finding the degree of your eye dominance

BilliardsAbout

BondFanEvents.com
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so today i went to the ophthalmologist and he did several tests on both of my eyes. he said first of all that my eyes were very healthy, (no myopia,astigmatism etc) and that both of my eyes have almost equal dominance. my left eye is just slightly more dominant but he said the difference is so small that i might as well play with the cue between both eyes.

from my experience playing center-chin and playing slightly under my left eye makes a big difference, like i said in the beginning of the thread i play way more consistently under the left eye ( which i've been playing for about 2 months now since changing from center-chin). although the answer seems obvious, what do you guys think i should do?
If you've tried under each eye, have you tried to locate your vision center, which for nearly all players is not directly under an eye but somewhere else on their face?
 
Maybe a youtuber can tackle this one and go to a tournament and ask the players if they aim down the cue. My guess is, that most players will give them a puzzled look and say, 'of course'.

The trick would be to measure them without asking. Since what players think that they are doing and what they are doing can differ a lot. It maybe feels like they are sighting down the cue but maybe the eye aligns in different ways you cant really know from what they are saying. Thats why I don't really care what books and other instruction says because it is mostly anecdotal and not measured.

I came up with a simple test, set up a single shot somewhere on the table and mark the positions of the balls. Then set a camera on the cueball ghost ball line and ask the player to shoot the shot with straight ball, inside and outside spin. Try to do it with really clean and new balls so that the player doesn't have to account for a lot of throw.

If the eyes are in the same spot on all three shots they align with the balls and if the eyes move around they align with the cue or something else. Probably both methods are false and there is something completely different happening with how the eyes work. Convergence, foveal vision and stereopsis don't really align with the notion that we are seeing lines..
 

WobblyStroke

Well-known member
The trick would be to measure them without asking. Since what players think that they are doing and what they are doing can differ a lot. It maybe feels like they are sighting down the cue but maybe the eye aligns in different ways you cant really know from what they are saying. Thats why I don't really care what books and other instruction says because it is mostly anecdotal and not measured.

I came up with a simple test, set up a single shot somewhere on the table and mark the positions of the balls. Then set a camera on the cueball ghost ball line and ask the player to shoot the shot with straight ball, inside and outside spin. Try to do it with really clean and new balls so that the player doesn't have to account for a lot of throw.

If the eyes are in the same spot on all three shots they align with the balls and if the eyes move around they align with the cue or something else. Probably both methods are false and there is something completely different happening with how the eyes work. Convergence, foveal vision and stereopsis don't really align with the notion that we are seeing lines..
Interesting point on players not even doing what they think they do. A demonstration by Tor Lowry comes to mind... to demo how 'automatic' his aiming had gotten, he shot a video where he walked up to shots with the cue drawn back into his bridge and he never allowed himself to use the cue for sighting or even cueing up to which part of the CB he will hit. He ran out no problem. Would be interesting where his eyes are.
 
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z0nt0n3r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If you've tried under each eye, have you tried to locate your vision center, which for nearly all players is not directly under an eye but somewhere else on their face?
yes i just mentioned in the beginning of this thread that if i play center-chin (under my vision center), i play very inconsistently and i cue across the ball very often
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
yes i just mentioned in the beginning of this thread that if i play center-chin (under my vision center), i play very inconsistently and i cue across the ball very often
Are you sure that's your vision center? It isn't always (maybe not even often) centered - it just means "where straight looks straight".

pj
chgo
 
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WobblyStroke

Well-known member
yes, i've checked all that stuff
then there are really only two opyions...
1. you did it wrong and you dont actually see str8 as str8 where u thought causing u to swipe.

2. you did it right but setting up in that way throws off ur alignment and makes u cue crooked and swipe across.
 

bbb

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
i dont understand why i dont see those 2 lines as straight. i am viewing them with my vision center i am sure....😂
straight lines optical illusion.png
 

BilliardsAbout

BondFanEvents.com
Silver Member
yes i just mentioned in the beginning of this thread that if i play center-chin (under my vision center), i play very inconsistently and i cue across the ball very often
Sorry I missed seeing that. Perhaps it has to do with degree of head rotation. Moving one foot ahead of the other tends to rotate our head as our trunk turns relative to the shot line (unless we forcibly twist our head to be straight ahead.

Post a video here and I'd be happy to make suggestions for improvement.
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
i dont understand why i dont see those 2 lines as straight. i am viewing them with my vision center i am sure....😂
View attachment 721582
Actually, if you sight along the two lines like sighting along your cue (rather than “through” them like here), they look straight. Vision center even “fixes” optical illusions!

pj
chgo
 
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z0nt0n3r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
then there are really only two opyions...
1. you did it wrong and you dont actually see str8 as str8 where u thought causing u to swipe.

2. you did it right but setting up in that way throws off ur alignment and makes u cue crooked and swipe across.
it's possible that i did it wrong since there are optical illusions created by the cue,balls and pocket but i have tested it many times carefully so i don't think it's very likely.
 
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z0nt0n3r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Slightly under your left eye sounds right.
fran, as i said i play more consistently under my left eye, but sometimes i lose the correct line of aim as i'm getting down on the shot when i try to set up that way. i remember you mentioning in one of your posts that as you change the cue alignment from center-chin towards one of your eyes, it's more difficult to perceive where true center ball actually is so you have to make some sort of aiming adjustments and i think this is what is happening.

will this problem resolve on it's own over time after a lot of practice or should i change something in my stance?
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
fran,
i remember you mentioning in one of your posts that as you change the cue alignment from center-chin towards one of your eyes, it's more difficult to perceive where true center ball actually is so you have to make some sort of aiming adjustments
I don’t know if Fran said that, but it’s not true unless you’re moving the cue away from your “vision center”, which is not necessarily (maybe not even usually) centered between your eyes. The cue often has to be off-center in order to see accurately when it’s pointed at CB center.

pj
chgo
 

SeniorTom

Well-known member
I am dominantly right handed in everything I do, but am left eye dominant. I shoot pool using my left eye, and I shoot pistol and rifle likewise. I used to pitch Hardball and could throw the ball in the 93 mph, but with my left hand I'm lucky to make 20 mph.
 

z0nt0n3r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don’t know if Fran said that, but it’s not true unless you’re moving the cue away from your “vision center”, which is not necessarily (maybe not even usually) centered between your eyes. The cue often has to be off-center in order to see accurately when it’s pointed at CB center.

pj
chgo

I don’t know if Fran said that, but it’s not true unless you’re moving the cue away from your “vision center”, which is not necessarily (maybe not even usually) centered between your eyes. The cue often has to be off-center in order to see accurately when it’s pointed at CB center.

pj
chgo
"The farther out on your dominant eye that you place your cue, the less accurate you will be in perceiving center ball, and the bigger the adjustment" actually she said this in the beginning of the thread, she didn't say it exactly as i did but it was something similar.
 

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
fran, as i said i play more consistently under my left eye, but sometimes i lose the correct line of aim as i'm getting down on the shot when i try to set up that way. i remember you mentioning in one of your posts that as you change the cue alignment from center-chin towards one of your eyes, it's more difficult to perceive where true center ball actually is so you have to make some sort of aiming adjustments and i think this is what is happening.

will this problem resolve on it's own over time after a lot of practice or should i change something in my stance?
Yes, you may have to make some slight aim adjustments, but not much if it's only slightly under your left eye, but you also have to have your stance right. They go together, so you will have to work on both together. Maybe you were falling out of your stance sometimes which could be why things didn't look right. I think it's time to take a break from reading the different opinions and start working it out on your own. Trust yourself. I think you know what you need to do now.
 
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WobblyStroke

Well-known member
it's possible that i did it wrong since there are optical illusions created by the cue,balls and pocket but i have tested it many times carefully so i don't think it's very likely.
Well if you don't see straight as straight you either did it wrong or the test simply didn't work as it should for you.

As far as learning to perceive center ball from a new head position, one thing you can try is to work into it from both sides. Basically you set up on the headstring and hit along it into the cushion. You start where you know you are right of center and let the rebound angle of the cueball confirm that. Then you hit where you know you are left of center. Repeat but be less right/left. After a few rounds of this you will be hitting center. Over time, where you see center will be natural but this little touch of spin exercise may expedite the process a bit.
 
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z0nt0n3r

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yes, you may have to make some slight aim adjustments, but not much if it's only slightly under your left eye, but you also have to have your stance right. They go together, so you will have to work on both together. Maybe you were falling out of your stance sometimes which could be why things didn't look right. I think it's time to take a break from reading the different opinions and start working it out on your own. Trust yourself. I think you know what you need to do now.
is it true that if you play with your inside eye (cross-eye dominant), that you need to place more of the heel of the back foot on the line of aim and if you play with your outside eye you need to place more of your toe on the line?i place the middle of my back foot and i'm cross eye dominant but i don't know if it would improve that problem if i changed my back foot position.
maybe i just need to just practice and trust the process as you said.
 

bbb

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
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watch neil robertson stance
very cross eyed dominant
watch his stance and trumps not as severely cross eyed dominant but it seems the cue is to the right of his nose(trump)
........................
 

FranCrimi

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
is it true that if you play with your inside eye (cross-eye dominant), that you need to place more of the heel of the back foot on the line of aim and if you play with your outside eye you need to place more of your toe on the line?i place the middle of my back foot and i'm cross eye dominant but i don't know if it would improve that problem if i changed my back foot position.
maybe i just need to just practice and trust the process as you said.
With a cross dominant eye you need to face your pool cue a little more. This helps you to allow for arm swing room and also to help get the other side of your head over the line of the shot. So it's actually the opposite of what you wrote --- more like the toe on the line of the shot with a cross dominant eye. But it's not just that --- because if you turn a bit more towards your pool cue (just a bit because it's not a strong cross dominant eye), you will also be adjusting your front foot slightly up and towards your cue. So the back foot moves slightly away from the line of the shot and the front foot moves slightly towards it.

So whoever told you the opposite, don't trust them. (If it was you, don't trust yourself. Haha)
 
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