Green Fees?

Would you play in weekly tournament with Green Fees?

  • Yes

    Votes: 60 80.0%

  • No

    Votes: 15 20.0%
  • Total voters
    75
  • Poll closed .
Tom In Cincy

Tom In Cincy

AKA SactownTom
Silver Member
Will you play in a weekly tournament with a 10% of the entry fee going to Green fees?
That 10% will also be used to supplement the Added weekly money.

It will be a DE race to 5w/3L.
 
If the room didn't get some money to turn on the lights and pay the bills, how would this tourney end up being a weekly thing without greens fees?? Surely not on snickers bars and diet coke. :)

I don't play in tournaments so I didn't want a false negative listed, so I didn't vote.

I would pay triple greens fees to turn the damned juke box off so my teeth would stop rattling and I could think. Then I might actually go to a pool room.
 
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I do play in tournaments that have green fees, but it really pisses me off when at one of the places we play out of charges us green fees !!! Because he heard we pay green fees at other tournaments, it is supposedly to take care of the cloth and tables and then the owner does nothing with it for years and the tables play like shit now ... So we stopped haveing them there and the owner ask why ????:confused: So I tell him everytime and he just shruggs it off. It's not like he doesn't make enough off all the alcohol and food he sells .So I refuse to play there I dont even play home league matches If they dont need me...<<ED
 
The situation is similar to when I spend money (at the bank).
My first question is always is the investment insured and who is it insured by. If they refer to anybody other than the FDIC the investment is too risky for me. The second question I ask is if I need my money are there penalties for early withdrawal. This narrows downs the type of investment I can make. There is not much to it after that.

The relation to green fees is lottery money is controlled by house rules. Are you the house or are you the ticket holder.

I used to sign up for local tournaments and league matches just to see if the players would play (defensively) or not. Even the top prospects played defensively. Its the same with money spend it on a sure thing.
 
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What you are suggesting is that the players who are already paying an entry fee also provide added money. I don't agree with this thinking.

In my experience, added money is typically offered by the establishment as an incentive to players to come and play and spend their money for food and drink. The proceeds from a "greens fee" goes to the establishment and in return, the establishment opens the tables or does not charge for the table time.

I know times are tough for bars and pool halls, but I don't think the players will like this type of "added" money.

One of our local bar proposed a surcharge paid by tournament players to go toward recovering the tables. Players offered to stop attending the tournament if it was implemented, the thinking being that all the customers of the bar use the tables and more than likely, it's those other players who cause the damage to the cloth anyway. The surcharge was quickly forgotten about.
 
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Never have thought Greens Fees were a good idea. That thought hasnt changed.

I would be more in favor of a 10-25cent increase in each transaction for the year and designate that money for tournaments.

Or make a game (maybe like the one were you drop a quater into water to
ring a shot glass). Place on checkout counter. Ring it and get 50% or 100% off. Could make it a buck to try if not a quarter would probably work. Out a quarter if you miss :rolleyes: Designate that money to bring a regional tour or some pros in for a tournament.
50 quarters a week 12.50
52 weeks 650
Not a bad way to help fund. I dont think even raising it to .50 would decrease your attempts by half. so
35 quarters a week 17.50
52 weeks 910
Almost two 500 added events


On a different note I have no problem at all with part of the money being taken out for a grand finale type event after a qualifying period.
 
I have no problem paying greens fees for any type of tournament as long as everyone knows they are being deducted from the entry fee. There are times when TD's and room owners seem to keep the greens fees a big secret and that leads to problems.
 
I'm confused. The room wants to hold back 10% from entry fees to help pay added money? Why not just reduce the added money by 10%?
Seems all they are doing is shuffling money around.
ie, room adds $50 to the pot, but takes $25 in green fees. Why not just add $25 and not charge green fees?

Steve
 
I have no problem with paying Green Fees at all. My local pool hall is a great place to hang out and most of the people there are really cool. The owner Mr. Sweet and his family that run the place I would consider fantastic friends and they take care of the place. The way I have always looked at it is I have no problem giving money to friends, it strangers that I have problems giving money to. If more of us had pool rooms that made you feel like family when you came in the door and bellied up to the bar for a cocktail we would not even be having this conversation you would be more than willing to pay these Green Fees.
 
i voted yes, but it would have to be conditional on knowing that a fund is set aside for table maintainence and repairs. 10% over a years time would recover a lot of tables.

Mike
 
pooltchr said:
I'm confused. The room wants to hold back 10% from entry fees to help pay added money? Why not just reduce the added money by 10%?
Seems all they are doing is shuffling money around.
ie, room adds $50 to the pot, but takes $25 in green fees. Why not just add $25 and not charge green fees?

Steve
Click to expand...

I've seen this crap done a lot on regional tournaments. That is why I think the greens fees and all other financial information should be spelled out.
I'm not against a TD making a buck on a regional tour, but the players paying entry fees have a right to know where the money is going.
 
Maybe if it was just stated that the added money decreases with the more players in the field? I wonder if that would be more acceptable?

The house usually adds a constant amount of added each week. With the economic times as they are, an adjustment is needed.

No weekly tournament is suppose to be a cash cow for any player or players. IMO the weekly tournaments should offer players a FAIR return for their entry fee and support of the pool room. Players that don't support the room and only show up for tournaments are not what the owner is looking for for his clients.

Thus the sliding added and lower entry fees. Hopefully this will appease the majority of the players and keep them happy clients.

By the way, this is a restricted weekly tournament. Only certain skill level players are allowed.

And, there has never been an issue with table maintenance or loud music. No juke box in the tournament room.
 
Yes, I agree. More straightforwardness is needed.
My other post stated that maybe Green Fees should be renamed or not even used.

I like the reverse sliding added scale. Like the increased adjusted added (i.e. $5/players up to 20 players).
A decreasing added with the more players still allows for 100% payout of all entry fees. IMO this is the most important part. The players know that their entry fees are 100% paid out.

All tournament money (added + entry fees) is accounted for with payouts for 25% of the field by the end of the first round of play. This has been so often that the players don't even ask anymore. It is always there for them to read.


pooltchr said:
I'm confused. The room wants to hold back 10% from entry fees to help pay added money? Why not just reduce the added money by 10%?
Seems all they are doing is shuffling money around.
ie, room adds $50 to the pot, but takes $25 in green fees. Why not just add $25 and not charge green fees?

Steve
Click to expand...
 
Too bad the players that indeed know they have the right to know where the money is going also forget that the owner also has rights.

Pool room owners do not have tournaments to subsidize pool player's incomes. They have tournaments to stimulate players to spend more time in their pool hall, if the owners make any money or come close to breaking even, they consider the tournament a success.

All to often the majority of pool players are forgotten. These players are the 75% of the field that does not get paid.



Rich R. said:
I've seen this crap done a lot on regional tournaments. That is why I think the greens fees and all other financial information should be spelled out.
I'm not against a TD making a buck on a regional tour, but the players paying entry fees have a right to know where the money is going.
Click to expand...
 
Tom In Cincy said:
Will you play in a weekly tournament with a 10% of the entry fee going to Green fees?
That 10% will also be used to supplement the Added weekly money.

It will be a DE race to 5w/3L.
Click to expand...

Tom,

Is this a bar table tournament where coins are used for the tablematches?

There aren't that many weekly tournament that have green fees. I think it may matter if the added money is low.

If a weekly tournament moves slow like a lot of them do, I have to be reminded and even prodded to go to them with or without a green fee.

I think we may have ONE local monthly tournament that has green fees but the pool room owners for the most part, have video poker to supplement their profits. A lot of pool rooms around the country don't have that and may need to have a green fee.

The Bar Table tournaments that are springing up around the country like wild onions often have substantial green fees which are sometimes overlooked by the players who see the added money of "thousands" and think the tournament is a feed trough.

10% seems very nominal but I would want to know what the added money was. For example, if there is a $100 added weekly tournament and it is slow run, I would definitly pass if there was a 10% green fee, especially if this is a coin table.

If the weekly tournament was run quickly I could easily overlook the 10
% green fee even in my area where the video poker machines put the BAM in pool room owners pockets. The quarters are a bigger pain than they are worth imo.

The thing that attracts me to most weekly or monthly tournaments is a LARGE turnout. I just like the competition.

JoeyA
 
Thanks JoeyA,
No bar boxes in this pool room.

Table time rate is $10/hour for two or more players.

Tables and separate tournament room are very well maintained Brunswick GC3s

Owner and I are trying to stimulate player attendance for new format starting January 2010.

I think we have decided to do away with 'Green Fees' and go with a two tiered added. With 23 or less $xx with 24 or more 2x $xx.

Too much negative perception with the wording "Green Fees"



JoeyA said:
Tom,

Is this a bar table tournament where coins are used for the tablematches?

There aren't that many weekly tournament that have green fees. I think it may matter if the added money is low.

If a weekly tournament moves slow like a lot of them do, I have to be reminded and even prodded to go to them with or without a green fee.

I think we may have ONE local monthly tournament that has green fees but the pool room owners for the most part, have video poker to supplement their profits. A lot of pool rooms around the country don't have that and may need to have a green fee.

The Bar Table tournaments that are springing up around the country like wild onions often have substantial green fees which are sometimes overlooked by the players who see the added money of "thousands" and think the tournament is a feed trough.

10% seems very nominal but I would want to know what the added money was. For example, if there is a $100 added weekly tournament and it is slow run, I would definitly pass if there was a 10% green fee, especially if this is a coin table.

If the weekly tournament was run quickly I could easily overlook the 10
% green fee even in my area where the video poker machines put the BAM in pool room owners pockets. The quarters are a bigger pain than they are worth imo.

The thing that attracts me to most weekly or monthly tournaments is a LARGE turnout. I just like the competition.

JoeyA
Click to expand...
 
That's why at Buffalo Billiards, there is a new winner practically every week. The owner handicaps each player and those that win, carry a heavier and heavier burden. Those that lose, well, they receive the benefits of losing. The handicap is in a constant state of flux. The tournament is a FREE tournament so when the owner lays down the handicap, you had better not complain too loudly or at least be doing it in jest. :grin: There is no big pay day and it brings all kinds to the tournament, especially those that would never be able to win a tournament without a stiff handicap.

Racing to one DE on tight Diamond tables helps a bit too.
JoeyA
 
JoeyA said:
That's why at Buffalo Billiards, there is a new winner practically every week. The owner handicaps each player and those that win, carry a heavier and heavier burden. Those that lose, well, they receive the benefits of losing. The handicap is in a constant state of flux. The tournament is a FREE tournament so when the owner lays down the handicap, you had better not complain too loudly or at least be doing it in jest. :grin: There is no big pay day and it brings all kinds to the tournament, especially those that would never be able to win a tournament without a stiff handicap.

Racing to one DE on tight Diamond tables helps a bit too.
JoeyA
Click to expand...

Do you mean the one-hole tourney? I won that tournament awhile back. I ALWAYS complain about the weight because I never get enough. I think someone pissed Buff off the day I won and he was hell-bent on making that person lose. I go for the camaraderie. I think having a tiered added amount is reasonable. Adding $1000 if ten people show up is outrageous. But then again, I do not really know what I am talking about.
 
Tom In Cincy said:
Too bad the players that indeed know they have the right to know where the money is going also forget that the owner also has rights.

Pool room owners do not have tournaments to subsidize pool player's incomes. They have tournaments to stimulate players to spend more time in their pool hall, if the owners make any money or come close to breaking even, they consider the tournament a success.

All to often the majority of pool players are forgotten. These players are the 75% of the field that does not get paid.
Click to expand...

Tom, I didn't mean to imply that tournaments of any kind are some kind of cash cow for the TD's or room owners. I know that is far from the truth.

I have just been to so many tournaments, mostly regional, where a couple of nits sit in a corner and start adding up all of the entry fees and advertised added money. Then they compare this amount to the payouts. Of course they don't consider any greens fees. Before you know it, they are telling everyone that will listen that someone is skimming the prize fund.

I guess my comments are aimed mostly at larger regional tournaments and not weekly tournaments, but in either case I believe everyone involved would be better off knowing if greens fees are involved and the amount.
 
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