Call shot rules question

[VIProfessor]

Many thanks for all the excellent responses. I think I have enough to go on in terms of instructing our referees. Once again, despite all the drama we have on here sometimes, AZBilliards proves its worth as the greatest pool forum on Earth!

 

[Bob Jewett]

I consulted the TD was told I made the right call. I did what I was told to do. The players were told this before the matches started also. ...

Yes, I understand. Sometimes TDs get it wrong. I've seen some really bad ones. At 14.1 when the ref is calling shots some players tune the ref out and are completely unaware of what the ref is calling. It is not easy to be a good 14.1 ref. Among other things you have to be in line to see which shot the players is shooting but not in the player's line of site and you have to be in the right place to see touch fouls. I've seen 14.1 refs who stood like statues back from the table -- they were not doing their jobs.

 

[John Novak]

Here's the situation: In a tournament match presided over by a referee, a player is lining up on a ball hanging in the corner pocket and calls "14 in the corner". In reality, however, he has called the wrong number and the ball is actually the 15. Does the referee declare his turn over, or does he award him the shot on the basis that the shot was obvious? We're playing by BCAPL rules, but haven't found anything in the rulebook to address this particular situation. As such input from Mark, Jay and all others who know these things would be greatly appreciated. Many thanks!!

I would say the only time it would be considered a foul is if the 14 and the 15 were lodged in the pocket, or involved in that shot, and he called the 14 but potted the 15. However if the ball he nominated wasnt in the line of the shot, then it wouldnt be a foul, He just made a mistake, Im suprised the ref didnt question the called ball before he shot it. Rules are in place to keep the game PURE, they arent there for deception or trickery. Even if there is no ref assigned to the game, both players become the ref. Ive seen ref's correct a players call, so why not you. I wouldnt want to win a game that was won by trickery or a cheap call. Id want to win on skill.

 

[WoodyJ]

I have seen some jack wagons call a foul because the (8 ball)pocket marker was touching the first diamond. Just barely touching it. And the rule is,,the marker has to be inside the diamond,,completely.
And this after the player put it there,,obviously calling that pocket!!! And this seems to be a fairly common thing now a days.

The refs agree it is a foul. Valley pool BTW.

So if that is a foul,,,this would also be a foul.

If you are a jack wagon,,,it's a foul!!!

Another dirty trick I have witnessed first hand,,,,is when there is no shot for my opponent. He looks right at me,,and touches the cue with his stick. Moving it no where,,,and has a smile on his face.

Then you/me walk up and pick the ball up,,,,and he calls foul!!!! Gets a ref over and ,,yep,,I didn't ask if it was BIH. It's now his shot.


Things like this will get you hurt ,,,but there are Jack arses out there doing it.


I don't play that crap. I would not call foul in any of these situations. Welll,,,unless he is the person I referred to above!!!

If this crap continues,,,the game will be a bunch of sissys playing whinner pool in the coming years!!!

Have seen this also. Was just wondering if you could wipe the smile off the person's face by calling unsportsman like conduct and asking the TD for the game.

By that I mean isn't it unsportsman like conduct to say shoot with the wrong end of your cue (i.e., the rubber bumper end) and not contact the cue ball with the tip of your cue (i.e., on purpose). Sounds like the person didn't touch the cue ball with the cue's tip (say just tapped it on the top with the ferrule) because it didn't roll anywhere according to you.

This is also why I now always ask if it's BIH if I think my opponent fouls and also why I always try to pick up the cue and hand it to my opponent when I foul.

 

[smoooothstroke]

Here's the situation: In a tournament match presided over by a referee, a player is lining up on a ball hanging in the corner pocket and calls "14 in the corner". In reality, however, he has called the wrong number and the ball is actually the 15. Does the referee declare his turn over, or does he award him the shot on the basis that the shot was obvious? We're playing by BCAPL rules, but haven't found anything in the rulebook to address this particular situation. As such input from Mark, Jay and all others who know these things would be greatly appreciated. Many thanks!!

Your question involves a ref so yes his turn is over.

If there is no ref I would just let him keep shooting,if it was an obvious shot I would be watching the play and not even notice what number he called.

 

[OnTheMF]

imo, this is the correct call. Just because there is a dollar involved should not mean that honesty and integrity is out the window. :boring2:

The real issue is that a lot of players like to try some "crazy stuff." In my case both balls are near the pocket. Even though he lines up on a particular ball, maybe he's attempting some sort of combo to break out the other ball, or a carom, or something of that nature. Now we're in a situation where a player basically gets a free shot to hammer a bunch of balls and shoot again regardless of which goes in.

It really has nothing to do with honesty and integrity. I suppose I forgot to mention this was the second time it happened with this particular player. He did it earlier in the night against another player on my team, who let it slide after warning him he shot the wrong ball. Again it was a situation where both balls would've gone in the same corner and he ended up crashing into a couple clusters.

The only reason I mentioned the cash is that I let a lot slide when the game is pretty much meaningless, just to avoid what usually turns into a drunken argument. But once my cash is on the line it's a different story.