Help with stroke finish

[HelpMeScrubs0013]

That y'all for the info definitely will try it when I get home. An I'll get video from behind me an the front. One guy I like most to watch is filler an shaw to. There hand gets no where close to there body even when they power up

 

[FranCrimi]

Not sure if this is what you mean, but it looks to me like his stance is too "open" (left foot too far back and to the left). He might try facing the cue a little more (move his left foot forward and to the right a little) to get his torso out of the way of his follow through.

pj
chgo

Yes, exactly. I asked him where he places his cue under his head in order to guide him a little better on how much to reposition his feet and turn more towards his cue. For example, if he's got his cue under a cross-dominant eye, he will have to turn a little more in order to get that eye over the cue and free up his arm a bit. I can't tell for sure which eye it's under from the video.

 

[HelpMeScrubs0013]

Yes, exactly. I asked him where he places his cue under his head in order to guide him a little better on how much to reposition his feet and turn more towards his cue. For example, if he's got his cue under a cross-dominant eye, he will have to turn a little more in order to get that eye over the cue and free up his arm a bit. I can't tell for sure which eye it's under from the video.

I try an keep it under my dominant right eye but for long time I kept it in center of my eyes. I've heard use dominant eye an heard center vision doesn't matter.

 

[HelpMeScrubs0013]

So saying I need to be more straight with cue since my right eye is dominant an not so much facing it

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Yes, exactly. I asked him where he places his cue under his head in order to guide him a little better on how much to reposition his feet and turn more towards his cue. For example, if he's got his cue under a cross-dominant eye, he will have to turn a little more in order to get that eye over the cue and free up his arm a bit. I can't tell for sure which eye it's under from the video.

What do you think of this common advice about how to find your natural foot position?

Hold the cue level in your grip hand with your arm hanging relaxed at your side - the shaft will naturally hang at an angle across your body. Position your feet so the cue, held at that relaxed angle, is on the shot line - that's your approximate natural foot position.

pj
chgo

 

[WobblyStroke]

What do you think of this common advice about how to find your natural foot position?

Hold the cue level in your grip hand with your arm hanging relaxed at your side - the shaft will naturally hang at an angle across your body. Position your feet so the cue, held at that relaxed angle, is on the shot line - that's your approximate natural foot position.

pj
chgo

This isn't all that common imo.

This had a thread not too long ago where Thorsten Hohman explained it (and it was news to Mike Massey standing there with him to illustrate how rare this approach is). Kinister was the first instructor that I know of teaching this method for finding your alignment and has a series of in depth videos on YouTube on the topic. It is based around finding the angle at which everything is in a neutral dead hang. Since this is the rest position, his contention is that the series of collapsible angles that comprise the stroke should be aligned along the same angle as that rest position so that if a breakdown occurs, it at least remains in the same vertical plane (straight line).

Kinister himself points out though that he estimates about 90%+ of pros don't do this but actually perform twists to get into their setup.

 

[WobblyStroke]

A key fundamental to any technique is keeping your head still. You don't.

I noticed your subtle head movement while watching your stroke on 0.25X speed to see when you hit the chest (it looks like after contact but you could be coming into contact with it b4 u really 'hit' it and we can see the results of that impact).

While you certainly aren't the first chin-on-cue guy to lift slightly on power shots, it would be much preferred to just start that little bit higher which you lift into anyway to give the cue clearance. I've even seen pros move their head up but where you differ from them is that when your head moves, so does your shoulder. These are very subtle movements but they are noticeable in slo mo and could def be enough to cause your tip position to migrate a bit on the cue ball.

I'd def try to address the extra bit of movement in your delivery before altering anything about the setup overall. That said, the two can very well be related and if you apply some of the great suggestions posted above to give yourself more room, you may no longer feel like you need to move to get out of the cue's way in your delivery.

 

[FranCrimi]

What do you think of this common advice about how to find your natural foot position?

Hold the cue level in your grip hand with your arm hanging relaxed at your side - the shaft will naturally hang at an angle across your body. Position your feet so the cue, held at that relaxed angle, is on the shot line - that's your approximate natural foot position.

pj
chgo

If you know, or even think you know, who created it, you should say it: Thorsten Hohmann. What if I didn't know it was him, didn't like it and publicly dissed it? You would have turned me against Thorsten, one of the greatest players and nicest people in the game.

As for his theory, I think it's well thought out and innovative and works well for advanced players, but I feel the need to be more specific when I'm working with newer players, particularly when setting up their stances for the first time.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

If you know, or even think you know, who created it, you should say it: Thorsten Hohmann.

Thanks. I didn't know that.

What if I didn't know it was him, didn't like it and publicly dissed it? You would have turned me against Thorsten, one of the greatest players and nicest people in the game.

That would be you "turning yourself against" an unnamed person.

Feeling a little prickly today, Fran?

pj
chgo

 

[WobblyStroke]

If you know, or even think you know, who created it, you should say it: Thorsten Hohmann. What if I didn't know it was him, didn't like it and publicly dissed it? You would have turned me against Thorsten, one of the greatest players and nicest people in the game.

As for his theory, I think it's well thought out and innovative and works well for advanced players, but I feel the need to be more specific when I'm working with newer players, particularly when setting up their stances for the first time.

I'm pretty sure Kinister was teaching this when Thorsten was still a child. Either way, I agree with you that for advanced players it can be used but newbies need more guidance. While I like the technique and think it can work for some with consistency, I think the 90%+ of pros (Kinister's estimate) are actually using those 'twists' to their advantage and adding consistency to their setups by employing them. As an example, the more open snooker stance which is becoming more and more common among pool players, causes a massive 'twist' in the setup which def doesn't have the cue aligned with a dead hang.

 

[FranCrimi]

Thanks. I didn't know that.


That would be you "turning yourself against" an unnamed person.

Feeling a little prickly today, Fran?

pj
chgo

I have a lot of respect for certain people in our industry, and Thorsten is one of them, which is why I'm very careful about falling into the trap of criticizing an unnamed person. (I'm not referring to people who post here with anonomyous handles. They're fair game, since they want to be hidden so they will be treated the way they're asking --- as anonymous people.) But when it comes to naming someone, even if I strongly disagreed with these people who I respect, I certainly wouldn't call them out publicly.

 

[FranCrimi]

I'm pretty sure Kinister was teaching this when Thorsten was still a child. Either way, I agree with you that for advanced players it can be used but newbies need more guidance. While I like the technique and think it can work for some with consistency, I think the 90%+ of pros (Kinister's estimate) are actually using those 'twists' to their advantage and adding consistency to their setups by employing them. As an example, the more open snooker stance which is becoming more and more common among pool players, causes a massive 'twist' in the setup which def doesn't have the cue aligned with a dead hang.

Well, Bert is another person who I have a ton of respect for. Thorsten said he thought of the idea, and it's possible that they both thought of something so innovative independently of each other. If either one of them were named in something I strongly disagreed with, I wouldn't take my comments about them publicly but would rather discuss it privately. Either way, it's always best to give credit to the person like you did, if you can connect a name with a theory.

 

[pagaspoling]

I've worked hours an hours I've finally got my stance an alignment fixed. I've noticed big improvement on my game since. But when I try an hit a long draw shot or hit the ball little hard my hand keeps hitting my chest. I have the measles cue ball an on draws I'm throwing bottom left English on. How can I prevent my hand an chest part.

You're not getting enough speed into the cue. Thats your problem, not hitting the chest. Most of the tips in this thread is how to change how you stand, thats not going to fix your problem by itself. If you want to be able to hit the ball harder just work on hitting it super hard and try to gain some accuracy with it. Speed is a skill that has to be developed not a product of how you stand.

Put OBs in the holes and try to get the ball curve back in to the hole with the OB, or just getting massive bananas on the cue ball with topspin. Or freeze the OB on the rail and with the cueball almost straight and try to punch out as far as you can. Training speed while hitting draws is a bad idea because you will naturally be afraid of the miscue and hold back. Train draws with medium to medium-hard speed with the cue ball hit in mind.

 

[BC21]

seems like you are forward of perpendicular at address
bob's advice bolded above should be helpfull
i am not an instructor

Shortening your bridge length by a couple of inches would probably help. It would get your arm at 90 at cb address, and it would likely help with striking the cb more accurately.

 

[HelpMeScrubs0013]

Didn't have much time to video. But using the advice y'all gave. Almost comes back straight everytime. Still little fast with the stroke. I need to accelerate little slower. Fixed my stance an grip placement.

 

[bbb]

Didn't have much time to video. But using the advice y'all gave. Almost comes back straight everytime. Still little fast with the stroke. I need to accelerate little slower. Fixed my stance an grip placement.

i am not an instructor but it looks alot better to me.....