Critics wanted

[9balldiva]

I am confused. You state that gaps create paths and balls are easier to pocket. If so, wouldn't the breaker want a loose rack?

I am under the impression that a loose rack don't scatter the balls very well, therfore decreasing the chances of making a ball on the break and leaves more clusters. That is why I try my best to make sure all balls are touching. On many tables, this is difficult if not impossible.

Hank <~~doesn't think Shawn will attest to your answer

In some ways...for instance, when the racker racks his own balls he can leave gaps in the rear of the rack, creating a path for the corner ball, and even the 9 ball. If the racker is racking for an opponent, and he leaves the 1 ball or the two behind it with a gap, it will cause the 1 ball the break into the rack instead of coming towards the headstring. Depending on the circumstances (rack your own or not) will depend on why the rack is bad!

 

[9balldiva]

After dating a pro, and being in the world of pros for a while, I found that there is a misconception amongst the lower level players. I did it to...

I put these pros on a pedastool, as people do to actors and actresses, singers, etc. After spending day after day hanging out with Rodney, Tony, Frankie, and some others, I realized that they are the same as me, but get paid to play. It is no different than me at my job. I wouldn't let somebody at my office put my position in jeopardy, just like Shawn (and all the others) don't want theirs in jeopardy.

It is perfectly fair for any player (pro, ametuer, etc...) to be concerned with what his rack looks like. Would it irritate me, YES. Things like that though, you have to treat it like you are in their shoes. Like he said, the Viking tour was how he was going to feed his family. That will impact how much attention you are paying. In turn, you just wanted to have fun and learn some things...maybe your first learning experience: that there is more pressure to being a pro, than just playing. Say you weren't playing for fun...you could have been just as worried.

The pros that have sponsors don't just get these sponsors and keep them forever. If you start to fall off, chances are good your sponsor(s) might fall off you. I guess all I am trying to say is that I understand the different concerns you have to have as a pro. I always thought it would be sooo great to get to shoot pool ALL the time, AND get paid for it...but it isn't as great as I thought. The money isn't that great, the pressure is hard if you NEED the money, and at the same time you have to keep this image no matter what for the fans!

Just my 2 cents...hope it helps!!

 

[Hustlin' Hank]

After dating a pro, and being in the world of pros for a while, I found that there is a misconception amongst the lower level players. I did it to...

I put these pros on a pedastool, as people do to actors and actresses, singers, etc. After spending day after day hanging out with Rodney, Tony, Frankie, and some others, I realized that they are the same as me, but get paid to play. It is no different than me at my job. I wouldn't let somebody at my office put my position in jeopardy, just like Shawn (and all the others) don't want theirs in jeopardy.

It is perfectly fair for any player (pro, ametuer, etc...) to be concerned with what his rack looks like. Would it irritate me, YES. Things like that though, you have to treat it like you are in their shoes. Like he said, the Viking tour was how he was going to feed his family. That will impact how much attention you are paying. In turn, you just wanted to have fun and learn some things...maybe your first learning experience: that there is more pressure to being a pro, than just playing. Say you weren't playing for fun...you could have been just as worried.

The pros that have sponsors don't just get these sponsors and keep them forever. If you start to fall off, chances are good your sponsor(s) might fall off you. I guess all I am trying to say is that I understand the different concerns you have to have as a pro. I always thought it would be sooo great to get to shoot pool ALL the time, AND get paid for it...but it isn't as great as I thought. The money isn't that great, the pressure is hard if you NEED the money, and at the same time you have to keep this image no matter what for the fans!

Just my 2 cents...hope it helps!!

First off, I have been shooting pool before you were born. I have seen the so called "pros" come and go. I have seen people claim they are "rack experts". But, put them to the test and they fail. Ask any "rack expert" to rack so that the 9 ball goes everytime or at least half the time. It won't happen unless there are gaps over 2" wide, and we know that isn't a good rack.

The best a person can hope for is the one ball in the side, even with the Sardo, it don't happen all the time. 9 on the snap is nothing but power and luck. Any honest pool player (is there one?) will tell you that.

Now, with a loose rack, the balls will not scatter as much, therefore decreasing your chances of making the 9 and increasing the possibility clusters. Other than that, the rest is bullshit.

Hank <~~~gives good rack

 

[9balldiva]

First off, I have been shooting pool before you were born. I have seen the so called "pros" come and go. I have seen people claim they are "rack experts". But, put them to the test and they fail. Ask any "rack expert" to rack so that the 9 ball goes everytime or at least half the time. It won't happen unless there are gaps over 2" wide, and we know that isn't a good rack.

The best a person can hope for is the one ball in the side, even with the Sardo, it don't happen all the time. 9 on the snap is nothing but power and luck. Any honest pool player (is there one?) will tell you that.

Now, with a loose rack, the balls will not scatter as much, therefore decreasing your chances of making the 9 and increasing the possibility clusters. Other than that, the rest is bullshit.

Hank <~~~gives good rack

Not arguing anything...just saying what i have experienced, and learned.

 

[9balldiva]

Shawn,

Your imput would be greatly appreciated here...

 

[etimmons]

Hank, you are under the impression that making the nine is the goal, sorry that is not correct. The goal is usually making the corner ball or not making it. The rack can be set to do this very easily by a top player. They can also set the rack so it will not move when hit. Watch Cory Deuel on TV look at the rack before he breaks, he is looking how to hit the rack by how it is racked, he has spent many hours breaking many types of racks and knows how to hit them to make balls. Shawn also knows racks, or so Dee Akins has told me. Shawn???

 

[Timberly]

Hank, you are under the impression that making the nine is the goal, sorry that is not correct. The goal is usually making the corner ball or not making it. The rack can be set to do this very easily by a top player. They can also set the rack so it will not move when hit. Watch Cory Deuel on TV look at the rack before he breaks, he is looking how to hit the rack by how it is racked, he has spent many hours breaking many types of racks and knows how to hit them to make balls. Shawn also knows racks, or so Dee Akins has told me. Shawn???

I've heard Shawn and a few others discussing racks before. I don't know what Shawn does & doesn't know but I do know that he's mentioned before that he knows what to look for when checking the rack. Some people know how to rack the balls where they're making the wing ball everytime. I've seen matches (rack your own) where one person figured it out & the other person didn't. Earl was in one of those matches right before the open... Earl didn't figure it out... we ALL heard about it too. Others focus on making the one in the side with a good shot on the two once the balls have been broken. I was watching someone play at the open (I can't for the life of me remember who the player was). The guy was consistently making the one in the side and having an open shot at the two in the corner. It was rather freaky! I've seen some people try to pull the nine towards one of the corner pockets. I think most of the guys that play at Shawn's level know a few things about racks... etimmons, I've heard and seen quite a few people check the rack to see WHERE to break from to get the result that they want. I'm not that far advanced. I just want the rack tight so that I can knock the hell out if it.

 

[Hustlin' Hank]

Hank, you are under the impression that making the nine is the goal, sorry that is not correct. The goal is usually making the corner ball or not making it. The rack can be set to do this very easily by a top player. They can also set the rack so it will not move when hit. Watch Cory Deuel on TV look at the rack before he breaks, he is looking how to hit the rack by how it is racked, he has spent many hours breaking many types of racks and knows how to hit them to make balls. Shawn also knows racks, or so Dee Akins has told me. Shawn???

After re-reading my response, I can see where you get your impression. To clear things up, I didn't mean the goal was to make the nine. The goal is to give a tight rack. With a tight rack, the balls scatter better.

Now, with a loose rack, one can see what "might" happen.

My point is: If all the balls are touching, the one ball on the spot, how could anybody call it a bad rack?

Besides, every table breaks differently, the cloth makes a difference, the rails make a difference, the cleanliness of the balls make a difference. The spot from which one breaks makes a difference.

Finally, like I said earlier, put a "rack mechanic" to the test. Have him rack where all the balls are touching and have him call the ball that will be pocketed. Or, you rack and have him tell you what is going to be pocketed. Don't just do this once, he may get lucky. See how many times he is right out of 10 tries.

Hank <~~~can break ANY rack and make a ball 50% of the time, more with a tight rack

 

[stedyfred]

Just a suggestion Hank! If you have a chance take a look at Sands Regency Open 17 final match tape between Jimmy Fusco and Kim Davenport from Acccustats. In this match Davenport makes the wing ball repeatedly when breaking. Check it out.Fred

 

[Hustlin' Hank]

Just a suggestion Hank! If you have a chance take a look at Sands Regency Open 17 final match tape between Jimmy Fusco and Kim Davenport from Acccustats. In this match Davenport makes the wing ball repeatedly when breaking. Check it out.Fred

I will watch if I get the chance. Thanks. Tell me this, was they using the Sardo?

I have never played where the table, balls and cloth were new and a Sardo was used. I have never seen a Sardo other than on TV, but I have been told that the Sardo needs to be "set-up". "Set-up" means making little "pin holes" in the cloth so that the rack sits in the same position. If this is true, I can see how a person can consistently make a certain wing ball or the One ball. Maybe someone on here can inform me.

My debate about racking is on a standard poolroom table with worn cloth, spot has been "hammered" in and a normal rack (triangle). On tables such as these, it is nearly impossible to get a consistant rack, but, it should be tight for sure.

Another question to all: If a Pro is playing a road player and they are gambling (not a tournament), do you think one of them would complain about the rack to the extent that Earl does?

Hank

 

[etimmons]

After re-reading my response, I can see where you get your impression. To clear things up, I didn't mean the goal was to make the nine. The goal is to give a tight rack. With a tight rack, the balls scatter better.

Now, with a loose rack, one can see what "might" happen.

My point is: If all the balls are touching, the one ball on the spot, how could anybody call it a bad rack?

Besides, every table breaks differently, the cloth makes a difference, the rails make a difference, the cleanliness of the balls make a difference. The spot from which one breaks makes a difference.

Finally, like I said earlier, put a "rack mechanic" to the test. Have him rack where all the balls are touching and have him call the ball that will be pocketed. Or, you rack and have him tell you what is going to be pocketed. Don't just do this once, he may get lucky. See how many times he is right out of 10 tries.

Hank <~~~can break ANY rack and make a ball 50% of the time, more with a tight rack

Hank, I travel with some very good pros that will make the wing ball if you let them rack and all the balls will be touching, you get to look at the rack too, I know this from experience of having it done to me then being taught what to look for. I understand you are talking from your experience but in this case you are really mistaken. I am not going to chirp or argue with you but plenty of people will show you if there is a bet involved.

 

[john schmidt]

hows it going

i noticed that you asked shawn if he wanted to play chris and i think its great that your trying to stir up action.i also think it would be a good match as their both great players as a matter of fact chris said he would play me at the derby this year if jason kirkwood could break for him. i said yes but he said he wanted play at richie richesons house .now i have not played any big money games in a while but i would give chris action as i think hes a gentleman win or lose i would probably play at breakers in mobile because ricky bird stakes sometimes and if chris beats he could win alot. post message if you guys are interested in playing,take it easy john schmidt

 

[bud green]

I haven't visited this thread in a long time but a few points:

1. Nobodies who come on AZ talking smack to pros are the worst kind of jerk-offs around here. Especially when they try and sick some other pro (their "buddy") on a guy. Most especially when they make a betting offer and then disappear. Tgavin did the same thing with Shawn, trying to belittle his game or sick Mika on him. Kwong made an offer, TWO guys offered to back Shawn, and then he ran away after trying to change the game ("...if Kid D can break for him." ). Most of the pros who have come to AZbilliards ended up leaving or stopped posting, in part because they end up taking flack from people they could give the orange crush to.

2. Speaking of Kid D, rack mechanics, and the calling of balls on the break. Kid D was playing Parica I think at the DCC. Kid would inspect the rack, and predicted with success most of the time, what ball would go in. Nobody can predict what will happen every time, but some of these guys can definately make a higher % prediction than the average hack. Joe Tucker has a dvd out (and book) about racking and I doubt he put all there is to know about racking in there. Corey Deuel has pretty much mastered the Sardo rack-they actually changed the rules at an event to prevent his soft break I heard. Asking a guy to make the nine ball 50% of the time is a bit much; I think it goes 1 out of 35 breaks on average. I bet some of these guys could increase the odds to 1 in 10, at the very least.

3. Shawn has proven to be a top player and a true pro in the way he acts. I really doubt he made a guy re-rack just to intimidate the guy. For run-out players, the break is half the game in nine ball and too important to just accept a bad rack.

 

[Shawn Putnam]

I haven't visited this thread in a long time but a few points:

1. Nobodies who come on AZ talking smack to pros are the worst kind of jerk-offs around here. Especially when they try and sick some other pro (their "buddy") on a guy. Most especially when they make a betting offer and then disappear. Tgavin did the same thing with Shawn, trying to belittle his game or sick Mika on him. Kwong made an offer, TWO guys offered to back Shawn, and then he ran away after trying to change the game ("...if Kid D can break for him." ). Most of the pros who have come to AZbilliards ended up leaving or stopped posting, in part because they end up taking flack from people they could give the orange crush to.

2. Speaking of Kid D, rack mechanics, and the calling of balls on the break. Kid D was playing Parica I think at the DCC. Kid would inspect the rack, and predicted with success most of the time, what ball would go in. Nobody can predict what will happen every time, but some of these guys can definately make a higher % prediction than the average hack. Joe Tucker has a dvd out (and book) about racking and I doubt he put all there is to know about racking in there. Corey Deuel has pretty much mastered the Sardo rack-they actually changed the rules at an event to prevent his soft break I heard. Asking a guy to make the nine ball 50% of the time is a bit much; I think it goes 1 out of 35 breaks on average. I bet some of these guys could increase the odds to 1 in 10, at the very least.

3. Shawn has proven to be a top player and a true pro in the way he acts. I really doubt he made a guy re-rack just to intimidate the guy. For run-out players, the break is half the game in nine ball and too important to just accept a bad rack.

Thanks for saying what was on my mind.
Now I don't have to reply to everybody.

 

[billiardbum]

Love Sponge...Jim from Indy...Hows the Cnc working? Need to come and get some training soon. Let me know, and we can go play some in the evenings. Oh yeah, snap both of those tournaments again in PA. See ya there.

 

[jcain]

hey, shawn. I want to comment on your question. When I watch you play and other top pros. I notice that your a perfectionist, consistant shot making, powerful mentally and physically at the game. So roughly 20 times that I've seen you play you've only played 1 or 2 bad games. And if you played perfect all the time the game or any other sport would get boring. If I were you. I would play around with the mental part. Experiment. Other then that I woudn't change a thing. Remember your doing what most people dream about. And your living it.
Also interact with fans more maybe. don't worry. You represent the sport and yourself just fine.

jcain