cue building apprenticeship, is this the way to go?

Cuemaster98

Cuemaster98

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Hi Guys,

I've been noticing lately (actually always been in my mind) that some of the cue builders that started building cue as apprentice seem to do very well and some in very short period of time. I know James White build amazing cues and he apprenticed under Paul Mottey and now the value of his work are now up there with Paul Mottey.

Just wondering if this a better route to market your brand and cut your learning curve? It seem that this has worked well for a lot of builders and just wanted to know how to approach this. I was told that most builder would not do apprenticeship as they're breeding their own competition but I really havn't seem this happen...if anything it should help elevated the cue builder own brand.

I'm just thinking the chance to see how a great builder put his cue together, how to properly finish a cue hand on, what machines he used for each operation would be invaluable to a newbee like me.

I just thought this would be an interesting topic for discussion as this is what I would consider when the opportunity become available. How many cue builders start this way? I've been hacking on my own...trial and error...and I'm thinking there a better way. I would think apprenticeship is a cheaper option as you don't have to buy all the equipment on your own.

Regards,
Duc.
 
Last edited:
Cuemaster98 said:
Hi Guys,

I've been noticing lately (actually always been in my mind) that some of the cue builders that started building cue as apprentice seem to do very well and some in very short period of time. I know James White build amazing cues and he apprenticed under Paul Mottey and now the value of his work are now up there with Paul Mottey.

Just wondering if this a better route to market your brand and cut your learning curve? It seem that this has worked well for a lot of builders and just wanted to know how to approach this. I was told that most builder would not do apprenticeship as they're breeding their own competition but I really havn't seem this happen...if anything it should help elevated the cue builder own brand.

I'm just thinking the chance to see how a great builder put his cue together, how to properly finish a cue hand on, what machines he used for each operation would be invaluable to a newbee like me.

I just thought this would be an interesting topic for discussion as this is what I would consider when the opportunity become available. How many cue builders start this way? I've been hacking on my own...trial and error...and I'm thinking there a better way.

Regards,
Duc.
Click to expand...

It would certainly let people know you have learned in the right way and are not learning by trial and error, maybe even on their cue. In the end though the cue makers work will speak for it's self. If you are good your cues will sell. Cue makers today seem to be a dime a dozen, just look at this forum, but the good ones will always be in demand.
 
Cuemakers with no traditional apprenticeship:
GINACUE
GUS SZAMBOTI
GEORGE BALABUSHKA
RICHARD BLACK
DAN JANES AND BILL STROUD
DENNIS SEARING
TONY SCIANELLA....

No, you don't need apprenticeship. Just work hard. Be a perfectionist in every product that you turn out to the general public.

I've actually given some thought to learning cuemaking and I developed a gameplan of my own to getting there.

1. Become a first rate cue repairman. Learn the basics of the cue. Master tip replacement, ferrule replacement, re-wrapping a cue, fixing joints, re-finishing a cue, replacing buttcaps....essentially become a master repairman. My goal would be to work with another repairman and maybe learn from them initially....even paying if necessary. Tattoo artists have to pay for their apprenticeship. Why should it be any different in cuemaking?

2. During this time frame you will obviously become capable of building a sneaky pete - but also begin the process of learning how to machine wood. Turning a rectangular block into a forearm, or handle, or butt. What kind of seasoning does the wood require? Learning how to select shaftwood and turn down a shaft. What are the different time requirements for this? How many turns per day/week/etc? This is a lot to learn? How to build a structurally sound plain-jane cue from scratch (well, maybe you'll buy the joint pin, weight bolt). When the shafts are fully turned how do you treat them, how long do you hang them? We're not even talking about beauty here...just a phase of the process where you learn about machining wood, and machining the components to build a structurally sound cue that isn't going to warp.

3. So at this point - you're a master cue repairman and a cue-builder of good, solid, playing cues. This in itself is an accomplishment. You know how to build a structurally sound plain jane players cue from the ground up. Now you can invest in getting pretty. Learning the art of inlay, building pointed forearms, using a pantograph or CNC, etc. From here, your ceiling is only limited by your natural design talent, attention to detail, and work ethic. This would be the point, where you would know if a design you wanted to build would make a structurally sound "playing" cue...or if you were literally just building a piece of art that looked like a cue.

So, again...I'm not machinist or cuemaker. I've been to several shops over the years and I've been interested in cuemaking when I retire from the Air Force and this is the kind of plan I've developed for myself after a lot of thought.
 
If you can be in a position to be an aprentice to a well known and respected cuemaker, go for it.
Completeing an aprenticship has it's cost's and rewards.
The cost is often low wages ,the rewards are skills attained in a specific field without alot of the mistakes of someone having to reinvent the wheel.
No matter what field the appenticship it, although you will learn skills, the difficult part to pick up is the artisty,the imagination to come up with something new in a crowded field.
Like musicians, it is difficult to come up with a new sound without using a part of someone elses chords or part of a rift from say up to 40 years ago.
If you have the talent and do the right training, you are well set on your way.
There is always a demand for high quality product, but that field is always small. So to compete you have to be amongst the best.
So learning from the best is always a good place to start.
If a lady was starting out in pool , lessons or having Karen Corr as someone to help you get started in pool , is going to be way better than some guy X at any local bar.
In short , if you can aprentice to someone in the field of what you want to do, then take the opertunity.But you know, Bill Gates did not initially have a degree in computers.
Neil
 
Good point. Bill Gates never had a computer degree but he did have an advanced start. As a kid, he went to a wonderful school that had its own computer lab. Back then...you had to pay by the hour just to learn programming but his school allowed him to work as long as he liked. He has a passion for it, and working with friends programmed computers like others learn how to play pool. It was a passion. If you have a passion to build cues, and aren't concerned about the monetary rewards...just the feeling you get from building a great cue - well, that alone could be defined as success, regardless of whether you are remembered as a Szamboti-like (in status) cue creator.
 
Matt_24 said:
Cuemakers with no traditional apprenticeship:
GINACUE
GUS SZAMBOTI
GEORGE BALABUSHKA
RICHARD BLACK
DAN JANES AND BILL STROUD
DENNIS SEARING
TONY SCIANELLA....

No, you don't need apprenticeship. Just work hard. Be a perfectionist in every product that you turn out to the general public.

I've actually given some thought to learning cuemaking and I developed a gameplan of my own to getting there.

1. Become a first rate cue repairman. Learn the basics of the cue. Master tip replacement, ferrule replacement, re-wrapping a cue, fixing joints, re-finishing a cue, replacing buttcaps....essentially become a master repairman. My goal would be to work with another repairman and maybe learn from them initially....even paying if necessary. Tattoo artists have to pay for their apprenticeship. Why should it be any different in cuemaking?

2. During this time frame you will obviously become capable of building a sneaky pete - but also begin the process of learning how to machine wood. Turning a rectangular block into a forearm, or handle, or butt. What kind of seasoning does the wood require? Learning how to select shaftwood and turn down a shaft. What are the different time requirements for this? How many turns per day/week/etc? This is a lot to learn? How to build a structurally sound plain-jane cue from scratch (well, maybe you'll buy the joint pin, weight bolt). When the shafts are fully turned how do you treat them, how long do you hang them? We're not even talking about beauty here...just a phase of the process where you learn about machining wood, and machining the components to build a structurally sound cue that isn't going to warp.

3. So at this point - you're a master cue repairman and a cue-builder of good, solid, playing cues. This in itself is an accomplishment. You know how to build a structurally sound plain jane players cue from the ground up. Now you can invest in getting pretty. Learning the art of inlay, building pointed forearms, using a pantograph or CNC, etc. From here, your ceiling is only limited by your natural design talent, attention to detail, and work ethic. This would be the point, where you would know if a design you wanted to build would make a structurally sound "playing" cue...or if you were literally just building a piece of art that looked like a cue.

So, again...I'm not machinist or cuemaker. I've been to several shops over the years and I've been interested in cuemaking when I retire from the Air Force and this is the kind of plan I've developed for myself after a lot of thought.
Click to expand...

LOL...I think I'm still in step 1...it's good plan. When I'm retired from IT...maybe this is what I will do as well but for now...trial and errors for me.

Thanks,
Duc.
 
Hi,
Being new (2yrs.) building cue have to say I whish there had been some1 close to me I could go watch and learn from hands on.It would have saved me alot of firewood , but I have had alot of cuemakers helping me on the phone and email. Not the best way to learn but all of them say when it comes down to it the best way to learn is by messing up and fixing it. It makes you use your head and learn to watch what your doing closer.I've been told with each step you make you better ,as long as you learn the first time around.I try to see how I can do things with what I have to work with .I also ask how it is done with ( the right tool) and it helps me there. In my shot time building the biggest thing i've learned is you wont stop learning as long as you think about what your doing .If you working with a cuemaker and learning from them always ask (how and why) and if your learning on your on the ask yourself the same thing.More than likely the reason will help you later on something .
This is only the way im thinking but I have alot to learn and always open to all input GOOD are BAD. So everything I have typed here my are mynot be right. Jeff Eason
 
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