DigiCue Blue graph interpretation

[7stud]

Here is a graph of a shot:

1. What does the yellow arrow signify?
2. The Straightness (STR) is described like this:

However, when I change the difficulty setting for Straightness, the (inner?) circle does not change size.

3. The tip steer metric in the image is CNTR and the result was 9.0. On the Settings page, I have that metric set to Medium. Why is it red in the image above? On the Settings page, I also have FLT set to Medium, and in the image above a 9.0 result is green.

I find that my Digicue Blue records too many false shots. For instance, I'll be standing behind a shot with my cue 90 degrees to the shot line and with my cue still, and suddenly Digicue Blue will record a shot; or I'll be examining the graph and scores while holding the cue vertical with the butt resting against the ground, and suddenly Digicue Blue will record a shot. As a result, I would like to see two features:

1. On the graph page (example screenshot above), I would like to be able to go back to the previous shot's graph and metrics.
2. On the page with the raw data (clock icon), I would like to be able to click on a line and delete it. It would also be kind of nice if you could click on a line and have the graph page display the metrics.

Mistake here:

 

[bbb]

looks like you are shooting pretty well

 

[7stud]

looks like you are shooting pretty well

Well...

BCK and FIN are easy to score high on, you just need to pause on your backstroke and pause after the shot.
STR -- Measures how much the tip is moving up and down in the vertical plane. I strive for a pendulum stroke,
so I want to score *low* on that. If you have a piston stroke, you will score higher on Straightness.
JAB -- I just stroke the ball like most people do. If you follow through normally, rather than like when hitting a nip shot, then you
will score high.

That leaves CNTR and FLT. The CNTR value can be RIGHT, LEFT or CNTR (i.e. CENTER), and it measures deviations of the tip from the vertical axis right or left, and that's what I'm trying to work on. FLT measures "smoothness and acceleration of the tip during follow through", and I don't know if I care about that.

 

[bbb]

Well...

BCK and FIN are easy to score high on, you just need to pause on your backstroke and pause after the shot.
STR -- Measures how much the tip is moving up and down in the vertical plane. I strive for a pendulum stroke,
so I want to score *low* on that. If you have a piston stroke, you will score higher on Straightness.
JAB -- I just stroke the ball like most people do. If you follow through normally, rather than like when hitting a nip shot, then you
will score high.

That leaves CNTR and FLT. The CNTR value can be RIGHT, LEFT or CENTER, and it measures deviations of the tip from the vertical axis right or left, and that's what I'm trying to work on. FLT measures "smoothness and acceleration of the tip during follow through", and I don't know if I care about that.

i dont know what sensitivity you have it on but a "9" is very good ...yes?
with such good scores
are finding success in your play?

 

[tableroll]

Anybody got a digicue blue for sale? How much?

 

[7stud]

Anybody got a digicue blue for sale? How much?

$169.95:

Amazon.com

Whoops. It looks like they are out for now:

FREE delivery January 18 - 20

 

[Paul_#_]

I look forward for answers to your questions. I have not noticed false shots. My trouble has been it not recording shots.

I have been trying to improve my stroke using the Mighty X drill for now. Maybe I shoud have worked that with Digicue Blue but the Mighty X was enough work for me.

 

[7stud]

I have not noticed false shots. My trouble has been it not recording shots.

Yesterday, I noticed that problem for the first time. I had to close out the app, push the start button on the cue, then relaunch the app.

 

[nataddrho]

I just sent a shipment of 100 to Amazon. It has been delivered and is being processed by FBA, so they should be in the distributed warehouses within a few days.

I now have time to address some issues that you guys have brought up. The Straightness plot shows a different magnitude (axial force vector), and it ends up not matching with the threshold line. Originally I had justification for this but I now consider it a bug because I agree it is confusing. I'll make an update to the app and make the display a little more clear, as well as add threshold lines to the bar graph, and add some of the features you mentioned including a firmware update to improve the false triggers. If I update the firmware I might as well add a "twist" parameter that people have been asking me to add for a while now.

Additionally, I am working on a complementary project I am calling "DigiCast". It is a simple, small box, that has a power input and HDMI output. It plugs into the back of your TV and displays some lightweight graphics. No configuration necessary, no WiFi, no phone needed, no app and no hassle. You just plug it in and it works on any TV. It directly reads a DigiCue or a DigiBall, up to two players for each device. Yes, you can just AirPlay or Mirror your phone to your TV for free (if you have a smart TV), but this doesn't always work, and it ties up your phone from using it for other things. Just an alternate solution. Trying to keep the cost under $100.

Connecting to it is very easy. You simply touch your DigiCue to the receiver and it connects automatically, and stays that way until you power off the DigiCast.

Here is an example screenshot of what the DigiCue screen looks like, and I'll make the mobile app more like this. Notice how the circular plot and the Straightness bar graph now agree. You want to keep the blue arrow inside of the circle to keep it "green".

Adding a DigiBall (when it comes out) is just as easy. Now the Straightness arrow shows how the tip moved off line to arrive at the tip location on the ball. This is useful for showing how an inaccurate stroke effects the ball.

Multiple DigiBalls, carom demonstration.

While I am at it I can add a Score feature that shows the score in large letters, if people want it.

Alright, I'll get to work in the DigiCue fixes either this or next week.

Thanks

Nate

 

[7stud]

In the following screenshot, why is the tip steer(CNTR) red?

As far as I can tell, the tip steer (CNTR) bar graph is always red no matter what my score is for a shot. If it matters, all settings are MEDIUM.

 

[nataddrho]

In the following screenshot, why is the tip steer(CNTR) red?

View attachment 794030

As far as I can tell, the tip steer (CNTR) bar graph is always red no matter what my score is for a shot. If it matters, all settings are MEDIUM.

It looks like your tip is moving upwards a tiny amount. This setting is very hard. When straightness is green steering also will be green. I think I will fix this and make it independent.

 

[7stud]

It looks like your tip is moving upwards a tiny amount. This setting is very hard. When straightness is green steering also will be green. I think I will fix this and make it independent.

Thanks for responding. How do you know the tip was moving up a tiny amount and not down? I assume that because straightness(STR) measures vertical tip movement, and my score was not a 10, that there was some up and down movement, but how can you tell the movement was up?

I strive for a pendulum stroke--where the tip moves up and down during the stroke--so I think the high score for STR means that I must have dropped my elbow.

 

[nataddrho]

Thanks for responding. How do you know the tip was moving up a tiny amount and not down? I assume that because straightness(STR) measures vertical tip movement, and my score was not a 10, that there was some up and down movement, but how can you tell the movement was up?

I strive for a pendulum stroke--where the tip moves up and down during the stroke--so I think the high score for STR means that I must have dropped my elbow.

The polar plot to the left is drawing a red line pointing in the direction that your tip is moving from a perfectly straight line through space during your forward stroke. The length of the line represents how much movement. Since the red line is not very long and is barely crossing the highest setting threshold (smaller white circle) you are already very straight. You are dropping your elbow a very tiny amount causing the tip to rise slightly before impact.

Tip steering should be green, since you are not steering left or right and are staying vertical. This is a bug. I’ll fix it.

 

[7stud]

The polar plot to the left is drawing a red line pointing in the direction that your tip is moving from a perfectly straight line through space during your forward stroke. The length of the line represents how much movement. Since the red line is not very long and is barely crossing the highest setting threshold (smaller white circle) you are already very straight. You are dropping your elbow a very tiny amount causing the tip to rise slightly before impact.

Tip steering should be green, since you are not steering left or right and are staying vertical. This is a bug. I’ll fix it.

I had to read that a couple of times before a light went off: the plot on the left is a view of the back of the CB. I thought the plot was a view of the top of the CB and that the red line was the direction my cue tip was moving as it went through the CB, i.e. it was a graph of the tip steer (I hadn't noticed the length of the red line changing). So if you stroke the CB with a perfect piston stroke, the red line will be a dot at the center of the circle, correct?

Does the yellow triangle at the top represent the tip steer?

 

[nataddrho]

I had to read that a couple of times before a light went off: the plot on the left is a view of the back of the CB. I thought the plot was a view of the top of the CB and that the red line was the direction my cue tip was moving as it went through the CB, i.e. it was a graph of the tip steer (I hadn't noticed the length of the red line changing). So if you stroke the CB with a perfect piston stroke, the red line will be a dot at the center of the circle, correct?

Does the yellow triangle at the top represent the tip steer?

Yes exactly. And the yellow arrow is just an extension to show where the line is pointing, in case the length of the line is too small.

The center of the plot is really in reference to your stroke line. Not the ball. The digicue has no idea where the ball is.

Please help me with making this more clear to avoid confusion like you had. What should I change?

 

[7stud]

With the Digicue app open, there is an information icon on every page:

The first thing on the information page should be an explanation of the "XY Plot" (as you call it on the Settings page). Something like:

The circle is a view of the rear of the cue ball, or more accurately a circle drawn around the line that your cue is moving along. The red line represents the direction your tip was moving up or down. If the red line points in an upward direction, then your tip was moving up with respect to the line of your stroke when your cue contacted the cue ball. If the red line points in a downward direction, then your cue tip was moving down with respect to the line of your stroke when the cue tip contacted the ball. The length of the red line represents how much your tip moved up or down. A perfect piston stroke will result in a red dot at the center of the circle. The yellow triangle represents the tip steer direction.

I don't know if I described that correctly, so change it as you see fit. Writing that got me thinking about how DigiCue Blue knows where your stroke line is when you have a Pendulum stroke. Is it some type of average location of the butt (which contains the device) in the vertical plane? If so, then an average position of the tip for a Pendulum stroke will be lower than the starting position, so when a Pendulum stroke returns to the starting position the tip will always be moving up with respect to the average position of the tip. That's because on the backstroke of a Pendulum stroke, the tip gets lower and lower as the cue moves backwards.

 

[Black-Balled]

Amazing thread, how cool it is to witness.

I have no directly applicable input!

 

[nataddrho]

Great feedback. Thanks!

As for the pendulum stroke, opposite to intuition, there is actually almost zero vertical tip movement during the last few inches of the forward stroke before the ball is hit. The DigiCue only measures Straightness/Steering during a small window of time (proof courtesy of Dr. Dave). The true stroke line is the one where zero radial acceleration of the butt is measured during the capture time.

So a high score in Straightness only means that your hand did not add any up/down/side forces right before you hit the ball, which is equivalent to the opposite direction the tip moves.

Seeing the tip move upwards, means that your hand moved downwards, and this can only happen with an elbow drop before contact. It can be OK if this is consistent and part of your stroke. The problem with this is only if this causes you to add MORE top than you intended (more than the solution in your head)...

...more top spin doesn't change the amount of squirt, but it definitely does change the amount of swerve, and when it breaks (earlier). This is enough to cause object balls to rattle, or hit shots thick. It is why """unintentional""" elbow drops cause people problems.

 

[sudocrushms]

I just sent a shipment of 100 to Amazon. It has been delivered and is being processed by FBA, so they should be in the distributed warehouses within a few days.

I now have time to address some issues that you guys have brought up. The Straightness plot shows a different magnitude (axial force vector), and it ends up not matching with the threshold line. Originally I had justification for this but I now consider it a bug because I agree it is confusing. I'll make an update to the app and make the display a little more clear, as well as add threshold lines to the bar graph, and add some of the features you mentioned including a firmware update to improve the false triggers. If I update the firmware I might as well add a "twist" parameter that people have been asking me to add for a while now.

Additionally, I am working on a complementary project I am calling "DigiCast". It is a simple, small box, that has a power input and HDMI output. It plugs into the back of your TV and displays some lightweight graphics. No configuration necessary, no WiFi, no phone needed, no app and no hassle. You just plug it in and it works on any TV. It directly reads a DigiCue or a DigiBall, up to two players for each device. Yes, you can just AirPlay or Mirror your phone to your TV for free (if you have a smart TV), but this doesn't always work, and it ties up your phone from using it for other things. Just an alternate solution. Trying to keep the cost under $100.

View attachment 793998

Connecting to it is very easy. You simply touch your DigiCue to the receiver and it connects automatically, and stays that way until you power off the DigiCast.

Here is an example screenshot of what the DigiCue screen looks like, and I'll make the mobile app more like this. Notice how the circular plot and the Straightness bar graph now agree. You want to keep the blue arrow inside of the circle to keep it "green".

View attachment 794001

Adding a DigiBall (when it comes out) is just as easy. Now the Straightness arrow shows how the tip moved off line to arrive at the tip location on the ball. This is useful for showing how an inaccurate stroke effects the ball.

View attachment 794002

Multiple DigiBalls, carom demonstration.
View attachment 794011

While I am at it I can add a Score feature that shows the score in large letters, if people want it.

Alright, I'll get to work in the DigiCue fixes either this or next week.

Thanks

Nate

Are you going to be selling these as a set once the DigiBall comes out?

 

[nataddrho]

Are you going to be selling these as a set once the DigiBall comes out?

Maybe, it depends on the interest