Dreaming and designing my own pool table

3kushn

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
So, in my quest for the ultimate, strongest, heavy duty pool table, I could place a double nut ...
Let's say one nut has 10 threads of 360°, two nuts have double !!!
That would make the load carrying capacity even higher, doesn't it.
That is a lot easier than designing an alternative system.

Thanks for the input.
I'm not a mechanical engineer or a table mechanic, only a lowly retired torque tooling peddler.
Typical rule of thumb is 3X diameter of thread engagement is about all the pull strength you can get. If I were to select fasteners for the ultimate design I'd find or have made precision studs and nuts with rolled threads, not cut threads. Rolled would have the strongest thread strength. Class of fit would be 3A & 3B. I don't believe you would need high tensile strength if you're going to be bolting against wood. Looking at Perfection, you'll want to be sure bolt holes line up perfectly so the bearing surface under the bolt head has full contact. This will ensure, for one, that if a torque wrench is used you'll end up with tighter tolerances regarding tension/clamp load. I'd also suggest heavy precision washers.
Brain Storming.....
 

3kushn

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm kinda partial to "T-Rails" Just my opinion, its a stronger design.
2 things although.
The rails aren't as quiet.
Risk of cracking a slate if you crank down on the rail bolts.

This is my Verhoeven
50mm slate.
Top row goes into the slate. Bottom row goes into the frame.
 

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boogieman

It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
I'm not a mechanical engineer or a table mechanic, only a lowly retired torque tooling peddler.
Typical rule of thumb is 3X diameter of thread engagement is about all the pull strength you can get. If I were to select fasteners for the ultimate design I'd find or have made precision studs and nuts with rolled threads, not cut threads. Rolled would have the strongest thread strength. Class of fit would be 3A & 3B. I don't believe you would need high tensile strength if you're going to be bolting against wood. Looking at Perfection, you'll want to be sure bolt holes line up perfectly so the bearing surface under the bolt head has full contact. This will ensure, for one, that if a torque wrench is used you'll end up with tighter tolerances regarding tension/clamp load. I'd also suggest heavy precision washers.
Brain Storming.....
Yep, and wood is a living thing. Don't put the beef to it, it's like cloth, you have to work with the material and it's "weave" to get the best results. Any natural material takes knowledge to use properly and it looks like you definitely understand that.
 

MamboFats

New member
The slate is held by the rail bolts.
If I understand this correctly: the complete table is just 2 parts: the top part with slate and rails is just laying on top of the frame with the leveling system...
Is there really no fysical attachment through screws, bolts or whatever?
So the complete slate with rails could shift when bumped very hard?
Watch the video on YT. Shows it very clearly.
I don't know if I watched the correct video. I saw two different lengths of screws attaching the leveling leafs to the frame. I saw the explication of the slate leveling, but I don't remember hearing them talk about attaching the slate.
I can be wrong ...

First I was thinking of copying the Diamond system with the leafs, but now I've turned 90° (not 180°): trying to combine the interesting features of Diamond with a regular frame built.

Thanx for the input
 

Ssonerai

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hello again,
I've been working on the slate leveling system. I've got it figured out ...
I've got some images to show : (pictures, etc.....)
[/QUOTE]
Think about your wedge system a little bit.
1.it is to be hoped you would not need that much depth ever, (of shim thickness) to level a conventional slate.
1.a.) that much depth in wood invites shrinking/swelling
(My) conclusion: simplify, and use a thinner, all metal (preferable), or all plastic shim if you have access to strong plastics for the sneck.

2.) Re: screw actuation - once again, it is to be hoped that very little displacement of that size potential shim would never be necessary.
2.a.) feeding the shim along the screw as shown will gradually bend it.
(My) conclusion: will probably work since it is unlikely to ever be displaced significantly from installed flush height.
However, using a slotted nut, in a slot in the end of the metal shim, would allow the nut to pull the shim as well as push it. The slot in the shim would allow rise & fall as necessary with shim displacement.

It has bothered me, as El Picos notes, that you have supports on each side of the joints rather than directly under them.
I imagine that you did that so the shim systems for each side can work independently. However, structurally, it is less stable than one support under both. So you might have to re-configure the shim system at those locations. Or place the supports closer together and connect them to form a sort of H flange beam.

Some parts of this you are probably over-thinking in wood.
But good luck, that is how progress happens.
:)

smt
 
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EL Picos

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't want to bring confusion but I think that, me too, to build up my own frame table a day and concerning the levelling support system, I would glue HPDE pieces 5/8-3/4 inch thick to the slate for fixing long bolts instead to drill holes in slates , It will do a system that work in two ways up and down.
cutting_board-xl-1200x705.jpg
 
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Sheldon

dontneednostinkintitle
Silver Member
If I understand this correctly: the complete table is just 2 parts: the top part with slate and rails is just laying on top of the frame with the leveling system...
Is there really no fysical attachment through screws, bolts or whatever?
So the complete slate with rails could shift when bumped very hard?
No, the frame and leveling system are connected with screws, and the rails and the rail bolts connect and hold the slate to them.
 

MamboFats

New member
I don't want to bring confusion but I think that, me too, to build up my own frame table a day and concerning the levelling support system, I would glue HPDE pieces 5/8-3/4 inch thick to the slate for fixing long bolts instead to drill holes in slates , It will do a system that work in two ways up and down.
I've been looking at some kind of this material, as the Diamonds wedges are made of such a plastic.

Since this is very expensive around my place, now I look at it from the other angle ...
Diamond has a plastic wedge in a slotted groove in plywood, I will be using a wooden wedge in a slotted groove of the frame, with a plastic plate inside that groove => I found some kitchen cutting boards in this material at ¼" thick, these can withstand high pressure, can be sanded and are really cheap.

I will look at putting slate screws down in the frame.
Since the frame is plywood, maybe I can put some solid wood blocks on the places where the slate has its screw holes.
 

EL Picos

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've been looking at some kind of this material, as the Diamonds wedges are made of such a plastic.

Since this is very expensive around my place, now I look at it from the other angle ...
Diamond has a plastic wedge in a slotted groove in plywood, I will be using a wooden wedge in a slotted groove of the frame, with a plastic plate inside that groove => I found some kitchen cutting boards in this material at ¼" thick, these can withstand high pressure, can be sanded and are really cheap.

I will look at putting slate screws down in the frame.
Since the frame is plywood, maybe I can put some solid wood blocks on the places where the slate has its screw holes.
Will you drill the slate in the seam also?
 

kid

billiard mechanic
Silver Member
Something is missing on those drawings: hardware.
What you are going to use is as important if not more than how strong your parts are.
I personally would have the frame corners connected and not rely only on the legs to hold it together


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant AzBilliards Forums
 

MamboFats

New member
Something is missing on those drawings: hardware.
What you are going to use is as important if not more than how strong your parts are.
I personally would have the frame corners connected and not rely only on the legs to hold it together
That's correct. I have not yet drawn corner connections to hold all sides in place.
In my sketchbook (paper and pencil) I have the long sides of the legs shorter, with the sideframe sticking out (only an overlap of about 4"). A block of solid wood is to be put in each corner for strenght, attached with2 or 3 bolts on each side.
I have not yet drawn this in the digital design ... homework
 

MamboFats

New member
So I just altered my design as I mentioned in the last post.
The outsides of the legs are shortened for multiple reasons.
1. they serve no purpose in the general strenght of the leg
2. that part of the leg will be hidden behind the skirts
3. it's my most expensive piece of wood
I also put in the inside corner blocks that hold the outside frame pieces together.
Desain Pool 16.png

Desain Pool 15.png

Just having fun ...
 
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MamboFats

New member
It's been over six weeks since I posted, but I haven't been doing nothing on this project.
I've bought some very nice oak that will be used for the legs and the toprail and the skirts.
In the meanwhile I've been learning to use Autodesk Fusion 360 on a higher level (jumping from absolute beginner to ... just 1 step up)

I've settled on the design: here are my latest sketches ...


I've chosen the 6 leg design. Just for peace of mind: there is a small chance of getting a 2" slate ... Crazy, I know ... Just want to be prepared if ever...
These legs I will be building this winter.
Version 5 v4.jpg

A friend - carpenter and furniture maker by profession - assured me when I glue several layers of plywood together and use it standing up, the strenght will be amongst the better hard woods. At my job I can get 1,25" plywood. So two layers gives me 2.5" thick frame beams. If necessary I can make it 3 layers ...
Planning to build this frame early 2022 ...
Version 5 v4 - 2.png

On top of the frame comes the slate leveling system: I've not yet decided on the actual system I'm gonna use. Still have time to decide.
Version 5 v4 - 3.png

The slate will be at least a 1.25" thick slate (30mm). I have multiple sources nearby, so this will come down to price .... unless I can get a 50mm thick - 2 inches - ... I'm willing to pay for that ... just wanting to be my table unique in every way ... It's fun to chase your dreams
Version 5 v4 - 4.png

I had a lot of problems drawings these rails. They are not yet perfect, pocketholes are not yet in this design and the pointy edges will be gone in my next drawing session.
Hope to be building these by summer 2022
Version 5 v4 - 5.png

Just a simple side and front view of my design.
I hope you guys see some resemblance with the Diamond Pro-Am ... my dream table
Version 5 v4 - 6.png
Version 5 v4 - 7.png


This project is a real journey.
The last weeks I've been sketching the jigs that will be needed to cut all the different angles of the legs and the rails.
I have no professional tablesaw, no CNC available, ... just some basic tools like a 89$ tablesaw, a battery-powered handdrill/screwdriver and an old plungerouter. In the past I have made several jigs to fit my tablesaw to be able to cut awkward angles, tenons and mortises. For my router I made a small table to fit underneath. Even this part of the project I find fascinating.

Just watched the semi's and the final of the US Open, I enjoyed this so much ...
Pool is fantastic

Enjoy the game
 

MamboFats

New member
This evening, just like many before has nothing to offer on TV. So I've been drawing, and drawing, and drawing ...

Put in some corner pieces, and made the cutouts for the pocket liners
Version 5 v6 - 10.png
Version 5 v6 - 11.png

Top view, looking a little like a Diamond ...
Version 5 v6 - 12.png
 
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