Easy To Stop Pattern Racking

Johnnyt

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
It's so easy to Stop Pattern Racking in 9 ball. Just make a rule that they must break at least so many miles an hour, determined with radar guns. Have a 2"X2" break box. It really gets old hearing, "Where is the money going to come from for refs and radar guns." "How can we know when soneone is pattern racking." Open your eyes? I'm starting to lean torward the promoters for NOT wanting things changed. With all these 2k/ 16 player tournaments popping up (Thanks Ray (Bigtruck), now is the perfect time to put this kind of thing in motion at the lowest cost.

It seems like there will never be a pro pool org. to set rules and enforce them, so let the promoter's be the org. Let the players, live gate and PPV put in a small % to pay for refs and such. The players need to let a small amount be taken from all the entries and promoters need to get the fish hooks out of their pockets. Either stop all the out right cheating in 9 ball at the open and pro level or don't play 9 ball. Johnnyt
 
I agree too. There should be a rule where a certian pattern should be used throughout the tournament.I mean there are rules that the 2ball needs to be in a certian place, and the 9ball doesnt count in bottom pockets
 
Even with Amateurs

Johnnyt said:
It's so easy to Stop Pattern Racking in 9 ball. Just make a rule that they must break at least so many miles an hour, determined with radar guns. Have a 2"X2" break box. It really gets old hearing, "Where is the money going to come from for refs and radar guns." "How can we know when soneone is pattern racking." Open your eyes? I'm starting to lean torward the promoters for NOT wanting things changed. With all these 2k/ 16 player tournaments popping up (Thanks Ray (Bigtruck), now is the perfect time to put this kind of thing in motion at the lowest cost.

It seems like there will never be a pro pool org. to set rules and enforce them, so let the promoter's be the org. Let the players, live gate and PPV put in a small % to pay for refs and such. The players need to let a small amount be taken from all the entries and promoters need to get the fish hooks out of their pockets. Either stop all the out right cheating in 9 ball at the open and pro level or don't play 9 ball. Johnnyt
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Even with Amateurs 9 ball is a pain because of the rack and the break so I play 10 ball, not near as much issue with it.
 
336Robin said:
Even with Amateurs 9 ball is a pain because of the rack and the break so I play 10 ball, not near as much issue with it.
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I agree. If the powers that be can't or won't fix it...get rid of it. Even 10 ball is a way better game on a 7' also. Johnnyt
 
Hopefully I'm not opening up a can of worms here, but what would be the harm if both players could place the balls in the rack however they wanted?
 
No can of worms

JeremiahGage said:
Hopefully I'm not opening up a can of worms here, but what would be the harm if both players could place the balls in the rack however they wanted?
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I don't think you are really opening up a can of worms but because of better amateur play 9 ball is found to have a flaw and apparently the flaw is quite large. Unless you do something to the rack or move it I don't see the flaw being nullified. Im currently playing a challenge system 9 ball and I can sure tell how the rolls and breaks are affecting the games. 10 ball is a might better enough to discourage 9 ball. Im not sure what could be done to 9 ball.

One thing we do is whoever is behind breaks until you have a switch in who is winning. That has helped and we both inspect the rack. If there are spaces we continue until its frozen. Its a call for the place you play and how they want to do their events. I prefer 10 ball not as much fuss.
 
An even simplier and better solution:

Breaker racks the balls in any pattern he wants. Opponent has the option to require the breaker to exchange the position any two balls (except the one and nine or ten, of course).

After the position exchange the breaker racks the balls tight and breaks. No touching the balls after you've lifted the triangle.

This solution is based on the theory that you can destroy any pattern by exchanging the position of just two balls. Try it; you'll see that it works.

No software, no sheets with pre-determined racks, no nothing -- just ten seconds to exchange the position of two balls.
 
336Robin said:
I don't think you are really opening up a can of worms but because of better amateur play 9 ball is found to have a flaw and apparently the flaw is quite large. Unless you do something to the rack or move it I don't see the flaw being nullified. Im currently playing a challenge system 9 ball and I can sure tell how the rolls and breaks are affecting the games. 10 ball is a might better enough to discourage 9 ball. Im not sure what could be done to 9 ball.

One thing we do is whoever is behind breaks until you have a switch in who is winning. That has helped and we both inspect the rack. If there are spaces we continue until its frozen. Its a call for the place you play and how they want to do their events. I prefer 10 ball not as much fuss.
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Ah, it sounds like you're concerned about manipulating the rack in such a way that favors making a ball. I think you don't want people tilting the rack or creating gaps on purpose, so maybe those players concerned should use something like a Magic rack?
 
The Magic Rack is fine

JeremiahGage said:
Ah, it sounds like you're concerned about manipulating the rack in such a way that favors making a ball. I think you don't want people tilting the rack or creating gaps on purpose, so maybe those players concerned should use something like a Magic rack?
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Im easy to get along with and the Magic Rack is fine because it creates some standards that are the same for all players. Even moving the racking location some is fine but racking for your opponent is not because it leaves too many unanswered questions. Its just easier to rack your own under some method. I actually had a guy tell me to rerack because of a space that I know would have worked out better for him that I didn't see.

I don't think in a tournament of any kind that another player should rack for you not with they way things have developed.
 
336Robin said:
Im easy to get along with and the Magic Rack is fine because it creates some standards that are the same for all players. Even moving the racking location some is fine but racking for your opponent is not because it leaves too many unanswered questions. Its just easier to rack your own under some method. I actually had a guy tell me to rerack because of a space that I know would have worked out better for him that I didn't see.

I don't think in a tournament of any kind that another player should rack for you not with they way things have developed.
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I agree with rack your own as it removes a lot of disputes about racking. Going with something like a Magic rack seems like the best option, and you can always challenge your opponent's rack if you think they are manipulating it.

Placing balls in particular patterns doesn't seem like a big deal because both players can do that. Requiring certain balls to be placed in particular locations is fine (e.g. the 2-ball at the back), but there should not be a rule where the rack has to be "random" or "not in a pattern" because that is too subjective.
 
Agreed

JeremiahGage said:
I agree with rack your own as it removes a lot of disputes about racking. Going with something like a Magic rack seems like the best option, and you can always challenge your opponent's rack if you think they are manipulating it.

Placing balls in particular patterns doesn't seem like a big deal because both players can do that. Requiring certain balls to be placed in particular locations is fine (e.g. the 2-ball at the back), but there should not be a rule where the rack has to be "random" or "not in a pattern" because that is too subjective.
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Exactly,
It shouldn't be allowed to take up time from the matches under tournament conditions. I racked for a full 2 minutes the other day on a table that had older worn balls and its enough to try your patience to get them all frozen. I would almost say Sardo rack cause its put the balls in push down and play.
 
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