I have a predator 314 shaft I would like to experiment with. I want to put a new ferrule on it to see how it would feel with a different ferrule. However, I know this would change the amount of deflection I would get out of the shaft. I would like some cue makers advice on which ferrule that I can use that would keep the shaft in the low deflection range and that would provide a good hit and keep clean. I would also like some advice on how to go about doing the job of putting it on. In terms of what dowel to use and glues and so on to get the job done. I have other predator shafts, I just want to experiment with this shaft.
Ferrule Advice
- Thread starter pool1027
- Start date
If you tenon the ferrule by plugging up the top, the shaft will become a high squirting shaft.
15-inch pro-taper and a heavy front=a lot of squirt.
15-inch pro-taper and a heavy front=a lot of squirt.
I'd suggest that you put a 314 Gen2 ferrule on it. It has everything you're asking for; good hit, stays clean & low deflection. Plus, you don't have to involve surgery to get it to fit.
I don't know of another ferrule material that meets your requirements.
Try to avoid messing with the tenon; the shaft will never play the same.
I don't know of another ferrule material that meets your requirements.
Try to avoid messing with the tenon; the shaft will never play the same.
I strongly suggest that you send it to one of the 8 locations of the Predator repair station network (which I and Seybert's are proud to be a part of.....hint,hint). However,your avatar doesn't give your location so there may be another repair station closer to you.
Kj
Well thats interesting I buy my stuff from Seybert's. I have seen your cues on their site. Do you also do their repair work. So how much will it cost to have the ferrule changed and I would like to have the shaft turned to 12.25 also. How is the balance on your cues is it forward, rear or even and is the weight adjustable with a weight bolt. I also like Bird's Eye maple the highly figured stuff that is why I am asking. Also when u order through Seyert's do they have your cues in stock or do u then have to make them. If you do what is the wait time.
Well thats interesting I buy my stuff from Seybert's. I have seen your cues on their site. Do you also do their repair work. So how much will it cost to have the ferrule changed and I would like to have the shaft turned to 12.25 also. How is the balance on your cues is it forward, rear or even and is the weight adjustable with a weight bolt. I also like Bird's Eye maple the highly figured stuff that is why I am asking. Also when u order through Seyert's do they have your cues in stock or do u then have to make them. If you do what is the wait time.
I've been doing all of Seybert's repair work for more than 7 yrs. now. Hooking my wagon to the Seybert's star has been one of my better moves and I've got a really great job. They display, promote and sell a lot of my cues for me, which frees me up to do repair work and build more cues. I'm a contractor, not a payroll employee but Seybert's is certainly my largest client. I enjoy the relationship with Predator as well.
I don't do pricing for Sey but if you call Rick, 1.877.314.2837 he can quote costs. Please let him know that we've spoken on this.
I deliberately set my cues with forward weighting and yes, they are wght. blt. adjustable. Part of that forward wghtng. is attributable to the length of the joint pin. I always have 1 3/8" exposed (1 3/16" length of thrd.) and there's at least 2" in the cue, sometimes more (sometimes less). It doesn't end there but you get the point. I don't recall my pin length being a concern on Pred. 10 pin shafts. When I build a Pred. shaft for one of my cues I build it from partial, not from a previously finished shaft. By the way, I have a limited stock of Gen1 314 partials that I've intended to save as an option on KJ cues.
At this moment I believe most all models in the '45' series are in stock. If a cue is not in stock, it's replacement is already in process. Completion time could be as little as 3 or 4 days or 3 or 4 wks. depending on what stage the cue is in. Repair work I do quickly, I don't rush building cues.
I don't do pricing for Sey but if you call Rick, 1.877.314.2837 he can quote costs. Please let him know that we've spoken on this.
I deliberately set my cues with forward weighting and yes, they are wght. blt. adjustable. Part of that forward wghtng. is attributable to the length of the joint pin. I always have 1 3/8" exposed (1 3/16" length of thrd.) and there's at least 2" in the cue, sometimes more (sometimes less). It doesn't end there but you get the point. I don't recall my pin length being a concern on Pred. 10 pin shafts. When I build a Pred. shaft for one of my cues I build it from partial, not from a previously finished shaft. By the way, I have a limited stock of Gen1 314 partials that I've intended to save as an option on KJ cues.
At this moment I believe most all models in the '45' series are in stock. If a cue is not in stock, it's replacement is already in process. Completion time could be as little as 3 or 4 days or 3 or 4 wks. depending on what stage the cue is in. Repair work I do quickly, I don't rush building cues.
kj
What kinda of hit does your wood to wood joint have. Is it soft, hard, is it stiff. Also when you hold your cues in your hand does the butt feel light because of the forward balance. Why do you most cue makers have their cues forward balanced. The reason I am asking is because when I am holding my cue in my hand I like to feel the weight of the cue in my grip hand. That is why I am asking how they feel when you grip them.
Mark Hinds
What kinda of hit does your wood to wood joint have. Is it soft, hard, is it stiff. Also when you hold your cues in your hand does the butt feel light because of the forward balance. Why do you most cue makers have their cues forward balanced. The reason I am asking is because when I am holding my cue in my hand I like to feel the weight of the cue in my grip hand. That is why I am asking how they feel when you grip them.
Mark Hinds
Well Mark,
Simply stated, I build my cues based on what I like as far as 'hit/feel'. I don't build cues in the hopes that they will have appeal to everyone in the world. I know what I like and my target audience are those that share my definition of 'hit'. To me, the hit is everything. All the inlays that you can fit in a cue won't help you make even one more ball. A well built instrument of performance will (and for a lot less money). At any given time, my personal playing cue is, for all practical purposes, a mirror image of the cues that I build for sale. At this point in time, I'm content to let GOD do my inlay work while I focus on performance. I've been blessed with some very beautiful woods wouldn't you agree? My task is to utilize what I've been given to it's greatest end result and I DO love to display HIS work.
Since the hit is paramount, I prefer wood/wood with big pin and phenolic collars and phenolic insert in the shaft, forward weighting with a stiff-hit shaft that compliments the overall flexibility of the entire cue. Please bare in mind that the joint of the cue is a flex point and should flex in unison with the rest of the cue, no more & no less. Ideally, when standing the cue on end (bumper down) and gripped firmly at the top of the shaft and imparting a side-load on the cue by flexing the wrist, the cue should bow naturally in a true parabolic curve, diminishing in curve the further down the cue that you look due only to the increasing diameter of taper.
'A' joint construction is critical and without going too deeply into the methods that I have developed for myself over a span of 20 yrs. I can tell you that there is wght. just ahead of where your grip hand would be. I feel that it is much more desirable to have the wght. in your hand where you can control it rather than having it hang in space 1 1/2 ft. behind you. It's about proper balance and ease of maintaining good stroke. Improper balance can greatly hinder an otherwise decent stroke.
I hope that I've answered your questions to your satisfaction and should you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to ask. KJ
PS. THANK YOU for your interest in my cues.
Simply stated, I build my cues based on what I like as far as 'hit/feel'. I don't build cues in the hopes that they will have appeal to everyone in the world. I know what I like and my target audience are those that share my definition of 'hit'. To me, the hit is everything. All the inlays that you can fit in a cue won't help you make even one more ball. A well built instrument of performance will (and for a lot less money). At any given time, my personal playing cue is, for all practical purposes, a mirror image of the cues that I build for sale. At this point in time, I'm content to let GOD do my inlay work while I focus on performance. I've been blessed with some very beautiful woods wouldn't you agree? My task is to utilize what I've been given to it's greatest end result and I DO love to display HIS work.
Since the hit is paramount, I prefer wood/wood with big pin and phenolic collars and phenolic insert in the shaft, forward weighting with a stiff-hit shaft that compliments the overall flexibility of the entire cue. Please bare in mind that the joint of the cue is a flex point and should flex in unison with the rest of the cue, no more & no less. Ideally, when standing the cue on end (bumper down) and gripped firmly at the top of the shaft and imparting a side-load on the cue by flexing the wrist, the cue should bow naturally in a true parabolic curve, diminishing in curve the further down the cue that you look due only to the increasing diameter of taper.
'A' joint construction is critical and without going too deeply into the methods that I have developed for myself over a span of 20 yrs. I can tell you that there is wght. just ahead of where your grip hand would be. I feel that it is much more desirable to have the wght. in your hand where you can control it rather than having it hang in space 1 1/2 ft. behind you. It's about proper balance and ease of maintaining good stroke. Improper balance can greatly hinder an otherwise decent stroke.
I hope that I've answered your questions to your satisfaction and should you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to ask. KJ
PS. THANK YOU for your interest in my cues.
Last edited:
My answer could only be viewed as subjective (and maybe biased). There are a lot of variables to be considered here. What model cue are you looking at? Where do you normally grip the cue? What wght. cue do you favor? It may be simpler just to state a preferred bal. point. Cue wght. could be viewed irrelevant and the number itself (in inches) would tell you if it's forward or rearward wghted. Some will tell you that Predator shafts are on the light side but I disagree as I've seen partials (no insert or ring-work) over 4oz. Shaft length is another variable.
Kj
I like a 19oz cue and I am playing with a Joss cue. I tend to grip my cue a couple of inches from the end of the butt. I am currently playing with a predator z2 shaft. I had modified the taper a bit on the z2 because I like the 11.75 tip but the taper was too big by the joint of the shaft. So I put it on a lathe and made it smaller. Like i said I don't like to feel a cue in my hand and all the weight seems to forward. The model cues I was looking at was the 45-1 or 45-2. Is it possible to get a 45-2 with a phenolic joint instead of the stainless steel.
I like a 19oz cue and I am playing with a Joss cue. I tend to grip my cue a couple of inches from the end of the butt. I am currently playing with a predator z2 shaft. I had modified the taper a bit on the z2 because I like the 11.75 tip but the taper was too big by the joint of the shaft. So I put it on a lathe and made it smaller. Like i said I don't like to feel a cue in my hand and all the weight seems to forward. The model cues I was looking at was the 45-1 or 45-2. Is it possible to get a 45-2 with a phenolic joint instead of the stainless steel.
Hi Mark,
Well, here's the kicker. The 45-1 & 45-2 are the same cue with one exception. The 45-1 has a phenolic collar set while the 45-2 has a stl jnt. Other than that, they're the same cue. Now if you like the cue but you want the wrap rings and the phenolic collar, that would be the 45-3. This cue however features a solid burl butt-sleeve and signature ring-work at all locations. 19oz is no problem and wrap color of your choice is no additional charge. Let me know your thoughts. KJ
Well, here's the kicker. The 45-1 & 45-2 are the same cue with one exception. The 45-1 has a phenolic collar set while the 45-2 has a stl jnt. Other than that, they're the same cue. Now if you like the cue but you want the wrap rings and the phenolic collar, that would be the 45-3. This cue however features a solid burl butt-sleeve and signature ring-work at all locations. 19oz is no problem and wrap color of your choice is no additional charge. Let me know your thoughts. KJ
Hi Mark,
I got a minute to check inventory and here's what I've got ready to go right now. I've got two 45-1 & two 45-2 in process that could be done in 2 to 3 wks.
The two cues with wrap are 45-3s and are $435. These have the 'wrap' rings that you asked about and the solid burl butt-sleeve. Solid, meaning uninterrupted by design.
The wrapless cue w/Curly handle & bocote forearm is not yet part of any series and could be considered 1 of 1. It's $400.
If one of these meets your liking then we're good to go. If they give you ideas of something you'd like done differently, I'm very willing to hear them. Matching Predator shafts are available for any of my cues. Thanx Much, KJ
I got a minute to check inventory and here's what I've got ready to go right now. I've got two 45-1 & two 45-2 in process that could be done in 2 to 3 wks.
The two cues with wrap are 45-3s and are $435. These have the 'wrap' rings that you asked about and the solid burl butt-sleeve. Solid, meaning uninterrupted by design.
The wrapless cue w/Curly handle & bocote forearm is not yet part of any series and could be considered 1 of 1. It's $400.
If one of these meets your liking then we're good to go. If they give you ideas of something you'd like done differently, I'm very willing to hear them. Matching Predator shafts are available for any of my cues. Thanx Much, KJ
Last edited:
Cue Thoughts
Hi KJ
First of all your cues look really nice with the highly figured woods and the rings thanks for the pictures. They gave me a better idea of how they look in reality. After looking at the total cost of the cue (The 45-3) plus the predator shaft. The cost of everything is a bit high for me right now as the cost is double in my currency, which is about $12-1400.00. So I have to wait a couple months. I would also like to ask you a few more questions. I would like your thoughts on what length of cue, shaft would be a good fit for a person. One cue maker I asked told me a 58" inch and I would like your thoughts on that.
Hi KJ
First of all your cues look really nice with the highly figured woods and the rings thanks for the pictures. They gave me a better idea of how they look in reality. After looking at the total cost of the cue (The 45-3) plus the predator shaft. The cost of everything is a bit high for me right now as the cost is double in my currency, which is about $12-1400.00. So I have to wait a couple months. I would also like to ask you a few more questions. I would like your thoughts on what length of cue, shaft would be a good fit for a person. One cue maker I asked told me a 58" inch and I would like your thoughts on that.
Thank you for your opinions of my cues. At least the pics are free.
Something that I have been doing lately is offering a shaft option. Quite a few of my buyers have requested Predator shafts for their new cue and some would prefer to have the Predator shaft be the only shaft with the cue. In these cases, I keep the original shaft, give the buyer a credit for me keeping the shaft and then just charge the additional for the Predator shaft.
For example : The cue you are interested in is $435. Less the credit for my keeping the original shaft ($85.) and the cue is now $350 without shaft. Now add the cost of a Predator shaft ($210 for a 314-2 or $225 for a Z-2) and now you are into the cue you want with the shaft you want for $560 to $575. Of course, the Predator shaft will have matching ring-work and be perfectly mated to the cue.
Cue length is generally relative to a person's height. In the past 50 yrs., standard cue length has grown from 56/57" to today's standard length of 58". My cues are in the 59" range because I use a 30" shaft as standard. I'm 6 ft. tall and play a 59 1/2" long cue. However, that may not be right for everyone so I build the shaft according to the buyers desired length. There is no additional charge for this. There is also no additional charge for the wght. adjustment or the color of linen wrap you want.
As far as the currency exchange, given the spiraling decline in the value of the US dollar, your wait may be shorter than you think. Thank you again for providing me an opportunity to present my offerings. KJ
Something that I have been doing lately is offering a shaft option. Quite a few of my buyers have requested Predator shafts for their new cue and some would prefer to have the Predator shaft be the only shaft with the cue. In these cases, I keep the original shaft, give the buyer a credit for me keeping the shaft and then just charge the additional for the Predator shaft.
For example : The cue you are interested in is $435. Less the credit for my keeping the original shaft ($85.) and the cue is now $350 without shaft. Now add the cost of a Predator shaft ($210 for a 314-2 or $225 for a Z-2) and now you are into the cue you want with the shaft you want for $560 to $575. Of course, the Predator shaft will have matching ring-work and be perfectly mated to the cue.
Cue length is generally relative to a person's height. In the past 50 yrs., standard cue length has grown from 56/57" to today's standard length of 58". My cues are in the 59" range because I use a 30" shaft as standard. I'm 6 ft. tall and play a 59 1/2" long cue. However, that may not be right for everyone so I build the shaft according to the buyers desired length. There is no additional charge for this. There is also no additional charge for the wght. adjustment or the color of linen wrap you want.
As far as the currency exchange, given the spiraling decline in the value of the US dollar, your wait may be shorter than you think. Thank you again for providing me an opportunity to present my offerings. KJ
I'd suggest the length that feels right to you. I don't pretend to have the secret formula to determine what length is right for everyone, though some do. Everyone is different so only you can determine what is right for you. I'd be very skeptical of anyone telling you what you want or what's right for you because that is only their opinion, not your's. When you decide what you want, we can proceed.
The bocote/curly is a built cue. I'm not changing it. I'm very capable of building any cue you want as soon as YOU decide what that is. Please don't ask me to tell you what you want. If you want to think of me as a 'hard-ass', that's fine. My first obligation to you is to tell you the truth. Unfortunately, that's not always as pretty as the reader would like.
The bocote/curly is a built cue. I'm not changing it. I'm very capable of building any cue you want as soon as YOU decide what that is. Please don't ask me to tell you what you want. If you want to think of me as a 'hard-ass', that's fine. My first obligation to you is to tell you the truth. Unfortunately, that's not always as pretty as the reader would like.