Expanding Interest In Pool

A few years ago when the Flax Barn Sale moved up to Syracuse, my wife took me along on promise we would go to SCBilliards afterwards. I abandoned the mayhem of middle aged and older ladies ripping off tops and dropping trou to try on the merch from bins and heaps to wander the tired semi-abandoned mall. It struck me that there were 4 fitness/or dance centers, and 3 various type Martial arts storefronts in that single, medium sized, old style suburban complex.
Each one about the size of a small to medium pool hall.

It occurred to me that if pool could be promoted and sold like gym memberships as essential to the whole family, plus a meeting place for single young professionals, it might have a chance.

I live in a rural area so the following would not work for me. However, i have worked for extended periods in major metro areas. In such an environment, i'd be interested in clubbing with say 50 - 100 other interested responsible individuals to incorporate a private venue with key card access (to record who is in & out). Ideally it would grow, but i think it would take close to 100 to start to make it viable unless some were heavy hitters who willingly funded a large portion most years. I participate in a flying club started on similar model, and these are growing.

Perhaps regretfully, the above models would tend to eliminate many of the "colorful" habitues of the traditional pool scene of yore. That might or might not be good for the growth of the sport.

Various histories i have read seem to indicate that "Billiards" was a highly respectable skill & passtime from inception through the late 1920's. Locally, minister Thomas Beecher (brother of abolitionist preacher Harry) and Mark Twain were regular practitioners and famous promoters of the game. When the depression hit, pool halls became one of the few locations for penniliess indigents to hang out, attain bathroom facilities, sometimes sleep, and possibly grift a stake to move on or connect for whatever day work might be available.

"Respectable" people stopped attending, the average person still with a job didn't have time, the war came along and the postwar boom, and people lost the habit, while a generation grew up with a "bad" impression of pool halls.

Pool has another path to popular appeal - it might be the only sport where women can compete heads up with men, and potentially win. Or (sorry, Duchess! :^) ) "grandmothers" can beat youngsters in tournament play on occasion.

Random ruminations, if you made it this far, thanks for reading.
Flame suit on. :grin:

smt
 
Last edited:
Does surge charge for table time? Or it’s part of being a customer?

The coffee shop model has people buy a couple of small items and camp out all day. It seems successful as coffee shops are all over the place. I’m even part of a knitting/sewing circle that meets in one, once per week for a few hrs.

People come in all the time and it is a meeting place for small groups to do their hobbies/planning/study/etc.

So does surge operate more like a coffee house, and the pool is secondary? (Or even 3rd/4th on the list)?
Just like any other pool hall (maybe a little more expensive). Surge offers more atypical amenities - which attracts more atypical players.

pj
chgo

surge rates.jpg
 
Some cities have ordinances against under 18 customers.

Has anyone tried to get these laws abolished?
 
Some cities have ordinances against under 18 customers.

Has anyone tried to get these laws abolished?

Some cities have laws against pool halls period. I think the BCA gave some kind of support at one time towards eliminating unreasonable ordinances. Byrne has a whole chapter in one of his books on how to argue for a pool hall.
 
Some cities have ordinances against under 18 customers.

Has anyone tried to get these laws abolished?

Some cities have laws against pool halls period. I think the BCA gave some kind of support at one time towards eliminating unreasonable ordinances. Byrne has a whole chapter in one of his books on how to argue for a pool hall.
Clyde, NC doesn't like pool halls.

Chicago pool halls are 18+ after 9 pm.

The weirdest pool hall regulation here is they can't have window coverings. It only applies to pool halls - one room I go to has a bar/cafe on one side with pool tables in an adjoining room. Only the pool side has to keep its windows uncovered. Lord knows what depravities would be going on in there behind curtains.

Trouble, oh we got trouble,
Right here in River City!
With a capital "T"
That rhymes with "P"
And that stands for Pool.

pj
chgo
 
Last edited:
Just like any other pool hall (maybe a little more expensive). Surge offers more atypical amenities - which attracts more atypical players.

pj
chgo

View attachment 522626

You'd need a good day job to afford those rates for long!

I am the current owner of the new Salt City Billiards in Syracuse. I can tell you that we have kept pool going here by doing so much the work ourselves. Building out the room, maintaining the tables and just being smart about not overspending on unnecessary things. This has allowed us to keep our prices reasonable. We charge just $8 flat rate to play all day as long as you like. We have great equipment and a great room.

One can succeed opening a pool hall if there is a base of players. It takes time to build up the rooms recreational player base. Providing value for their money is paramount. The model of going too big often results in going home.

When we were opening I strongly considered opening a club type room, using key fab entry for members. I just don't think it works because somebody has to sign the lease and bear the liability of ownership. Plus if you reduce public access you limit the ability to grow the game and increase sales.
 
When we were opening I strongly considered opening a club type room, using key fab entry for members. I just don't think it works because somebody has to sign the lease and bear the liability of ownership. Plus if you reduce public access you limit the ability to grow the game and increase sales.

My proposition was essentially that it only works in a major metro area with enough players who are used to serving on other boards, as a corporation. There's something strong about working with other responsible board members with resources & interest to push a mission. The liability is assumed by the corporation; Directors and Officers Liability insurance is available if lack inhibits volunteerism. A budget is developed based on the board's interest & evolution, lease is planned and negotiated by the board, etc. This is not a profit model for any individual; though in an area with a large base it has the potential for reasonable club income and development through special events.

A dozen people could do it as a very private club. (9 member board, say; with 3 in waiting) A dozen people with intent could grow it through recruitment, introducing guests gradually, & the development of public outreach and education events.

If it were not possible to find a dozen core people who would and could follow through, the answer would be clear before money was spent.

You & I have had our dust-up and understand i am banned at SCB. However, that is kind of beside the point - i have appreciated and respected how you think about the business and what you've been able to do to promote it.

There's no particular ego in this thought process. The affiliations i support and have participated in growing on small local level are based around machining/making; at one time STEM, and around aviation.

smt
 
... When we were opening I strongly considered opening a club type room, using key fab entry for members. I just don't think it works because somebody has to sign the lease and bear the liability of ownership. Plus if you reduce public access you limit the ability to grow the game and increase sales.
I know of three billiard clubs that are running now in California, Minnesota and Wisconsin. They seem to be doing OK. A large factor seems to be finding low rent. They happen to be snooker and carom clubs, presumably because the players/members found they had no choice but to open a club to play the game they like. Most pool hall owners seem to think of non-pool tables as a bother and a waste of space and that is sometimes extended to 9-foot pool tables.

In each case I think there was one person who pushed to make it happen.
 
I know of three billiard clubs that are running now in California, Minnesota and Wisconsin. They seem to be doing OK. A large factor seems to be finding low rent. They happen to be snooker and carom clubs, presumably because the players/members found they had no choice but to open a club to play the game they like. Most pool hall owners seem to think of non-pool tables as a bother and a waste of space and that is sometimes extended to 9-foot pool tables.

In each case I think there was one person who pushed to make it happen.
There have been a handful of pool/billiards clubs that I've heard of (but never visited) in the Chicago area. I don't know if any are still around.

Then there are the rec rooms in senior centers, fraternal orders and the like - those are sorts of clubs I guess.

pj
chgo
 
... Then there are the rec rooms in senior centers, fraternal orders and the like - those are sorts of clubs I guess. ...
At one time many of the 3-cushion tournaments on the West Coast were at Elks' Clubs (a fraternal order). The problem is that such clubs are not very interesting to most young people these days and they are dying as their members die. Some of the members seemed to feel like, "This is my table and I don't want anyone else playing on it!" So now nobody plays on it. There were exceptions but that's generally how those clubs went.
 
Back
Top