GC 1 with swayback

T

tjohnson

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Had my GC 1 installed about a month ago and after taking my Starret level around the table, it has confirmed what the ball trajectories seem to be showing: the Brunstone is swaybacked (i.e sagging in the middle, higher on the sides). I am 99% sure that the mechanic simply laid the Brunstone on top of the leveled base and did not shim the slabs at all. From reading the forum here's what I think I already know:

1. Brunstone is susceptible to swayback and shimming it flat is tough because it's brittle and likely to break.

2. If shimming it, frame needs reinforcing (as shown in this thread)

3. New slates may be the only solution (and since I paid $500 for the table, not out of the question).

So, that said, here are my questions:

1. Is it possible to get out ANY swayback in Brunstone via shimming without cracking it?

2. If shimming is ok, can shims go between the wooden frame on the bottom of the brunstone and the base?

Mechanic is coming back out, and I don't want him to make the table any worse. I'm not super confident he has the skills/experience to know the best solution.


thanks!
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
tjohnson said:
Had my GC 1 installed about a month ago and after taking my Starret level around the table, it has confirmed what the ball trajectories seem to be showing: the Brunstone is swaybacked (i.e sagging in the middle, higher on the sides). I am 99% sure that the mechanic simply laid the Brunstone on top of the leveled base and did not shim the slabs at all. From reading the forum here's what I think I already know:

1. Brunstone is susceptible to swayback and shimming it flat is tough because it's brittle and likely to break.

2. If shimming it, frame needs reinforcing (as shown in this thread)

3. New slates may be the only solution (and since I paid $500 for the table, not out of the question).

So, that said, here are my questions:

1. Is it possible to get out ANY swayback in Brunstone via shimming without cracking it?

2. If shimming is ok, can shims go between the wooden frame on the bottom of the brunstone and the base?

Mechanic is coming back out, and I don't want him to make the table any worse. I'm not super confident he has the skills/experience to know the best solution.


thanks!
Click to expand...
Yes, Brunstone is very brittle, if it's swayback side to side you can shim a little bit of it out, but you're not going to flex the Brunstone very much before it cracks I guarantee it. I've even gone so far as to drill 1/8" holes in straight lines down the middle of the Brunstone in order to control the cracks to be where I wanted them to be so that I could at least take the wider swayback out and limit it to a smaller area, then super glue the breaks and bondo the crack and holes back in again. Real slate will flex, Brunstone won't that's the difference between the two playing surfaces. So, keep that in mind when everyone claims the GC1's were the best built GC's Brunswick ever built;)
 
T

tjohnson

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
realkingcobra said:
Yes, Brunstone is very brittle, if it's swayback side to side you can shim a little bit of it out, but you're not going to flex the Brunstone very much before it cracks I guarantee it.
Click to expand...

Good to know. I think I'll experiment with gentle shimming, get a little out, and live with it until I upgrade or replace slates.

When shimming, do the shims go between the wooden slate frame and the base?

thanks
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
tjohnson said:
Good to know. I think I'll experiment with gentle shimming, get a little out, and live with it until I upgrade or replace slates.

When shimming, do the shims go between the wooden slate frame and the base?

thanks
Click to expand...

Yes, between the slate backing and the 2"x4" framing, but when you're shiming the ends of the slate, spread out the shims, meaning 1 dead center, then another 1 about 3" left and another 1 about 3" to the right of the one right in the center, that way you're spreading out the lifting of the slate instead of stressing it from just one spot.
 
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fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
Hey Glen, where can us GC owners get new slate from for our GCs? I have heard of numbers of $500.00-$700.00 for new slate depending on freight which seems reasonable, but maybe not true either.
 
T

tjohnson

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was quoted $750 + $250 shipping for a new set of ready-to-install slates from Classic Billiards. Cheaper would be nice :)
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
fastone371 said:
Hey Glen, where can us GC owners get new slate from for our GCs? I have heard of numbers of $500.00-$700.00 for new slate depending on freight which seems reasonable, but maybe not true either.
Click to expand...

I don't have a clue anymore, I haven't bought slate in almost 16 years, and when I did it was through Imperial Billiards.

Glen
 
fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
realkingcobra said:
I don't have a clue anymore, I haven't bought slate in almost 16 years, and when I did it was through Imperial Billiards.

Thanks Glen and everyone else who may be able to offer ideas. Its not something I really need but during a future recover it is something I may consider, I have already had problems with the Brunstone bowing, although if I can get a qualified mechanic to my area he can probably sort it out much better than I can.
Click to expand...
 
T

tjohnson

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Apocalypse2014 said:
I just purchased a GC1 and found out it was brunstone. should I be upset?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily, because:

1. Not all brunstone is swaybacked.
2. Even if it is you MIGHT be able to shim it out well enough.
3. Depending on how much you paid for the table, you can always replace the slates.

My experience so far has taught me that anyone buying a GC 1 should check for swayback and if present, factor new slates into the cost of the table. I paid $500 for my GC 1 so if I need new slates, I'm in for $1500 total which for a nice GC 1 with brand new slates seems ok.
 
magnetardo

magnetardo

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
fastone371 said:
Hey Glen, where can us GC owners get new slate from for our GCs? I have heard of numbers of $500.00-$700.00 for new slate depending on freight which seems reasonable, but maybe not true either.
Click to expand...

Jerimy Chambers has sets of new old stock Gold Crown slates from the '70's
Last I heard he was charging $4-500 a set, plus delivery or freight. He's located in the
SW burbs of Chicago, search his name on this site, you'll see he's highly
recommended, top notch mechanic and great guy to boot. You can reach him at 708-574-9888
 
fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
I had about 2 playing cards thickness of swayback to get out of my GC with Brunstone. I think I caused the problem by not properly supporting the "slate" when I set the table up, I corrected it about 6 months ago and seems to be staying flat now. The balls would roll away from the rails slightly on a slow roll lengthwise down the table. It was barely noticeable, I probably could have left well enough alone but I saw it happen a couple times, had to investigate, and after that I knew I had to fix it. Hopefully I can get a decent mechanic up here in the next year or so to recover table again and double check the work I did. I tried to find someone to recover the bed after I had the rails modified but I couldn't find anyone that I trusted to do a decent job so I was forced to stumble thru it myself.
 
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