Custom Cue Build Off For Charity

Hi everyone. Why not have everyone build the same cue, and not real fancy. That will allow more cue makers to become involved, you wouldn't have to be rich, and loaded with machines, just a good craftsman to be invloved in the charity, and have a chance to win this build off. That would also avoid someone putting a 150 hours into a cue without benifitting the charity equally. Deciding what that design may be tough to agree on. An idea might be to at the same time choose a cue maker from the past, and honor by making a similar designed cue. The cue should have each makers initials in the butt cap to avoid exact copy.
Have every one make the exact same cue including joint, joint rings, forearm, veneer colors, blockwork, butt cap, wrap, and with same simple inlays. Simple inlays will keep the guys without cnc machines in the contest.
Then cover each makers ID, and put a number on each cue, display all the cues at a big show like the Hopkin's show. I don't think anyone would argue that the Hopkins show is the biggest show for the custom cue maker, with the most custom cue buyers in attendence. Make a big sign for the booth that has the name of every cue maker that has a cue entered, and participated in the charity. let anyone and everyone who wants to vote "not cue makers" look over every cue and pick first, second, and third place. They would make there choices based on quality of workmanship, fit, finish, etc. Then write their choices on a form and put in a box. The last day of the show, open the box count the votes, and the numbered cues that get the most votes wins. There are several ways you can profit for the charity. At the same time people vote, they could also put a bid on a cue number if they choose, and the winning bidder for each cue gets that cue. Then uncover ID's and announce who won, and at the same time the winning bidder will see who's cue they bought. All the money goes to charity, or you could charge a nice entry fee to each cue maker who wants a shot at the build off title. Another or additional way, charge a small donation fee to participate in the vote that goes to the charity too. I would have to believe all the publications would love to print the results, there for, great press to the winners. I can't speak for them, but I think that there's a chance Allen, and Dawn may give a space for it, just to be part of the charity and good press for them too. I'm sure every aspect of this idea could be tweaked in a lot of ways. The main thing is to make everything fair for every cue maker. You also would want to take steps to avoid vote cheating, but if your going to do a build off were you choose a winner, then lets try one were we compare the same apples to apples. Never been done in the past.
Only my idea of a build off, maybe a wrench in the soup, but just an idea.
If it's only build a cue for charity, I'll do that too.
Dennis Searing
PS;My first post on AZ Hope I don't regret it.. :)
 
searingcue said:
Hi everyone. Why not have everyone build the same cue, and not real fancy. That will allow more cue makers to become involved, you wouldn't have to be rich, and loaded with machines, just a good craftsman to be invloved in the charity, and have a chance to win this build off. That would also avoid someone putting a 150 hours into a cue without benifitting the charity equally. Deciding what that design may be tough to agree on. An idea might be to at the same time choose a cue maker from the past, and honor by making a similar designed cue. The cue should have each makers initials in the butt cap to avoid exact copy.
Have every one make the exact same cue including joint, joint rings, forearm, veneer colors, blockwork, butt cap, wrap, and with same simple inlays. Simple inlays will keep the guys without cnc machines in the contest.
Then cover each makers ID, and put a number on each cue, display all the cues at a big show like the Hopkin's show. I don't think anyone would argue that the Hopkins show is the biggest show for the custom cue maker, with the most custom cue buyers in attendence. Make a big sign for the booth that has the name of every cue maker that has a cue entered, and participated in the charity. let anyone and everyone who wants to vote "not cue makers" look over every cue and pick first, second, and third place. They would make there choices based on quality of workmanship, fit, finish, etc. Then write their choices on a form and put in a box. The last day of the show, open the box count the votes, and the numbered cues that get the most votes wins. There are several ways you can profit for the charity. At the same time people vote, they could also put a bid on a cue number if they choose, and the winning bidder for each cue gets that cue. Then uncover ID's and announce who won, and at the same time the winning bidder will see who's cue they bought. All the money goes to charity, or you could charge a nice entry fee to each cue maker who wants a shot at the build off title. Another or additional way, charge a small donation fee to participate in the vote that goes to the charity too. I would have to believe all the publications would love to print the results, there for, great press to the winners. I can't speak for them, but I think that there's a chance Allen, and Dawn may give a space for it, just to be part of the charity and good press for them too. I'm sure every aspect of this idea could be tweaked in a lot of ways. The main thing is to make everything fair for every cue maker. You also would want to take steps to avoid vote cheating, but if your going to do a build off were you choose a winner, then lets try one were we compare the same apples to apples. Never been done in the past.
Only my idea of a build off, maybe a wrench in the soup, but just an idea.
If it's only build a cue for charity, I'll do that too.
Dennis Searing
PS;My first post on AZ Hope I don't regret it.. :)



Wouldn't using the same joint, same tapers, same materials take away from the differences between the cuemakers and leave it as who can make the best copy? Maybe just come up with a value that is honest and have each maker build a cue in that price range? I know price ranges vary greatly among cue makers, but make it 1000-1500 and I would think you could get a cue from just about any builder for that range or very close to it.

I'm not a cuemaker, just a interested potential buyer.
 
I'm not saying don't do your own tapers. Let the cue maker build the specs he believes in, just make everything else the same. The reason I'm saying make the same cue is because if you are doing a build off, and they are different, the chance of a winner being chosen for mostly beauty is high. Every contest I've ever heard of to date, beauty has been the major reason and basis to choose the winner. I'm thinking just try once make the priority craftsmanship, and best of all help a charity. Besides, I would think a customers number one priority would be the craftsmanship in there cue.
Thank you for your interest.
Dennis
 
searingcue said:
Hi everyone. Why not have everyone build the same cue, and not real fancy. That will allow more cue makers to become involved, you wouldn't have to be rich, and loaded with machines, just a good craftsman to be invloved in the charity, and have a chance to win this build off. That would also avoid someone putting a 150 hours into a cue without benifitting the charity equally. Deciding what that design may be tough to agree on. An idea might be to at the same time choose a cue maker from the past, and honor by making a similar designed cue. The cue should have each makers initials in the butt cap to avoid exact copy.
Have every one make the exact same cue including joint, joint rings, forearm, veneer colors, blockwork, butt cap, wrap, and with same simple inlays. Simple inlays will keep the guys without cnc machines in the contest.
Then cover each makers ID, and put a number on each cue, display all the cues at a big show like the Hopkin's show. I don't think anyone would argue that the Hopkins show is the biggest show for the custom cue maker, with the most custom cue buyers in attendence. Make a big sign for the booth that has the name of every cue maker that has a cue entered, and participated in the charity. let anyone and everyone who wants to vote "not cue makers" look over every cue and pick first, second, and third place. They would make there choices based on quality of workmanship, fit, finish, etc. Then write their choices on a form and put in a box. The last day of the show, open the box count the votes, and the numbered cues that get the most votes wins. There are several ways you can profit for the charity. At the same time people vote, they could also put a bid on a cue number if they choose, and the winning bidder for each cue gets that cue. Then uncover ID's and announce who won, and at the same time the winning bidder will see who's cue they bought. All the money goes to charity, or you could charge a nice entry fee to each cue maker who wants a shot at the build off title. Another or additional way, charge a small donation fee to participate in the vote that goes to the charity too. I would have to believe all the publications would love to print the results, there for, great press to the winners. I can't speak for them, but I think that there's a chance Allen, and Dawn may give a space for it, just to be part of the charity and good press for them too. I'm sure every aspect of this idea could be tweaked in a lot of ways. The main thing is to make everything fair for every cue maker. You also would want to take steps to avoid vote cheating, but if your going to do a build off were you choose a winner, then lets try one were we compare the same apples to apples. Never been done in the past.
Only my idea of a build off, maybe a wrench in the soup, but just an idea.
If it's only build a cue for charity, I'll do that too.
Dennis Searing
PS;My first post on AZ Hope I don't regret it.. :)


Hello Dennis,
Welcome to the board, Nice to meet you. I live up in Saint Augustine. I've seen the cue you built for David G, And May I say you sure do some nice work. He always raves about how skilled you are whenever the cuebuilding topic comes up, and I can see why.

I don't get to devote as much time to cuebuilding as I would like yet, but I think the build-off Is a great idea, for a wonderfull cause, and would love to see It become yearly event of some type. I aggree with you that the more builders involved the better accross the board for everyone, and if It's unlimited as to what level cue to build, then that would weed alot of people out from being involved. Your idea is a good one. I also like the idea of different level/classes of cues, That way everyone summits what they would like or are able to. I guess the problem with that would be that the top level/class would still over shadow the other classes/level winners though. I also like the promotion Ideas you had, What if it was promoted in a way that lets the cues be displayed more then one event, finishing up with the biggest promoter.

Greg
 
Michael Webb said:
I do one every year for the Bradley childrens hospital in Conn. Every cue except one has found it's way to ebay, I feel great for doing it but totally discouraged when I see it end up there. I am definately considering just given cash from now on.
That is exactly my point. I work all the hours I want to and every hour I put in could have been making real $$. Mike you donated a cue to an event in Lousiana and it raffled off for only about 1/5th the cash value. Made you real happy didn't it??? Many of you are also in that position. Why work even 20 hours to see your cue bring in 1/4 of the real cash value on ebay. I would rather give the 5 hours worth of cash. If it is a build off, to me that means a competion. I guess I have watched too many Biker Build Off programs to see it otherwise. Drop the Build Off title and try to just get a cue donated, or keep the title, make a donated entry fee and let's get on with a real competition.
Anyone considered Galilean Childrens Home in Kentucky? Charlie Daniels does a benefit for them every year. They bring children with disabilies from all over the world there and get them help from Childrens Hospitals and help them all the way through being healthy enough to go home. They also help some with mental disabilities also.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com
 
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I like the idea

I like the idea of a build-off. I wouldn't want the entries to be catagorized by value, but by style. Maybe have an entry for the simple merry widow styles, and progress up to the more intricate cues. Hide the makers names and let the voters decide. I think hiding the names of the builders is important as some people will be biased in their decisions if they are able to see names.
 
Madison Bob

cueman said:
That is exactly my point. I work all the hours I want to and every hour I put in could have been making real $$. Mike you donated a cue to an event in Lousiana and it raffled off for only about 1/5th the cash value. Made you real happy didn't it??? Many of you are also in that position. Why work even 20 hours to see your cue bring in 1/4 of the real cash value on ebay. I would rather give the 5 hours worth of cash. If it is a build off, to me that means a competion. I guess I have watched too many Biker Build Off programs to see it otherwise. Drop the Build Off title and try to just get a cue donated, or keep the title, make a donated entry fee and let's get on with a real competition.
Anyone considered Galilean Childrens Home in Kentucky? Charlie Daniels does a benefit for them every year. They bring children with disabilies from all over the world there and get them help from Childrens Hospitals and help them all the way through being healthy enough to go home. They also help some with mental disabilities also.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com

CHRIS THERE IS SO MANY WAYS THIS CAN BE DONE AND I,LL SAY THIS I DON,T CARE MYSELF HOW IT,S DONE I,LL GIVE UP WHAT EVER I CAN TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN FOR THE CHILDREN.i,ll say this you have the ICA send out a news letters asking them to give there ideals in writing are emails to you on how they think we can make this happen and everyone be apart of it and made happy and i,ll contact the ACA and see if they will do the same then we will post the ideals on the forum and vote once we get the results then i will contact the mags and see if they will give us a 1/4 page telling what were wanting to do and also ask for other builders that are not involved in either the ICA are ACA to become involved. look theres alot of guys who respect you why not use that to get them in to a great cause such as this and it will attract more members and support in the long run. would you be willing to do so??? please reply here on the forum letting us all know were you stand. If you agree i will contact the ACA and see what they think after i hear back from you. :) MADISON BOB CUSTOM CUES
 
sliprock said:
I like the idea of a build-off. I wouldn't want the entries to be catagorized by value, but by style. Maybe have an entry for the simple merry widow styles, and progress up to the more intricate cues. Hide the makers names and let the voters decide. I think hiding the names of the builders is important as some people will be biased in their decisions if they are able to see names.


I aggree, the value would be different from maker to maker. They could possibly be catagorized by what level cue they are. Simular to way they're listed in the blue book.
 
cueman said:
That is exactly my point. I work all the hours I want to and every hour I put in could have been making real $$. Mike you donated a cue to an event in Lousiana and it raffled off for only about 1/5th the cash value.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com

The problem in Lousiana was the director, Even though the lady involved called me direct and was an absolue pleasure to talk to. I learned a huge lesson. But that wasn't charity, that was pure Bullshit on you know who's part. Even though some people use raffled cues for personal gain on flea bay, I have commited to donating a cue evry year for as long as Bristol Billiards in Bristol Ct. has the event because they do what ever they can for the Bradley childrens hospital. Despite my sometimes personal judgement towards winners and their vision to make a quick buck, As a parent, I believe in the cause.
 
bob griffin said:
CHRIS THERE IS SO MANY WAYS THIS CAN BE DONE AND I,LL SAY THIS I DON,T CARE MYSELF HOW IT,S DONE I,LL GIVE UP WHAT EVER I CAN TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN FOR THE CHILDREN.i,ll say this you have the ICA send out a news letters asking them to give there ideals in writing are emails to you on how they think we can make this happen and everyone be apart of it and made happy and i,ll contact the ACA and see if they will do the same then we will post the ideals on the forum and vote once we get the results then i will contact the mags and see if they will give us a 1/4 page telling what were wanting to do and also ask for other builders that are not involved in either the ICA are ACA to become involved. look theres alot of guys who respect you why not use that to get them in to a great cause such as this and it will attract more members and support in the long run. would you be willing to do so??? please reply here on the forum letting us all know were you stand. If you agree i will contact the ACA and see what they think after i hear back from you. :) MADISON BOB CUSTOM CUES
Where I stand is cash entry fee, present pictures of the cue you want to enter. Or enter multiple cues at $100 each. The full $100 would go to charity. I think this would get you a lot more participation than giving up a cue would. This would make it all fair and equal. The winners would have cues that were considered award winning cues and they may benefit more for putting in more labor. Some ICA members will have religious issues with picking Shriners as the charity. I would rather have said that in private, but you are insisting for some reason my answers be public. So the above is where I stand. Work out the details.
Chris
www.hightowercues.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com
 
rhncue said:
I don't see what difference anyone could tell from a CNC or a pantomill cue. The same cutters are used and the only way anyone can tell the difference is if they are told.
Dick

There's a huge difference between a pantomill cue and a high-end CNC cue. There are things you can do with CNC that would take you forever or be impossible on a pantomill.
 
searingcue said:
I'm not saying don't do your own tapers. Let the cue maker build the specs he believes in, just make everything else the same. The reason I'm saying make the same cue is because if you are doing a build off, and they are different, the chance of a winner being chosen for mostly beauty is high. Every contest I've ever heard of to date, beauty has been the major reason and basis to choose the winner. I'm thinking just try once make the priority craftsmanship, and best of all help a charity. Besides, I would think a customers number one priority would be the craftsmanship in there cue.
Thank you for your interest.
Dennis
I'm not a cue maker, but I would be one of those paying to vote and hopefully buying one of these cues.

I really like your ideas on this, except for all of the cues being exactly alike.
Why not make up a set of general specs for a cue and let all of the makers do their own version.
For example, all makers could make a four pointed cue, with or without veneers, with a wrap of their choice, or no wrap, and no more than a total of 8 simple inlays.
That would give each maker some room to express their individual style, yet keep the cues within a reasonable cost, both to the maker and the potential buyers.

Just a thought from a potential voter. :D

BTW, I am a friend of Big Steve and I really liked seeing your work at Valley Forge.
 
Man...bout time

searingcue said:
Hi everyone. Why not have everyone build the same cue, and not real fancy. That will allow more cue makers to become involved, you wouldn't have to be rich, and loaded with machines, just a good craftsman to be invloved in the charity, and have a chance to win this build off. That would also avoid someone putting a 150 hours into a cue without benifitting the charity equally. Deciding what that design may be tough to agree on. An idea might be to at the same time choose a cue maker from the past, and honor by making a similar designed cue. The cue should have each makers initials in the butt cap to avoid exact copy.
Have every one make the exact same cue including joint, joint rings, forearm, veneer colors, blockwork, butt cap, wrap, and with same simple inlays. Simple inlays will keep the guys without cnc machines in the contest.
Then cover each makers ID, and put a number on each cue, display all the cues at a big show like the Hopkin's show. I don't think anyone would argue that the Hopkins show is the biggest show for the custom cue maker, with the most custom cue buyers in attendence. Make a big sign for the booth that has the name of every cue maker that has a cue entered, and participated in the charity. let anyone and everyone who wants to vote "not cue makers" look over every cue and pick first, second, and third place. They would make there choices based on quality of workmanship, fit, finish, etc. Then write their choices on a form and put in a box. The last day of the show, open the box count the votes, and the numbered cues that get the most votes wins. There are several ways you can profit for the charity. At the same time people vote, they could also put a bid on a cue number if they choose, and the winning bidder for each cue gets that cue. Then uncover ID's and announce who won, and at the same time the winning bidder will see who's cue they bought. All the money goes to charity, or you could charge a nice entry fee to each cue maker who wants a shot at the build off title. Another or additional way, charge a small donation fee to participate in the vote that goes to the charity too. I would have to believe all the publications would love to print the results, there for, great press to the winners. I can't speak for them, but I think that there's a chance Allen, and Dawn may give a space for it, just to be part of the charity and good press for them too. I'm sure every aspect of this idea could be tweaked in a lot of ways. The main thing is to make everything fair for every cue maker. You also would want to take steps to avoid vote cheating, but if your going to do a build off were you choose a winner, then lets try one were we compare the same apples to apples. Never been done in the past.
Only my idea of a build off, maybe a wrench in the soup, but just an idea.
If it's only build a cue for charity, I'll do that too.
Dennis Searing
PS;My first post on AZ Hope I don't regret it.. :)

My man Dennis steps up to AZ...wonder if Jimbo will post bash? BAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Welcome brother...bout time.
 
Sheldon said:
There's a huge difference between a pantomill cue and a high-end CNC cue. There are things you can do with CNC that would take you forever or be impossible on a pantomill.

Boy, I sure beg to differ here. I know of nothing a CNC can do that a Pantomill can't. Wrap around inlays would be harder on a pantomill but they still can be done. Fancy inlays are cheaper to do on a CNC as you don't need all of the templates but what else is different?
Dick
 
Madison Bob

I CONTACTED dan dishshaw with the ACA and chris hightower with the ICA and there both checking with there members to try to get a level playing field both organazations can play on if we work this out it will say alot about both organazations characters and ability to work together for a great cause i,ll keep everyone concerned and informed as i can keep your fingers crossed. if we all pull it off there will be some smiles from the children you can see for a mile, now thats exciting. :) :) MADISON BOB CUSTOM CUES
 
madison bob

alright dan dishaw has contacted me and said he will sumit the ideal to his ACA members also and will look forward to working with the ICA and chris hightower to make this happen and he said also there is no problems are have never been a problem with the ICA . he also said its not confirmed untill he has spoken to his members but will be doing so very soon and he said if they agree that he would invite myself and chris hightower to there meeting in march of this up and coming year if everything is not taken care of by then to discuss this he also said he personaly loves the ideal and would like to see as many non members of either the ICA are ACA get involved as possiable. I want to thank personaly the ICA and ACA members and chris and dan for at least trying to get involved with this and if anyone else wants in please post it here with contact information so i can make a list and get things rolling and if it so happens you don,t like the way we present it after the decisions are made. After all the ideals of how most would like to have it done you can change your mind. The way of doing it will be decided at a later date since this is still in its beginning state.But i tkink it will be done in about the same way chris has mentioned but we will see once all the cards are on the table.MADISON BOBS CUSTOM CUES
 
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custom cue build offfor charity

If you turn this into a contest, I don't see how you will be raising money for a charity. Instead you'll have a "MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS", kind of contest. I'm willing to make an Ebony cue with 6 Ivory points & 6 matching designs in the butt. SELL IT FOR THE BEST PRICE YOU CAN GET & DONATE THE MONEY, TO THE CHOSEN CHARITY. My cue probably won't bring as much money as the big boys, but somebody will get a hell of a cue & I will be making a donation to the charity. I thought that was the idea...JER
 
BLACKHEARTCUES said:
If you turn this into a contest, I don't see how you will be raising money for a charity. Instead you'll have a "MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS", kind of contest. I'm willing to make an Ebony cue with 6 Ivory points & 6 matching designs in the butt. SELL IT FOR THE BEST PRICE YOU CAN GET & DONATE THE MONEY, TO THE CHOSEN CHARITY. My cue probably won't bring as much money as the big boys, but somebody will get a hell of a cue & I will be making a donation to the charity. I thought that was the idea...JER


yeah why not just combine all the ideas? ex.

everyone could built a hoppe style cue, any combo, wood, color, ect. that whay you dont have to be worried about going crazy. imagine variety of hoppe's... wow how could one choose?

auction it off as a whole collection, im sure that would be a collection many collectors would give a nut for. its been done at all the collectors shows.

and also have a contest for best of show, best crafsmanship, and cuemakers choice ( where the cuemakers vote... hopefully everone wouldnt get 1 vote each) oh and like denise searing said hide the name.

although i still like my original idea winner take all... :D
 
I have run it by some of the ICA members and it seems most would not want to have a competition. We decided not to have best of show competitons at trade shows because of the egos that get wounded and tempers that flare. Cuemakers as a whole have fair size egos and it would probably not benefit the children or anyone else to have a contest. A Cue Charity for Children seems to be what most would want to participate in if they decide to participate. So for now the ICA will encourage members to participate, but it will be up to each member what he wants to donate if anything. People want to know who is going to handle everything as it will obviously be a lot of work. Work out the details and we will let each member decide in his own heart what he desires to do.
Chris
www.internationalcuemakers.com
 
Different kind of contest!

BLACKHEARTCUES said:
If you turn this into a contest, I don't see how you will be raising money for a charity. Instead you'll have a "MY DICK IS BIGGER THAN YOURS", kind of contest. I'm willing to make an Ebony cue with 6 Ivory points & 6 matching designs in the butt. SELL IT FOR THE BEST PRICE YOU CAN GET & DONATE THE MONEY, TO THE CHOSEN CHARITY. My cue probably won't bring as much money as the big boys, but somebody will get a hell of a cue & I will be making a donation to the charity. I thought that was the idea...JER


I agree! The idea is to raise some money for the kids and possibly get a little exposure for our efforts. I can see where the contest could be counter productive to the effort. A gallery would be fine, where prospective buyers could check out the cues and even hit some balls with them if that's feasable.

I've got an idea for an initial way to award a cue and raise some money. We could cover the Makers mark on all the cues. We can use a sticker with an assigned number for each entry. Let the people buy a chance for say $10, with a list of contributing cuemakers and a block next to the name. The contestants can see if they can pick the maker of the cues, with the person getting closest winning the cue of his choice BEFORE THE ACTUAL MAKERS ARE REVEALED! Of course we, as contributing cuemakers, have to be somewhat secretive about whet we're submitting and display them before the event. I still say that the Derby City Classic would be my pick of venues but I'll go with the rest of you (even though I don't plan to attend the Valley Forge Show this year). I'll still submit a cue.

just more hot air!

Sherm
 
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