everything I know about vegas (bca)

[mikeiniowa]

You are right- Caroline won 2 pro Q'rs-one had an 8 PLAYER FIELD and the other somewhere under 20. It was small enough that it was turned into a one day event as was the 8-Player one as well. Neither field had more than one player, if that, who had ever won a qualifier before. Very weak fields. I would not consider those wins any kind of indicators of some killer level. She plays no 8 ball or bar table pool ever and she didnt win the tournament also. I think that says more.

that is a little more info then we had. my wife thought she was great and played with a lot of class. we were hoping for her to snap it off. hope she does great in the pro events. good for her.

mike" the real estate tycoon"

 

[watchez]

Watchez
I dont believe that Justin's age or his ability to go to Vegas for 10 days has anything to do with his being eligible for an event.

While I am not sure if he should have been allowed or not have been allowed I have been able to read and hear about his exploits in pool for a couple years.

If your to good for one level then you should move on to the next level. Most players know where they honestly belong. What does Justin honestly think?

Every one does not deserve their "one year of glory".
Thats rediculous. If your of known ability it not right to let someone
have the advantage just so they can shine on their way up.

Like I said before I dont know if he should have been allowed or not. I dont know the exact protocal. But I do wonder a couple things.....

How many in the OPEN division are better then he is? How many would he not gamble with even?

People are in pool for different reasons and 85% will never reach the level
at which Justin is at right now. What do you propose for them to have their time in the spotlight?
If its not wrong what can make it more right.

Also how high do you have to finish in the Open event to be placed up in the Masters level?

I believe it is the top 10% are moved up to the Masters level. I could be wrong. There must be something more to it because it doesn't seem like the Masters field grows by 10% a year.

I am one of the 85% that will never reach Justin's level. I don't propose anything. Either I can get better or just go have a good time, or both. But I am going to stick with my belief that there is nothing wrong with giving good, young players one year to have their shot. If Justin wants to say what he thinks, he is free to say it himself. I am not going to speak for him.

The gambling issue is a non point. Most people in the Open wouldn't bet they are breathing. Andy asked the guy that got 4th in the Open last year if he wanted to 'match up'. The answer was an immediate no. By saying 'match up' Andy was conceding that he was a better player. The other player didn't even want to hear an offer. Just NO.

The best thing to me about the BCA is that, in your division of Open, Masters, etc, everyone plays even. No handicap. You either win or lose. If you win big, you move on. If you lose, come back next year & give it another try. Congrats to Justin & all the other winners.

 

[watchez]

What I was referring to was I was in a BCA meeting and Justin's name was being discussed by several league operators who were questioning his placement as a open player.

I was asked by a upper management BCA person regarding Justins capabilities at the beginning of the BCA event where I said that I felt he should be an OPEN player. His record, as far as I am concerned does not reflect master or Grand Master in which some people feel he is qualified to be so far. He is still young and a great player indeed. I have ALWAYS liked him and his Dad, good people. But as far as I was concerned, he had every right to be playing as a OPEN player. There are many other players who are OPEN players that shoud be masters, as we all know. And, for what ever reason, they are not. These player in which I refer to are far more seasoned than Justin. Justin, IS on his way to higher ranks, but as far as I was concerned, not this year.

I know Justin well. He has played in my events and has come to several Viking tournaments. He knows me as well. I saw him several times during the event. He has grown up quite a bit, but he still looks the same to me.

I hope this clarifies my ststement. I wish you would have brought it to my my attention during the event. And, for the record, I wouold have bought you that lousey meal and brought you to the front of the line. The service was awfuk at Katy's. I have never in my life stiffed as many wait persons. They all for the most part could give a chit about your meal, the service or the lenghtly wait in general to be seated or recieve your food.

Next time, let's go for a real steak, on me, ok!

Thanks for your reply & backing of basic BCA rules. I don't like 'gray' issues. Things should be black and white. If you win, top 10% or whatever, you move on. If you lose, you stay. I don't care if some Phillipino champion comes over here & takes the Open next year. Congrats to him.

After standing in the front of the line to be seated at Katy's for 15 minutes, the hostess came up & I simply asked 'How are you doing?' in case she didn't happen to see the us or the line behind us. Her response was 'Much better than you' and she walked away. That is when I 'took' the booth that was open.

 

[jingle]

Mike--Sounds like you have sour grapes & you finished 5-6 & got $2800. Amazing. A typical 'league' player's attitude & view in my opinion....always b-tch'n how things are unfair no matter how they finish. No one from St Louis did anything wrong. You think that Justin was sneaked into the tournament? He is two time Jr National Champion. He is known. And I take it you are referencing Andy Quinn, another former Jr National Champion that won the Open last year. Neither doesn't go around wearing disguises or lying about his name. But, here is where you & your attitude & most leagues are dead wrong and need to be adjusted. Why damn Justin for getting better? Most leagues, players are upset that they got raised in handicap, it gives them no incentive to get better. You are trying to do the same to players like Justin and their role in the BCA. If Justin was immediately made a Master as you think he should have, what does that do to the minds of other up & coming players? Should they think to slow down in their level of play? I say give players an incentive to get better. Let them have their year of glory. Watch him play, most people would probably learn something. Also, keep in mind that Justin is just 18 & do you think that as a 14, 15, 16 year old he had the funds to go to Vegas each year for 10 days, let alone think that he would have to have the funds for two due to the chaperone rule as a minor playing in the tournament? Maybe when he is some big real estate tycoon like yourself but right now he is just a teenager that plays pool & is getting by.

Justin had a match in the singles where a player was playing extremely slow to try to get him unglued. A few people told him to call a ref & put the player on a shot clock. I leaned over & told Justin, don't worry about it. If this guy feels that he has to try this to win, then he can't win. Same goes for people complaining about someone having a one time shot at the BCA title. The BCA lets all players that are not in the top 64 in the world play. Think about that. That means many an IPT player can play. Give them all their chance & move on. Don't try to get an upper hand off the felt.

Look on the bright side, you got 5th-6th; Justin got 2nd. Next year you can play in a tournament with him again as you will both be ranked as a Master player. Congrats on your finish & good luck. (FYI: Andy Quinn went 1 win 2 losses in this year's Master tournament).

Eydie: Please reply on what exactly you mean by I have heard the same thing about Justin. There is quite the controversy regarding him going on as I write this. I thought it best to give you a chance to clarify before I reply to that statement. I will let you know that reading stuff like this kept me from introducing myself in Vegas. I was there to have a good time not to hear people that are winning also whine. I am not sure that you even know what Justin looks like. FYI, we sat right next to you & your husband in Kady's, I believe Thursday at lunch. Yes, I actually spent money at the Riviera one time....and was sorry I did so. We had to wait 25 minutes to sit down when there were plenty of open tables. I finally pointed to a booth & told the host we were going to just sit there after being in the front of the line for 15 minutes. She still tried to argue with me, making no sense & I just moved past her. The service sucked, the food was worse.

Wow watchez, WHO is the one with sour grapes here? I didn't think Mike was b*tch*ng, just a little disappointed he got that close to the "grand prize" but fell short....what good player wouldn't/shouldn't feel that way?

 

[watchez]

Wow watchez, WHO is the one with sour grapes here? I didn't think Mike was b*tch*ng, just a little disappointed he got that close to the "grand prize" but fell short....what good player wouldn't/shouldn't feel that way?

Jingle...I think you need to have someone in Iowa explain to you what the term 'sour grapes' means. Then explain to me how in any way, shape or form I would fit in that category. Justin got to play in the Open, got 2nd. Justin was on the 1st place Masters team. Add it up. He couldn't have made much more in the tournaments than he did There is nothing sour about that. But you are right, if Mike is a good player he shouldn't be unhappy with coming up short to a slightly better player. Souinds like Mike & his wife did just fine out there themselves. Congrats.