gluing veneer stacks

R

rhncue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When gluing veneer stacks up I normally use West systems and the 205 hardener. I've had no problems with this mixture but I've been reading that some are using the 208 hardener as it is thinner so can be absorbed better. I tried this yesterday and after dry I cut into strips and started routing the 90 deg V. On the third strip just before the V was finished a veneer came loose near the end. I still had more veneer glued up so I just cut another strip but I got to thinking about it and checked the rest of the stacks that were already finished. I found that in a number of places they were not sufficiently glued together. Even if these stacks held up over the years I'm pretty sure there would be buzzes taking place.

I had mixed up a double batch of the epoxy so I really put quite a bit on each veneer so it wasn't lacking in glue before the compression and drying. Has anyone else observed this on their veneer glue ups? I glued up a second set of veneers last night using the 205 which I should be able to use here shortly. Just something to look out for.

Dick
 
rhncue said:
When gluing veneer stacks up I normally use West systems and the 205 hardener. I've had no problems with this mixture but I've been reading that some are using the 208 hardener as it is thinner so can be absorbed better. I tried this yesterday and after dry I cut into strips and started routing the 90 deg V. On the third strip just before the V was finished a veneer came loose near the end. I still had more veneer glued up so I just cut another strip but I got to thinking about it and checked the rest of the stacks that were already finished. I found that in a number of places they were not sufficiently glued together. Even if these stacks held up over the years I'm pretty sure there would be buzzes taking place.

I had mixed up a double batch of the epoxy so I really put quite a bit on each veneer so it wasn't lacking in glue before the compression and drying. Has anyone else observed this on their veneer glue ups? I glued up a second set of veneers last night using the 205 which I should be able to use here shortly. Just something to look out for.

Dick
Click to expand...

Thanks for your advice, Dick...

I was just wondering if wood glue would not do the job just aswell for veneers? If not, why not?

Greetz,

Tom Penrose
 
rhncue said:
When gluing veneer stacks up I normally use West systems and the 205 hardener. I've had no problems with this mixture but I've been reading that some are using the 208 hardener as it is thinner so can be absorbed better. I tried this yesterday and after dry I cut into strips and started routing the 90 deg V. On the third strip just before the V was finished a veneer came loose near the end. I still had more veneer glued up so I just cut another strip but I got to thinking about it and checked the rest of the stacks that were already finished. I found that in a number of places they were not sufficiently glued together. Even if these stacks held up over the years I'm pretty sure there would be buzzes taking place.

I had mixed up a double batch of the epoxy so I really put quite a bit on each veneer so it wasn't lacking in glue before the compression and drying. Has anyone else observed this on their veneer glue ups? I glued up a second set of veneers last night using the 205 which I should be able to use here shortly. Just something to look out for.

Dick
Click to expand...

How much pressure do you use? With epoxy you don't want to crank down on anything. If you go too tight you will squeeze it out too much. With wood type glues you want to crank the pressure up. This is why epoxy should always be used in areas like the A joint. Veneer stacks use wood glue.
 
Craig Fales said:
How much pressure do you use? With epoxy you don't want to crank down on anything. If you go too tight you will squeeze it out too much. With wood type glues you want to crank the pressure up. This is why epoxy should always be used in areas like the A joint. Veneer stacks use wood glue.
Click to expand...

I've used Elmer's and Titebond 1 a number of times in the past with less than stellar success. They both curled the veneers after drying and removing from the press so they had to be used almost immediately before the curling could take effect but the main drawback is that there is so much color cross contamination between the different veneers and the prong wood as the veneers grain is still open. The Epoxy soaks in some and seals the veneers so that when sanding the cue before finish the veneers stay bright. That has always been the main reason for it's use as it seals the veneers very well.

As far as how much pressure, well actually I can't say. I have two, one inch thick pieces of pressed board that has 6 3/8 bolts around it's circumference which I tighten down evenly and then I put the whole thing in a hydraulic press and squeeze the center. The veneer is wrapped in wax paper and there was very little squeeze out left on the paper. Many of these dry veneer areas were actually in the middle of the veneer stack. Maybe a little later I can go back and take some close up pictures of the faulted stack and the new one That I just cut up and is back to being perfect.

The main reason for me posting this stuff was because I was under the impression the thinner hardener was supposed to do a better job but in my case it did much worse. It is more of a warning for people to check their veneer stacks before gluing into the prong where it would be to late.

Dick
 
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