Bring back the traditional nine ball.......who agree's ???

For the reasons listed by those who like the game of 9 ball the way it is, I've mostly given it up for Straight Pool and One Pocket. I'm open to 10 Ball, as I said, probably with some modifications. Doing away with the so-called two-way shot could be one of the best outcomes of the switch to 10 Ball.
 
ok, I am 30 years old and considered to be in the younger generation. Some of you people don't understand until you try it...... The old way kind of turns nine ball to a one pocket strategy at some points, say for instance when some one misses a shot and hooks you with no other choice than a 3 rail stab at it for $1000 or in the other game a player can strategically place the cue ball where his opponent may be able to hit it and may make a t.v. shot or give it back to you and you make the t.v. shot or you can play safe on him if he gives it to you. All the patience of one pocket in nine ball. Why does a crowd want to see you 3 fouled to death when they could see strategy and an incredible shot ? The shooter does not win if someone accidentally hooks the other guy and if you guys can 3 rail kick 5 out of 10 in, I say keep it the same......Just imagine "One Pocket Strategy With 9 Ball rotation"
 
bulletjr said:
How many of you out there would like to see 2 foul - push out nine or ten ball ?
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Defiantly "No". I don't think you have played push out in a while and forget how bad it actually was. Get snookered and push out, the guy says shoot again and you play safe. He pushes out, you take the shot and play safe. Guy gets out of position frozen to the rail and pushes off the rail. You decide to let him shoot and he misses and snookers you. You push out to a bank. He takes the shot and plays safe. This goes on and on. Original push out was "TERRIBLE" by any ones standards. That is not to say ball in hand is the way to go either but push out was even worse. I actually heard this argument among a bunch of old time players lamenting ball in hand yearning for the good old days of push out. Danny DiLiberto chimed in making an argument for ball in hand and how it is much better. Once he laid out his argument it was not even a contest and all had to agree. Like I said though, there are better rules to play by then Texas Express but traditional push out, no way.
 
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bulletjr said:
ok, I am 30 years old ..."One Pocket Strategy With 9 Ball rotation"
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It already exists. Called last -pocket 9ball.

But really, it is 1ball 1 pocket, coz the other balls don't matter.

Nobody has addressed why the pushout never appeared in other games, if it makes so much sense...

Black-Balled said:
It makes no sense for a player to have the opportunity to play the shot from anywhere other that where it lies.

Corey is wrong, I say! WRONG!
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macguy said:
Defiantly "No". I don't think you have played push out in a while and forget how bad it actually was. Get snookered and push out, the guy says shoot again and you play safe. He pushes out, you take the shot and play safe. Guy gets out of position frozen to the rail and pushes off the rail. You decide to let him shoot and he misses and snookers you. You push out to a bank. He takes the shot and plays safe. This goes on and on. Original push out was "TERRIBLE" by any ones standards. That is not to say ball in hand is the way to go either but push out was even worse. I actually heard this argument among a bunch of old time players lamenting ball in hand yearning for the good old days of push out. Danny DiLiberto chimed in making an argument for ball in hand and how it is much better. Once he laid out his argument it was not even a contest and all had to agree. Like I said though, there are better rules to play by then Texas Express but traditional push out, no way.
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This sounds a lot like One Pocket to me. It's all about patience and strategy, the key word being patience. Something most people today don't have. I respect Danny and Bill Incardona but disagree with them about this. However, as I stated before, I've just about given up 9 ball to any serious degree, not just because of this.
 
Strong opinions wow!

Im forever hearing people wanting to change a game to suit a few. Tighter pocket and tighter rules only benefit those who dont miss much in the first place. You can never take luck out of the game no matter what you try to do. Some vote to take the jump shot out. Jump shots are a skill shot just like kicking is a skill. The reason 9 ball is so much more popular with "The Bangers" as you call them is because its exciting. You can end the game with one shot. Its that excitement that make low level "bangers" want to support our sport. Nine ball is a game for "bangers for the most part, but its a game thats consistantly won by about 10 of the same guys. If it is as easy and lucky as everyone makes it out to be with the rules as they are, why are there not far more people winning the open events? If we tighten the pockets and make the luck factor a penalty, there will still be the same 10 or so pros taking the cash, because thats what they do. Just a B players humble opinion.

Frank C
 
Pushout said:
This sounds a lot like One Pocket to me. It's all about patience and strategy, the key word being patience. Something most people today don't have. I respect Danny and Bill Incardona but disagree with them about this. However, as I stated before, I've just about given up 9 ball to any serious degree, not just because of this.
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The main problem is, the shooter is never punished for mistakes, nor does the shooter ever have to take a chance. If they get out of position, they just push. If they snooker themselves, they push and so on. Like I said, Texas Express is not the answer but traditional push out is maybe worse. Not to mention the audience goes to sleep. Especially when the shooter passes up tough shots and pushes. They want to see magic, they want to see great shots and great play. You don't get that with push out. You just get two great players trying to do as little as possible and still win. If we had a tape of a few hours of push out and the same two players playing a few hours of ball in hand the difference would be obvious. You would fast forward through the push out right away, you could not stand to watch it. Push out provides a constant bail out for players mistakes. It would be like a golfer being able to have a do over every time they missed a putt.
 
Argueably the most popular players tournament in the country is the Derby City Classic.

Rule: No Jump Cues.

The proof is in the pudding.
 
macguy said:
The main problem is, the shooter is never punished for mistakes, nor does the shooter ever have to take a chance... Push out provides a constant bail out for players mistakes...
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Great post. Actually yours and fcee06's (both on this page) are standouts, IMO.
 
People are making too big of a deal out of the three foul part of the rules. When you get to the higher level players it is very rare to see a three foul attempt, let alone a successful three foul game. In the last ten years I can probably count the amount of games I've lost and won to three fouls on one hand. You learn how to kick two or more rails and you learn how to jump -full or jump cue. Other rules may or may not need changes but the three foul rule is nearly irrelevant.
 
fcee06 said:
... If it is as easy and lucky as everyone makes it out to be with the rules as they are, why are there not far more people winning the open events? If we tighten the pockets and make the luck factor a penalty, there will still be the same 10 or so pros taking the cash, because thats what they do. ...
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As I've said in other threads, the element of luck in pool is not significant enough to allow a mediocre player to beat several champions in a row to win a big tournament. So it's always going to be a top player who wins. But luck is significant enough to be a factor (and sometimes a huge factor) in determining which of the top players wins any particular event.
 
macguy said:
The main problem is, the shooter is never punished for mistakes, nor does the shooter ever have to take a chance. If they get out of position, they just push. If they snooker themselves, they push and so on. Like I said, Texas Express is not the answer but traditional push out is maybe worse. Not to mention the audience goes to sleep. Especially when the shooter passes up tough shots and pushes. They want to see magic, they want to see great shots and great play. You don't get that with push out. You just get two great players trying to do as little as possible and still win. If we had a tape of a few hours of push out and the same two players playing a few hours of ball in hand the difference would be obvious. You would fast forward through the push out right away, you could not stand to watch it. Push out provides a constant bail out for players mistakes. It would be like a golfer being able to have a do over every time they missed a putt.
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The incoming player is punished for missed and so-called two-way shots. Force the shooter to either call a shot or a safety.
 
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