual fans turn into savvy fans. I think break force is an ingredient to a recipe for a meal being served. Savvy fans know that gaffe breaks that yield a predictable and repeatable layout every time results in a kind of monotony where you see less pool skills on display for the more challenging aspects of the game, e.g. push outs, safeties, kicks, banks, jumps, etc. So there are certain meals that shouldn’t be served or else it will hurt the industry because your savvy fans will start to tune out. And the soft break is an ingredient that many can instantly see this meal is heading into an unfavorable direction (like adding anchovies).
For me, this event was a prime example of the meal I hope to never eat again. Soft breaking was the main ingredient. Other ingredients included template rack, 1 on the spot, no break box, and an ineffective 3-point rule. Some of those ingredients can work okay in a dish but definitely not all together like that.
www.youtube.com
For me, this event was a prime example of the meal I hope to never eat again. Soft breaking was the main ingredient. Other ingredients included template rack, 1 on the spot, no break box, and an ineffective 3-point rule. Some of those ingredients can work okay in a dish but definitely not all together like that.
LIVE STREAM | APF Asian 9-Ball Open | FINAL
Live coverage from the APF Asian 9-Ball Open in Singapore. This afternoon sees the final between Ko Pin Yi and James Aranas take place.#Asianpool #NineBall #...
www.youtube.com
Last edited:
Guy Manges
Registered
All we need , Brilliant... GuyThere’s casual and savvy fans/viewers. And if the industry does its job, casual fans turn into savvy fans. I think break force is an ingredient to a recipe for a meal being served. Savvy fans know that gaffe breaks that yield a predictable and repeatable layout every time results in a kind of monotony where you see less pool skills on display for the more challenging aspects of the game, e.g. push outs, safeties, kicks, banks, jumps, etc. So there are certain meals that shouldn’t be served or else it will hurt the industry because your savvy fans will start to tune out. And the soft break is an ingredient that many can instantly see this meal is heading into an unfavorable direction (like adding anchovies).
For me, this event was a prime example of the meal I hope to never eat again. Soft breaking was the main ingredient. Other ingredients included template rack, 1 on the spot, no break box, and an ineffective 3-point rule. Some of those ingredients can work okay in a dish but definitely not all together like that.
LIVE STREAM | APF Asian 9-Ball Open | FINAL
Live coverage from the APF Asian 9-Ball Open in Singapore. This afternoon sees the final between Ko Pin Yi and James Aranas take place.#Asianpool #NineBall #...
The savvy fans are all players themselves and still can't runout like Pro's no mater how they break. Yes these guys soft break and make it look easy, but theres noboby on this form that can soft break and get out like them so enjoy what your seeeing and practice it, the patterns still require high level skill or we'd all be Pro's by just soft breaking.There’s casual and savvy fans/viewers. And if the industry does its job, casual fans turn into savvy fans. I think break force is an ingredient to a recipe for a meal being served. Savvy fans know that gaffe breaks that yield a predictable and repeatable layout every time results in a kind of monotony where you see less pool skills on display for the more challenging aspects of the game, e.g. push outs, safeties, kicks, banks, jumps, etc. So there are certain meals that shouldn’t be served or else it will hurt the industry because your savvy fans will start to tune out. And the soft break is an ingredient that many can instantly see this meal is heading into an unfavorable direction (like adding anchovies).
For me, this event was a prime example of the meal I hope to never eat again. Soft breaking was the main ingredient. Other ingredients included template rack, 1 on the spot, no break box, and an ineffective 3-point rule. Some of those ingredients can work okay in a dish but definitely not all together like that.
LIVE STREAM | APF Asian 9-Ball Open | FINAL
Live coverage from the APF Asian 9-Ball Open in Singapore. This afternoon sees the final between Ko Pin Yi and James Aranas take place.#Asianpool #NineBall #...
People who hate soft breaks often put the onus on Corey. His pattern racking started the change in racking rules. The wing ball break with squatted whitey and one near upper corner pocket soon followed.
The break seen in World pool masters is here to stay, unfortunately. MR loves the golden break. The golden lights tell me this is true.
There are two simple fixes that appeal to me. First, make the break box a two inch square with the headshot in the middle of the edge closest to the rack which is placed with one ball on the footspot. Or just watch 10 ball
The break seen in World pool masters is here to stay, unfortunately. MR loves the golden break. The golden lights tell me this is true.
There are two simple fixes that appeal to me. First, make the break box a two inch square with the headshot in the middle of the edge closest to the rack which is placed with one ball on the footspot. Or just watch 10 ball
Huh? It’s not about whether the audience can replicate what they’re watching. It’s about whether what you’re watching has entertainment merits. Regardless of what the viewer can do, soft breaks for a repeatable layout after the break takes a lot of value out of the viewing experience.
Not for the league player, amature tournament player or the players who know what they are looking at it and try to develop it and use it themselves. Pool is for the us's not the them's...., the Color of Money is for them, because thats entertainment, but it aint real.
The most entertaining sports experiences involve rivalries. Sterile exhibitions of who executes the play the most efficiently ,takes the tightest line or runs the fastest lap might be high value entertainment for the purist but to really build the rabid fandom needed to grow the sport you need rivalries that trigger the emotions of the fans. You need good guys and bad guys. People to root for and root against. You need some drama and conflict to intrigue those casual fans into following the sport.
tomatoshooter
Well-known member
How hard should the balls be hit? I saw good spreads, nothing like the Corey Deuel soft break that barely sent a ball past the side pockets, if that. If there's a problem, it's the one on the spot, nothing to do with how hard they are breaking.There’s casual and savvy fans/viewers. And if the industry does its job, casual fans turn into savvy fans. I think break force is an ingredient to a recipe for a meal being served. Savvy fans know that gaffe breaks that yield a predictable and repeatable layout every time results in a kind of monotony where you see less pool skills on display for the more challenging aspects of the game, e.g. push outs, safeties, kicks, banks, jumps, etc. So there are certain meals that shouldn’t be served or else it will hurt the industry because your savvy fans will start to tune out. And the soft break is an ingredient that many can instantly see this meal is heading into an unfavorable direction (like adding anchovies).
For me, this event was a prime example of the meal I hope to never eat again. Soft breaking was the main ingredient. Other ingredients included template rack, 1 on the spot, no break box, and an ineffective 3-point rule. Some of those ingredients can work okay in a dish but definitely not all together like that.
LIVE STREAM | APF Asian 9-Ball Open | FINAL
Live coverage from the APF Asian 9-Ball Open in Singapore. This afternoon sees the final between Ko Pin Yi and James Aranas take place.#Asianpool #NineBall #...
Let’s describe what to avoid.
I don’t want to see the following all happen at the same time.
1. A specific ball is repeatedly pocketed
2. The lowest ball after the break is sent to a specific small zone on the table that’s easily pocketed
3. The final cueball resting place is sent to a specific small zone on the table that is highly likely to have a view of the lowest ball.
At the Asian Open that was…
1. Wing ball made
2. 1 ball bounces below the side pocket and parks gently in front of the upper corner pocket
3. Cueball cuts into the long rail and is gently drawn up table to the other long rail.
Granted they didn’t achieve that outcome every time usually because they’d make the 1 in the side or the top corner on accident. But they were clearly striving for exactly that every time and got it a lot. It’s a trick shot break. The spread of the remaining balls was misleading because they didn’t matter. At this level, that’s too easy of a start to the game.
Absolutely 1 on the spot makes that possible. Template rack makes it possible too. It’s still possible with 9 on the spot without a break box. I’ve seen players in prior world championships attempt it and get warnings they were breaking too soft. And then when they started breaking harder they couldn’t get the 1 ball parked neatly in front of the pocket anymore.
And Matchroom making the smaller break box makes is great. I’d dare argue players can’t accomplish a gaffe break. But at the same time, it makes sense to me that they don’t want players even trying to discover a new gaffe break. They are giving players a lot of levity by saying “hit them forcefully”.
You got players skirting the line feeling their best break is to find the minimum force they can apply without getting a warning from a ref, and then we overreact when they do get a warning from a ref. I say shame on them. They know how to hit it forcefully. Just do it.
Players like Kaci and SVB aren’t trying to get away with skirting the line. They are giving the break a good solid whack. All the players are capable of hitting it as hard as they are. Maybe not as accurately.
Maybe players like Niels should try to achieve that accuracy at a forceful break rather than try to skirt the softness line. Or if they don’t like Matchroom’s rules, go play 10b with Predator. That sounds more accusatory at Niels than intended. I love the guy. He’s just topical to make an example of.
Last edited:
I think there are a few on this forum who can do that. Tinman for one and then there are a few hidden players on here. Karl Boyes I believe plus others
Yeah I over stated my position a bit, I'm sure there more then a few that can get all the way out.
Ironically I’m scrolling through FB today and see this.
www.facebook.com
27K views · 2.6K reactions | This break will win you more games without a doubt! #8ball #8balltrickshot #pooltable #billiardsmagic #efrenreyes #9ball #cueball #billiardlesson #poolplayers #trickshot | Robert Czupryniak
This break will win you more games without a doubt! #8ball #8balltrickshot #pooltable #billiardsmagic #efrenreyes #9ball #cueball #billiardlesson #poolplayers #trickshot.
www.facebook.com
Here are some more examples of why there are break restrictions....
That’s a good contribution. I like to respect and appreciate the history of the game. Those Corey Deuel examples certainly serve as the most egregious versions of concerns with breaking.
My only contention is that there is a large population of people that think this is the problem we are trying to solve. Many of them fail to appreciate its not 2001 anymore. The three point rule has historically addressed this issue of that specific break.
I hope more people can understand that the breaking challenges faced in 2023 are born out of and derived from that 2001 tradition but in more modern forms. Modern soft cut breaks are not as egregious as the 2001 version but even though they require a bit more skill, they are unbecoming of the game.
There’s a reason why we see 9 on the spot, smaller break boxes, semi-subjective requirements of a forceful break, and a return to hand racking. It’s not tinkerers tinkering away aimlessly. There’s straightforward intentionality going on.
