History of pool in the Phillipines

Andrew Manning

Andrew Manning

Aspiring know-it-all
Silver Member
Danny D said something interesting to me in his commentary in one of the matches that's up on youtube right now, and I thought I'd pose the question here where several posters seem to have a great deal of knowledge about the Phillipines.

Danny was saying that in the US, the various areas where great pool is played can be attributed to a few great players; that all the greats learned from a few specific greats from before, such as Greenleaf was to Mosconi, and so on. He was saying that he hasn't been able to find out who the original greats were in the Phillipines, that taught the rest how to play great pool.

So I know Parica was the first to gain international acclaim, and that there was a guy named Boy Bicol that Efren looked up to the way the rest of us look up to Efren (I hope that sentence wasn't too gruesomely inaccurate; though if it was, that'll spark discussion!) But who was/were the original great(s) of Filipino pool, or phrased differently, how did the tradition of extremely strong play develop in the Phillipines?

-Andrew
 
nineballman said:
I'm not a history expert, but maybe Efren reinvented the wheel?
Click to expand...
I think you are on the right track. Some people are just born "special".

The argument is that a region benefited from Greenleaf's presence. If you always need someone to emulate, how did Greenleaf achieve what he did? This is a chicken/egg situation.
 
I think this would be interesting to learn. I doubt Efren was the first "great Pinoy" player. I'm sure there are exceptions to the rule, but I think that if you play in an area with many great players, you may become better yourself... rising to the competition... perhaps it can be said.

Then again, at least in the US... maybe many great players just tend to congregate in the same place?
 
I am almost certain US Military introduced pool in the Philippines.
Same with bowling.
Then it went from there.
Totoy Dacer, Boy Bicol,Boy Quiapo and Parica made their names before Efren I think.
But when Efren turned 19-20 yrs old, he beat them all except Boy Bicol b/c he was killed.
 
CaptainHook said:
JoeyInCali said:
I am almost certain US Military introduced pool in the Philippines.
Same with bowling.
Then it went from there.

That is what my Dad always told me.:)
Click to expand...
Yes, Efren's infamous $15 Jessie cue had US Military base bowling alley shaft.
Imagine how stiff that maple was. :)
Tried it one time and I understood then why Efren was inlove with that cue.
Click to expand...
 
JoeyInCali said:
I am almost certain US Military introduced pool in the Philippines.
Same with bowling.
Then it went from there.
Totoy Dacer, Boy Bicol,Boy Quiapo and Parica made their names before Efren I think.
But when Efren turned 19-20 yrs old, he beat them all except Boy Bicol b/c he was killed.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they made their names first, but how? Did they get that good just practicing and playing each other? This post isn't really about Efren, because we know there were world-beaters in the Phillipines before him (like Parica). I'm wondering if anyone knows where the knowledge came from; did they learn how to beat the dominant US players by just playing each other and gradually learning the game by trial and error, or was there some unknown great whose influence sent them on that track? This is way before they could learn by watching youtube or ordering accu-stats.

-Andrew
 
Andrew Manning said:
I'm wondering if anyone knows where the knowledge came from; did they learn how to beat the dominant US players by just playing each other and gradually learning the game by trial and error, or was there some unknown great whose influence sent them on that track?
Click to expand...
I believe three main factors shaped Philippine pool, in the following order...

1) Game of choice - Rotation

2) Love (and Necessity) of Gambling

3) Harsh playing conditions

I still believe being brought up on Rotation is the biggest advantage of the Pinoys.
 
I believe it's becoz of the rotation game. I must admit that I see a lot of shots in playing rotation than in 9 ball. most especially with regards to combos, caroms and safeties. next because it's the most accessible game in every street and the most easiest to learn. 3rd is, pool has some kind of charisma for the Filipinos. but ultimately I think it's their creative nature. you just can't teach creativity. the style of play alone tells alot. Americans are more methodical in their plays if you notice.
 
Andrew Manning said:
Yeah, they made their names first, but how? Did they get that good just practicing and playing each other? This post isn't really about Efren, because we know there were world-beaters in the Phillipines before him (like Parica). I'm wondering if anyone knows where the knowledge came from; did they learn how to beat the dominant US players by just playing each other and gradually learning the game by trial and error, or was there some unknown great whose influence sent them on that track? This is way before they could learn by watching youtube or ordering accu-stats.

-Andrew
Click to expand...
Gambling.
Efren used to get a spot from Bicol.
Remember there was no organized pool in the Philippines until the late 70's.
I was at a friend's house with Efren when Mark Wilson called him for the Color Of Money match in HK.
Efren told stories about matching up with Quiapo early in his career.
 
Last edited:
I remember reading somewhere that there used to be a pool bar in the former US airbase in Clark field Pampanga owned by an American where some of the rules in the big tournaments such as the US open were conceived. The owner, upon his retirement, made an exact replica of how the old pool bar looked like back in Clark, complete with the memorabilias in his hometown in the US.

While surfing, I stumbled upon this article, Efren explaining why Filipinos are good in pool:

Efren explained that what makes him and so many other Filipinos so good in pool, especially under pressure, is the gambling.

"Because Filipinos like to gamble and play for money. They don't practice. The practice is gambling. A lot of pool players don't have jobs. Their job is playing pool."

you can read the full article here
http://www.homestead.com/jalems/bata.html
 
Hail Mary Shot said:
I believe it's becoz of the rotation game. I must admit that I see a lot of shots in playing rotation than in 9 ball. most especially with regards to combos, caroms and safeties. next because it's the most accessible game in every street and the most easiest to learn. 3rd is, pool has some kind of charisma for the Filipinos. but ultimately I think it's their creative nature. you just can't teach creativity. the style of play alone tells alot. Americans are more methodical in their plays if you notice.
Click to expand...

I don't think the game has anything to do with it. Canada for the longest time was a snooker country. Just about every top Canadian player has a strong snooker background along with all the skills of a pool player. But we are certainly not the top pool country in the world. I think our players do all right, but there are much better pool playing nations out there.

I think Phillipino pool started like any other sport did in any other country. Pool would have been introduced to the phillipines and people banged around for a while, some guys got pretty good at the game and other guys got better.

If you look at the history of english billiards in the UK it didn't take long for players to go from crap to gods. Around the 1820's a player known as Jack Carr was dazzling people with side spin (he kept hidden what he was doing though). Techniques developed and within the century players were amasing century breaks and much more on what we would consider almost impossible equipment.

I think fillipino pool developed from nothing, just as American pool and British snooker did. It doesn't take long, just a few devoted players and a strong interest in the game.

But the biggest advantage the phillipines has is that it is incredibly popular. Efren Reyes is a celebrity over there, whereas Corey Duel probably doesn't have to worry too much about being mobbed at an American airport.

How many players take up the game in the Phillipines wanting play like Reyes? I'm betting quite a few more than there are US players wanting to develop themselves to a professional level (I'd love to some statistics on that). Most people in North America just want to become better than there friends, or not be the one people dread having for a partner. A lot of people don't quite understand what good player is over here. How many bangers have you come across that feel they could go pro if they played a bit more? How many people think they get better when they get drunk (if I hear that one more time I will scream)?

I wonder how many people in the phillipines make that mistake, probably less on average.

Professional pool in the phillipines seems to have a sustained popularity which draws more and more people to learn the game. And although in North America pool is very popular also, the professional game is in a bit of a lull.

As a bit of a comparison or side note, I am going to try and find out how many professional level hockey players there are in Ottawa. In contrast, there are 2 pro level pool players that I know of in Ottawa.
 
Cameron Smith said:
I don't think the game has anything to do with it. Canada for the longest time was a snooker country. Just about every top Canadian player has a strong snooker background along with all the skills of a pool player. But we are certainly not the top pool country in the world. I think our players do all right, but there are much better pool playing nations out there.

I think Phillipino pool started like any other sport did in any other country. Pool would have been introduced to the phillipines and people banged around for a while, some guys got pretty good at the game and other guys got better.

If you look at the history of english billiards in the UK it didn't take long for players to go from crap to gods. Around the 1820's a player known as Jack Carr was dazzling people with side spin (he kept hidden what he was doing though). Techniques developed and within the century players were amasing century breaks and much more on what we would consider almost impossible equipment.

I think fillipino pool developed from nothing, just as American pool and British snooker did. It doesn't take long, just a few devoted players and a strong interest in the game.

But the biggest advantage the phillipines has is that it is incredibly popular. Efren Reyes is a celebrity over there, whereas Corey Duel probably doesn't have to worry too much about being mobbed at an American airport.

How many players take up the game in the Phillipines wanting play like Reyes? I'm betting quite a few more than there are US players wanting to develop themselves to a professional level (I'd love to some statistics on that). Most people in North America just want to become better than there friends, or not be the one people dread having for a partner. A lot of people don't quite understand what good player is over here. How many bangers have you come across that feel they could go pro if they played a bit more? How many people think they get better when they get drunk (if I hear that one more time I will scream)?

I wonder how many people in the phillipines make that mistake, probably less on average.

Professional pool in the phillipines seems to have a sustained popularity which draws more and more people to learn the game. And although in North America pool is very popular also, the professional game is in a bit of a lull.

As a bit of a comparison or side note, I am going to try and find out how many professional level hockey players there are in Ottawa. In contrast, there are 2 pro level pool players that I know of in Ottawa.
Click to expand...


some historical data can be found in this book......

http://cgi.ebay.com/START-WINNING-P...5QQihZ007QQcategoryZ75195QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 
For Andrew's and everyone's info, a book on Filipino Pool is now under preparation in Manila, and hopefully I'm told it will be ready by the time of 2007 World Pool Championship in November. The book has been commissioned by the Billiards & Snooker Congress of the Philippines and Raya Sports (the WPC promoter).
I mention this because some of the questions raised in this thread will most likely be answered in the book. It will contain a little history of the sport in the country.
As for the theories being advanced by some posters, I tend to agree with Mr. Smith. Philippine pool did not flower overnight. It evolved over time -- from the Spanish game of carom to American pocket billiards, which was introduced following US seizure of the Philippines Islands in 1898. A billiards industry -- tablemakers and cuemakers, among others -- sprouted in the country.
Also, Efren rose on the shoulders of many excellent players, dating back to well before the 50s. They shaped the Filipino style and set the tradition of pool excellence.
 
Last edited:
are they going to talk about when Nick Varner played a legendary match with Reyes when they were both young and in prime? Varner is actually slightly older.
Varner I remembered was in complete control of Reyes despite playing in Manila on Reyes home turf.

Nick was super strong mentally and physically in his game back then.
 
Spade said:
are they going to talk about when Nick Varner played a legendary match with Reyes when they were both young and in prime? Varner is actually slightly older.
Varner I remembered was in complete control of Reyes despite playing in Manila on Reyes home turf.

Nick was super strong mentally and physically in his game back then.
Click to expand...
Nick played pretty strong then.
Then Efren avenged that loss with US Open final win over Varner.
Efren took off from there. That was his first major int'l title.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top