CopyCats - WOW Already ! Give your advice, please.

Johnnyt said:
I don't know why a men's tour can't be started using the WPBA system/format. I've been saying this for years. If you need to tweek it a little here and there fine...but it seems to work just fine. Johnnyt
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your right Johnny!,....or how bout the "Camel" tour....that worked GREAT for a while. We got to watch the events just about weekly...remember?:D
 
JB Cases said:
Maybe but not everyone wants to be a pool professional. In other sports people retain their amateur status for a myriad of reasons. I don't think that participating in pro-level events should make one a pro.

I agree that being a "pro" should be more lucrative. However if you are a top amateur or a mid-level pro sometimes you make the same money with far more choice and less pressure as an amateur.

Professional Status as a designation should accompany an income level that is commensurate with Professional status in all walks of life. My plumber is a professional and he clears $50,000 a year. I am sure that if this was the target then there would be plenty who relish the chance to go pro.

This was the premise of the IPT who stupidly wasted the chance to build something similar. Remember the mini-qualifiers to earn a spot in qualifiers? I think Mike Janis ran those for a week. Each mini was like $30 and paid out an entry into a qualifier, which in turn paid out one spot into the big tournament.

If the ATS can develop such a feeder system that produces a PRO tour with an average after tax/expense income of sufficient size to support a family decently then I am sure that there will eventually be plenty of people in the USA who try to go that route for their professional careers.

John
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John has been reading and comprehending my posts so thoroughly over the years that I think I should delegate the duties of the ATS spokesperson position to JB to help answer everyones questions about the ATS. His eloquent use of the English language, typing and grammar skills are 70% better than mine. John, want a job? What a temm that would be. With our combined skills, motivation and knowledge of the industry,wow!
:D I'm serious John, I think you tell it better than I do.

It sure is nice to have someone on my side for a change that knows what's going on.

Anyway, yes what John wrote is correct. But john, let's try to separate the ATS as a standalone product and try not to mention other organizations names. Even though the wpb- would be a fine organization to emulate, it is not exactly the same system.

John, also note that the ATS is a self sustaining system that is set up to roll with the changing times with or without outside industry funding.


Thanks,

Mj
 
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lol, okay guys I know you are a bunch of elementary kids, but in conclusion to our tour of the facility, im going to step out for awhile, but I asked that you under no circumstances push the big red shiny button that is labeled PUSH.
 
MikeJanis said:
As most of AZ forum members know, I have been working on a complete system for the overall growth of our sport which culminates in a US Pro Tour. I have worked and formulated this system for over four years.

It was just brought to my attention from a potential supporter of this system that someone from another agency asked their company to support almost exactly to a T the system I developed for our sport.

Of course, I have copyrights on all of the information regarding this system I have created and disseminated so the offending parties will be hearing from me to cease and desist but.......... What can I say. What a joke. The offenders are a well known billiard entity but have no experience in these matters regarding tournaments or membership services. In fact, they have an already tarnished reputation . I hope I am able to convince them to stop before their reputation is tarnished even further.

PLEASE DO NOT SPECULATE AS TO WHO THEY MAY BE. We as a community through AZ forums definitely do not want to get anything wrong with assumptions and tarnish an innocent person or company through speculation. Again, please do not post any names of companies you think it may be.

Does anyone have any advice to offer ?
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Mike,
Not sure what you expect someone to offer as advice short of saying get an attorney involved if you truly do have your ideas copyrighted. I would venture to say if it is a general/overall idea, then there is not much you can do.

The one thing you will find about "entities" is that the little guy doesn't scare them as you might think. If you have a basis for legal remedy, shoot for the moon.

9balllvr
 
RayDM said:
havent read all the posts, just going by the initial thread starter,
but,

Capitalism ! The best product will rise to the top.
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Not so. Under capitalism it's the product with the most reach that rises to the "top". Top being the most market share/participation.

Windows is not the "best" product in it's class yet it has the dominant share of the marketplace.

More crappy cases are sold each day than all the good ones I have made in ten years. It's a lot more work to establish oneself as the best product and find discerning customers who appreciate the value. It's far easier for larger entities to copy (mostly badly) the enterprising work of the people who do produce the best products.

It's a true shame that when NO ONE was doing what Mike is doing, what he has been working hard on for over four years, that now some other people have decided to take his ideas and offer the same setup. Awfully funny now that Mike has announced that he finally has things in place to truly get started.

Capitalism is simply the method by which the rich can squash the poor through the use of capital. And rich companies kill small companies all the time by hard competitive tactics, outright theft, by purchasing the company and burying the product and so on.
 
JB Cases said:
... It's a true shame that when NO ONE was doing what Mike is doing, what he has been working hard on for over four years, that now some other people have decided to take his ideas and offer the same setup. Awfully funny now that Mike has announced that he finally has things in place to truly get started.
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And to comment directly on Mikes posts -
a C&D would be unenforceable and he has no protection or legal standing under copyright law -
Ideas, procedures, methods, systems, processes, concepts, principles, discoveries, or devices,
as distinguished from a description, explanation, or illustration are not protected under copyright law.
(http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html#wnp)

I would think he may gain some protection once he formally publishes the "ATS" and its associated procedures,
rules and regulations. At that point it becomes an expression and he could have standing if copied.
 
Dartman said:
And to comment directly on Mikes posts -
a C&D would be unenforceable and he has no protection or legal standing under copyright law -
Ideas, procedures, methods, systems, processes, concepts, principles, discoveries, or devices,
as distinguished from a description, explanation, or illustration are not protected under copyright law.
(http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html#wnp)

I would think he may gain some protection once he formally publishes the "ATS" and its associated procedures,
rules and regulations. At that point it becomes an expression and he could have standing if copied.
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Fortunately, that's exactly what I did as early as January this year. However, my question on that would be: What is the definition "published" ?

I did publish the complete and exact system but only distributed it to a select few within the industry. Potentiel sponsors, billiard magazines and billiard web sites. The complete package included: Format, rules, procedures, and depending on who was approached either as a sponsor or a partner it included projections and/or P&L's.

Would that hold water in court?


Unfortunately, for me, it's a little unsettling because I have been doing business on just a handshake for the past 18 years. I have never sued anybody or even wanted to. I usually just don't do business with someone in the future if they break a deal that we had. It has always been just that simple for me. Mj
 
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MikeJanis said:
Fortunately, that's exactly what I did as early as January this year. However, my question on that would be: What is the definition "published" ?

I did publish the complete and exact system but only distributed it to a select few within the industry. Potentiel sponsors, billiard magazines and billiard web sites. The complete package included: Format, rules, procedures, and depending on who was approached either as a sponsor or a partner it included projections and/or P&L's.

Mj
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If its not too late or for future ideas of the same type, have the "viewing parties" sign a confidentiality agreement. You could have them agree not to divulge your ideas to third parties and not act on them within a certain time period. This would allow you the time needed to develop your ideas fully and become first in the market.
 
Hey Guys and Gals, 1st, I need to apologize for even starting this thread. While the info contained is truthful about the copycat, it seems to have taken an ill turn.

I knowingly put this out here on AZ for the world to see because I knew the offender was an avid reader of AZ.

The BAD NEWS is that a supporter or a few of me/ATS/Viking Tour etc.... got a little carried away and sent a nasty email to the incorrect party('s).

Please, I never thought it would go that far. I asked in the beginning for no speculation to protect the innocent.

I take full responsibility for the actions taken by the said supporters and I appreciate all of your support in every way possible but this was way too much!

Please trust that I will pursue legal action if the copycat offender persists.

Respectfully,

Mj
 
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MikeJanis said:
Fortunately, that's exactly what I did as early as January this year. However, my question on that would be: What is the definition "published" ?

I did publish the complete and exact system but only distributed it to a select few within the industry. Potentiel sponsors, billiard magazines and billiard web sites. The complete package included: Format, rules, procedures, and depending on who was approached either as a sponsor or a partner it included projections and/or P&L's.
Would that hold water in court?
Mj
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Published as in a web page made available in the public domain. Or published in a magazine, book, pamphlet or even a notepad.
In reality once you commit your idea to a visual form or paper you then own the copyright to it.

If you find that someone "copied" (in whole or in part) the documentation you already distributed then you may have a case for
copyright infringement. The burden of proof however, that your work was copied is on you if you choose to file legal action.
Be prepared for all sort of off the wall defenses and considerable expense with an attorney (this is first hand
as I'm currently involved in litigation along a similar situation).

.
 
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MikeJanis said:
...I asked in the beginning for no speculation to protect the innocent.Mj
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PLEASE DO NOT SPECULATE AS TO WHO THEY MAY BE. We as a community through AZ forums definitely do not want to get anything wrong with assumptions and tarnish an innocent person or company through speculation. Again, please do not post any names of companies you think it may be.

Yes you did! Oh the powers of Pandoras Box!
 
you should have named them in the first place, might have avoided confusion

or not brought it up at all
 
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