Double hit on break

1ab

1ab

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
After a player double hit on the break it became difficult to understand the result of the foul, considering it occurred on a break shot, interpretations of the VNEA rules were varied. Tried e-mail to VNEA ... no response. Please help. Thanks
 
That's very hard to do, a double hit on the break.

Regular VNEA break rules apply.
randyg
 
randyg said:
That's very hard to do, a double hit on the break.

Regular VNEA break rules apply.
randyg
Click to expand...

I've not only seen it happen a bunch of times, I've done it myself on several occasions. I usually do it after I've made a slight contact with the cueball on a practice stroke thus rolling the cueball slightly/slowly toward the rack and then just go ahead and whack the cueball on my very next stroke. It all happens fairly fast, but not so fast that it can't be noticed. In the APA, a foul cannot occur on the break shot UNTIL the rack is struck. Also, there are no rules in APA covering the "double-hit", so it wouldn't be a foul either way in APA. But VNEA rules I know nothing about.

Maniac
 
I have no idea about VNEA rules. I did see it happen at the US Open 10 ball in May. Raj Hundal double hit the break against Efren (actually, Efren called a foul on him and Raj looked surprised but acquiesced to his claim). The fouled occured before the balls were struck, so Efren chose a rerack with ball in hand and proceeded to three foul Raj.

I believe his choice was to break or receive ball in hand, not 100% sure though on the first choice. It could have been ball in hand with the rack open. I only know the one he chose for sure.
 
In apa touching the cue ball is a foul,other then the break...you must hit the rack before a foul can be made..you basicaly have to scratch on the break to foul.
In bcapl its a foul to touch the cue ball even when breaking..
 
Standard penalty is 20 laps around the parking lot with a pool table on the offender's back.
 
If it matters to anybody, I think fouls on the break should be the same as fouls on any other shot. I also think players should be afforded the right to use their judgement and break soft if they see fit.
 
Rules

I don't care what rules you use, a double hit is ALWAYS a foul. In this case, on the break, it would be a rerack and opponents break normally, unless the opponent was feeling generous and let the player rerack and break again.
 
APA doesn't clarify whether the cue ball has to be motionless prior to the breaking stroke. You can adjust the position of the cue ball with the pool cue prior to breaking. The only stipulations on fouls while breaking is the difference between a legal break and an illegal break.

legal break:
cue ball struck from inside the kitchen
strike the rack prior to striking a rail
4 object balls driven to rails or object ball pocketed

the double hit on the break question hits one of two situations:
1) you double hit prior to breaking the rack, so the cue ball is in motion for the breaking stroke
2) you hit the cue ball with your stick after breaking the rack.

case 1, if the cue ball is still in the kitchen the second time you hit it, it's a legal break in the APA. If it was outside the kitchen on the second hit, it's an illegal break. if you didn't scratch, your opponent reracks and you break again. no foul. if you scratched, you rerack and your opponent has the break.

case 2, you fouled the cue ball after striking the rack. If it was otherwise a legal break, you opponent has BIH from the kitchen. If it was otherwise an illegal break, you rerack and your opponent breaks.

That's the APA perspective, anyway. I wasn't sure what kind of double hit y'all were talking about, so I figured I'd cover all the bases.
 
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