CBSA - What A Joke !!
- Thread starter JC51534
- Start date
I''m sorry about the whole thing and I must say it should have never happened in the first place. My intention all along was to promote pool from the amateur level ever since I got to know John Morra at Petrinas and he was a 4 hc and I was a 5, from there to where it is now is like one new world has gone by.......never regretted the driving alone from niagara to Peterborough or anywhere else as long as I had a good time and good time they were.DaveK said:
If at any time some one or some association wants to better pool......I'm in...just ask, my system of handicap was created by foot work, not in my mind and with the new system of advanced amateur is even better.......it affords all players alike an opportunity to cash in and at the same time offers the thrill of real competition.
Leave your comments and perhaps poll the players that have benefited from competition with full fields as in the past, perhaps a united goal is better than a divided front
Only thinking out loud!!!!!!!! or maybe not
from my point as a spectator i though willy did a great job from the tournaments that i watched. where else can you win that kind of money. A job well done willy!:smile:
Thanks friend, as always there will be some for and some against.......but the bottom line has always been for the better of the sport.ballbanger said:
I can recollect when there was not handicap tournaments and small fields where the owners had to add money with out the possibility of having a return in sales. In essence a tournament is for both the players as well as he owners of buss, if not the well will dry up sooner than later.
Then the tounaments with handicaps started to become popular and even assoc.. that never had handicaps started to have tournament with differences (handicap) their formats change to much the same as the 10-20-30K alternate breaks, box, rack your own, etc.
Truly hope there is hope for amateur pool in the coming history as I personally would like to play and not direct.
I do wish all a better tomorrow, as today is about to end!!
Good fortunes and prosper to all
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By the way, I'm cruising South America (scoutting) local talent to see where there may be someone capable of coming North to battle as my invitee and see if we can measure some sticks
In the mean time if I find something I will share with you all, perhaps there is another Johnny or Erik, Jason, etc. down here.
Have a nice one again
In the mean time if I find something I will share with you all, perhaps there is another Johnny or Erik, Jason, etc. down here.
Have a nice one again
srs314
shooterville.com
Amateur level is so important to focus on because in most events they make up 95% of the field.
In my opinion there are four kinds of players.
1. League players that are not interested in tournaments outside the league system.
2. Amateurs that are happy with the level they are at and due to other priorities like work or family don't have the time or desire to improve. There love of the game and the people around it is what brings them to compete.
3. Amateur players that are truly trying to improve their game and get to the level of the top players.
4. Pro players who play for a living.
Finding a way to bring all these players out to one event is tricky. Willy has done it, and the first year numbers were amazing, they lowered in the next couple years but I think only becasue there were so many more events. The handicap format gave amateurs a chance to win. Shooters and Bigwigs have done a similar thing with the 404 events.
There may never be a perfect system becuase the top players can just keep you off the table no matter what your handicap is if they play good. This is proven by the results of events.
Anybody with any great ideas? I'm sure the tour directors would like to hear them, so post them.
In my opinion there are four kinds of players.
1. League players that are not interested in tournaments outside the league system.
2. Amateurs that are happy with the level they are at and due to other priorities like work or family don't have the time or desire to improve. There love of the game and the people around it is what brings them to compete.
3. Amateur players that are truly trying to improve their game and get to the level of the top players.
4. Pro players who play for a living.
Finding a way to bring all these players out to one event is tricky. Willy has done it, and the first year numbers were amazing, they lowered in the next couple years but I think only becasue there were so many more events. The handicap format gave amateurs a chance to win. Shooters and Bigwigs have done a similar thing with the 404 events.
There may never be a perfect system becuase the top players can just keep you off the table no matter what your handicap is if they play good. This is proven by the results of events.
Anybody with any great ideas? I'm sure the tour directors would like to hear them, so post them.
suel said:
As long as you are here and the current VP of the CBSA I have to ask you how your organization has such a seemingly minimal focus on actually running quality events across Canada? Last years Alberta 8-ball championships were a total gongshow, the bulk of people in Calgary had no idea that they were even going on and the turnout almost caused the entire tournament to fold. How is a provincial qualifier for the national event so absolutely terribly advertised such that this happens while a person like Jim Wych can run a tour across Canada that gets the players attention and advertises their events well in advance to great effect? I myself heard about the alberta 8-ball championships at Oc's THE DAY OF THE EVENT from a friend who just happend to call me who plays out of Oc's all the time.
Also, why is the national event ALWAYS in Eastern Canada? We actually have a huge number of players in this western area of the country as well that would take part in the competition if you A) actually advertise it and make us aware of it's existence, and B) actually put on quality events on this other part of the country, perhaps alternating between East and West each year. At present the whole thing seems to have a tremendous biase towards the East and makes us in the west wonder how effective your organization is when the only first hand experience we have is a 8-ball championship that hardly anyone knows about that gets a total of 8 players.
A summation of this post, you guys are seriously not doing a good enough job. Either start working a whole lot harder to make the organization work well and have a quality stable of events to send the players of Canada to the international competitions or get out of the way so that people who have the will and ability to do so actually can.
srs314
shooterville.com
Celtic,
I'm not sure if you have read much of this forum but the last time it was scheduled and set to run in the west 3 years ago the room there was forced to back out for financial reasons. A room in Ontario stepped up to host. No other room in the west stepped up at that time and none have since.
If you can mention any rooms out west that have to table and person capacity I'm sure they would be considered in the future. Or if not a room a comference center or other location willing to give the space as sponsorship. Canada is a big country and I agree it would be great to have other provinces host the Canadian Championship.
As far as your local qualifiers you should contact your provincial rep with your issues.
Your summation is unfair, our Canadian Association is successful in sending players to the World Championship which is their mandate from the WPA. They have worked with Jim Wych in the past to qualify players through his tour.
Maybe instead of saying people don't work hard a better approach would be to suggest some constructive ideas. I just think it's a better way to influence change.
I'm not sure if you have read much of this forum but the last time it was scheduled and set to run in the west 3 years ago the room there was forced to back out for financial reasons. A room in Ontario stepped up to host. No other room in the west stepped up at that time and none have since.
If you can mention any rooms out west that have to table and person capacity I'm sure they would be considered in the future. Or if not a room a comference center or other location willing to give the space as sponsorship. Canada is a big country and I agree it would be great to have other provinces host the Canadian Championship.
As far as your local qualifiers you should contact your provincial rep with your issues.
Your summation is unfair, our Canadian Association is successful in sending players to the World Championship which is their mandate from the WPA. They have worked with Jim Wych in the past to qualify players through his tour.
Maybe instead of saying people don't work hard a better approach would be to suggest some constructive ideas. I just think it's a better way to influence change.
srs314 said:
How about actively seeking out those rooms that might be able to support the events? I know the owner of Oc's wishes to get into the large tournaments more but has had issues with contacting the people that he would need to talk to.
I would happily spend a heap of time and do their job and make a better running system. Of course I would expect that they in turn send someone to take up my geophysics degree, keeping my 3.5 gpa and of course doing the 13 hour/7 day a week summer employment I do. Otherwise no, I am not going to do THEIR job on my very small window of free time. I don't after all have the neat little VP of blah blah blah after my name on this forum do I? If the CSBA thinks people like me should be doing a huge amount of their logistics work then there is a serious problem in their design and thinking right there.
Want some constructive comments? Get out and talk to the room owners and find out what is out there and who is interested in perhaps running events. Plan events well in advance and make sure they are properly advertised so that the players know they actually exist. I mean, this is not rocket science, I would not assume I actually have to say this type of stuff.... but then again this minimal amount of stuff itself is not getting done so I guess it actually does need to be said.
Defend them all you want, I see you are in the East and I am sure your provincial championships are not the absurd joke our 8-ball event was this year, if it were then I know you would not be spouting off on the great job they were doing. Take my word, the Alberta 8-ball event is NOT good enough, it is not even friggin close when at 10:00 AM the day of the event after driving an hour to get to the pool hall the people there are talking about just canceling the event because there are not enough people to even make it a real tournament. We had plenty of events in Alberta last year, and this was the only one that turned into a joke of a fiasco, and this is supposed to be the premier Canadian pool and snooker organization sanctioning events like this? No, it is not good enough, and no I am not going to fix it for them and do all their work, I already do plenty and have my own responsibilities I actually take care of and do a good job at. If they can not deal with their own then they should as I said quit and let someone move in who can do a far better job. Instead they will probably keep their slack ass posts doing a minimal amount of work and screw this sport over further in this country because it is claer they don't give a flying ****.
Celtic said:
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Hey Celtic,
If I'm not mistaken the CBSA is made up of volunteers, not people employed by the CBSA. Meaning they don't receive pay. They have full time jobs, families, ect. So they are taking time out of their small windows of time each day to do what they can for pool in Canada.
Was all the planning done this year great, nope. But as pool players and lovers of the game we should try to think of ways to better our sport.
Its hard to blast people for their efforts if your not willing to do anything yourself. IMO
It really sucks it wasnt better planned in your area. I also would like to see the Canadians rotate around our country each year. But pool is not in the greatest shape right now. Its not like there is tons of cash to throw around promoting and hosting the Canadians.
The only way we get our info around here on tournies ect is from Shooterville...which by the way is run by volunteers.
JD_Hogg said:
This wouldn't work too well for me, heck there aren't even any pool halls in Saskatchewan listed at the site. There are a few Alberta halls (4 perhaps) listed, and even less BC halls (I think I found 1). There are also a few from Manitoba. Of course there are several hundred pool halls listed, the vast majority being in Ontario. It certainly seems to me that the focus of Shooterville is the province of Ontario.
Dave
srs314
shooterville.com
Dave,
Shooterville is available to any province to advertise their events or rooms on for free, qualifiers were advertised from other provinces this year.
Alberta sent us this and it was posted right away,
http://www.shooterville.com/tourdetails.asp?id=56
All someone has to do is send me the folowing info for a room.
Room Name, Address, City, Province, Postal Code, Phone Number. We will also link to a website and use their logo if it's sent.
For events we simply need,
Date, Tour associated with, Room Hosting and a poster if there is one.
Unfortunately I'm not as in tune with the rooms and the scene in other parts of Canada as I would like to be and I rely on things to be sent to me. It is on the room owner or tour opperator to seek out places to post their events. I would be happy to post events and news stories from other parts of Canada. This would increase my viewer base and help me get more payed product advertisors.
Of course I come across more from Ontario since I live and play here.
I am looking at setting up Shooterville so people may just post their events and rooms which may help.
Hope this explanation will change how you feel about my sites support,
Shooterville is available to any province to advertise their events or rooms on for free, qualifiers were advertised from other provinces this year.
Alberta sent us this and it was posted right away,
http://www.shooterville.com/tourdetails.asp?id=56
All someone has to do is send me the folowing info for a room.
Room Name, Address, City, Province, Postal Code, Phone Number. We will also link to a website and use their logo if it's sent.
For events we simply need,
Date, Tour associated with, Room Hosting and a poster if there is one.
Unfortunately I'm not as in tune with the rooms and the scene in other parts of Canada as I would like to be and I rely on things to be sent to me. It is on the room owner or tour opperator to seek out places to post their events. I would be happy to post events and news stories from other parts of Canada. This would increase my viewer base and help me get more payed product advertisors.
Of course I come across more from Ontario since I live and play here.
I am looking at setting up Shooterville so people may just post their events and rooms which may help.
Hope this explanation will change how you feel about my sites support,
srs314 said:
Scott I hope I did not come across as disparraging your site, that was not my intent. I simply wanted to point out that Shooterville is not a good site (at present) for getting information about western events or rooms. Having said that, there is no good Internet site to get western Canadian pool information (although perhaps OTB covers the greater Vancouver area ??? ). Having lived in Toronto for 7 years and covering a territory that extended from the lakehead through Kinsgston and Ottawa, I appreciate the size difference between our regions as well.
I am however suprised that Al has not had his hall added to the list. I hear he was a big help working at Canadians a while back.
Dave
There are some people that would do a good job if the posting was available, like you said........work or move out so that someone else may step in and do a better volunteer job.....we all know that volunteer have perks in the buss. of pool or whatever other sport!!JD_Hogg said:
The balance is where the difference is, to be open and more agresssive in pursuit of sponsorships, money, time, prizes, etc.etc.
Why not cater to the league players and make their contribution voluntary with the promise of a national championship where the pros will not be permitted, while holding events geared to the pros as well?
In any case we do need help if our national data base is to increase in strengh, help in all sort of shapes........not just sitting in the chair and holding tittle's.
The only tour ran with dignity and no bull was the canadian 9 ball tour. Jim Wych and company ran every event without any loss of money or any other shenanigans that has happend on every other tour including the 10k, 20k and 30k tour. And if there is another K tour in the future the people that actually go deserve everything that has previously happend to happen to them again. The only way to improve pool is to get rid of the people that infiltrate supporting the game but in fact try to find any loop hole to screw the players over.
You think that the tour may be run again, some people say it may not......I wonder why not?taxi man said:
It was the best tour for Canada by far, so the question is?.......where are the other tour operators?
Any ideas Taxi man........I can see you driving the world for free and doing your best to survive at the same time while you pay for gas yourself......maybe not!!
When will people wake up
:boring2: :boring2: I know when it comes to pool some people don't care about how it is run because they just want to play,but on the other hand some people do.That finals of the 30k should of had a 100+ people or more but not even close.People lost alot of faith and showed an abundance of patience only to be let down time and time again.Even the 404 tour ran very well with john white at shooters without the problems that the 30k tour had.You had a great thing going but like most people in the world we trade integrity for money.When you deal in any business including a pool tour your main priority is the clients or investers and in this case the pool players you are obligated keep in contact with them when a problem arises.That did not happen.Players were left in the dark with the expectations that the 30k finals would happen hopefully within this decade.The funny thing is that 30 thousand was not even added to the finals,but as usual,were only the clients ,I mean pool players.Of course you deserve to be paid in every event but the players have the right to know how much or at what percentage are you taking from the tour.But the numbers were so screwed up that not even a GPS could follow that paper trail.Even watching a magician for hours may be entertaining at the end of the day it was still just a trick .And thats what the k tour has been a trick to make people beleive one thing and shaft them in the end.And I agree it is not easy to run events but thats no excuse to run them improperly.I think with events run like that is the reason why pool has the reputation it does and is probably better not to have events at all just to save face or multiple of faces.I believe the industry you should try next is religion,because making people believe in your garbage year after year is an art,and that's were the real money is .I guess you can't tell god your a profit but I guess you can tell him you made some!:boring2:
:boring2: :boring2: I know when it comes to pool some people don't care about how it is run because they just want to play,but on the other hand some people do.That finals of the 30k should of had a 100+ people or more but not even close.People lost alot of faith and showed an abundance of patience only to be let down time and time again.Even the 404 tour ran very well with john white at shooters without the problems that the 30k tour had.You had a great thing going but like most people in the world we trade integrity for money.When you deal in any business including a pool tour your main priority is the clients or investers and in this case the pool players you are obligated keep in contact with them when a problem arises.That did not happen.Players were left in the dark with the expectations that the 30k finals would happen hopefully within this decade.The funny thing is that 30 thousand was not even added to the finals,but as usual,were only the clients ,I mean pool players.Of course you deserve to be paid in every event but the players have the right to know how much or at what percentage are you taking from the tour.But the numbers were so screwed up that not even a GPS could follow that paper trail.Even watching a magician for hours may be entertaining at the end of the day it was still just a trick .And thats what the k tour has been a trick to make people beleive one thing and shaft them in the end.And I agree it is not easy to run events but thats no excuse to run them improperly.I think with events run like that is the reason why pool has the reputation it does and is probably better not to have events at all just to save face or multiple of faces.I believe the industry you should try next is religion,because making people believe in your garbage year after year is an art,and that's were the real money is .I guess you can't tell god your a profit but I guess you can tell him you made some!:boring2:
I wish you had stayed in school; your spelling may have gotten bettertaxi man said:
I know your kind, the one that just whines about mother's milk being to sour......at last your uninformed opinion is worth a whole lot.
If you only had some knowledge it would be understandable, but to try to educate an illiterate is beyond my grasp and I say sorry about that.
Have a nice day and leave God out of your words, He may get pissed at you
I guess this will confirm the Canadian 9 Ball Tour status........from their websitetaxi man said:
http://www.canadian9balltour.com/
It does not matter what you do or how fine of a job is done, the end is always similar thanks to the negative people that just complain and not help really....just a shame and sad
My 2 cents worth, what is your oppinion now?
ouch, that hurts