Hitting 1/2 Tip to the Left on Center Ball Shots, Should I Fix My Stroke or Adapt?

Bob Jewett said:
I'd say mostly your stroke looks good. I noticed a little head movement during some strokes. I couldn't tell about left/right misalignment.

When recording this kind of shot for analysis, it is best to place the balls on donuts (paper reinforcements) and make sure they are in a perfectly straight line to the pocket. Also, you need to be very careful to place the camera exactly along the line of the shot or a straight stroke may look crooked and vice versa. The donut the cue ball is on can be used as a reference to see if the cue stick is coming through straight. It should end centered on the donut.

To check any left/right swerve in the stroke, it is good to add a view from behind where you can see what the butt and hand are doing. Exact centering of the camera along the shot/stick line is even more important for the rear view.

Finally, it is best to adjust the zoom to eliminate parts of the picture you don't need to see. For the front view that includes everything above your head and elbow and everything in front of the object ball. Zooming in like that makes it much easier to pick out details. One detail is whether the cue ball has unintended sidespin, which I wasn't sure of in the video.
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Thanks for the comments Bob. I realize that the video isn't ideal because of parallax etc.
I am out on the road working all over the USA at the moment and did the best I could with a cell phone and a strange pool hall. I don't think the guy behind that bar would have let me put donuts on his new cloth.
I do appreciate your input though:)
 
stockbob55 said:
... I don't think the guy behind that bar would have let me put donuts on his new cloth. ...
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Yes, that kind of thing is often a problem -- see the thread on "no marking the table". One way to accomplish the same thing is to tap balls into place. A quiet way to do this is to get the ball into position and put as much weight onto it as possible -- makes a surprisingly good dimple.
 
bbb said:
fran
it seems to me ginky opens and closes his hand more than i imagined happening with your description of your grip preference
you can see it well at this time in the match
especially if you play it back at slow speed
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It's possible. I really couldn't get a good look at him on all shots. It's frustrating trying to see the grips of these players on video. They're usually cut off or dark or funny angles. I was able to pick out a few shots of his grip, and then of course recall him by memory, since we both played out of the same room. Another player to watch is Rodney Morris.
 
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stockbob55 said:
I am not cross eye dominant, I have my cue 1/2 way between right eye and nose. I will try to move my stance a small distance to the left and see if it makes a difference.
In your experience how many inches to the left to give sufficient clearance?
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You should try to keep a portion of your right foot on the line of the shot. If you point your foot slightly outwards, you have a couple of inches to play with. Start there.
 
Th
FranCrimi said:
You should try to keep a portion of your right foot on the line of the shot. If you point your foot slightly outwards, you have a couple of inches to play with. Start there.
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Thanks Fran I will try moving my right foot a little to give my arm more clearance.
I know that the head-on video is not ideal, but it does look like I am dropping my shoulder as I hit the ball.
 
stockbob55 said:
Th

Thanks Fran I will try moving my right foot a little to give my arm more clearance.
I know that the head-on video is not ideal, but it does look like I am dropping my shoulder as I hit the ball.
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Sure. Remember, a stance adjustment always involves both feet. The shoulder drop doesn't look to be a problem. It's straight and in line with the shot. I can't see anything going on from the front position. You look good. But, it would be easier to tell if there's a problem if you were shooting the exact same shot and the cue ball was coming back different ways.
 
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Bob Jewett said:
I'd say mostly your stroke looks good. I noticed a little head movement during some strokes. I couldn't tell about left/right misalignment.

When recording this kind of shot for analysis, it is best to place the balls on donuts (paper reinforcements) and make sure they are in a perfectly straight line to the pocket. Also, you need to be very careful to place the camera exactly along the line of the shot or a straight stroke may look crooked and vice versa. The donut the cue ball is on can be used as a reference to see if the cue stick is coming through straight. It should end centered on the donut.

To check any left/right swerve in the stroke, it is good to add a view from behind where you can see what the butt and hand are doing. Exact centering of the camera along the shot/stick line is even more important for the rear view.

Finally, it is best to adjust the zoom to eliminate parts of the picture you don't need to see. For the front view that includes everything above your head and elbow and everything in front of the object ball. Zooming in like that makes it much easier to pick out details. One detail is whether the cue ball has unintended sidespin, which I wasn't sure of in the video.
Click to expand...
FranCrimi said:
Were you setting up the same exact shot every time? What was your goal for the cue ball?
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Patrick Johnson said:
I'm not cross dominant, yet didn't have a problem keeping my stick under my eyes (although I did have to twist my neck/head more to face the shot squarely). Maybe my difference was that it was my hips in the way, not my chest.
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Here is a video of shots from the front with the cue ball and object ball on donuts, there is an extra donut on the same line to show where the tip finishes. Hopefully this video id better, thanks for your help :)
 
stockbob55 said:
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How old is the video? (Christmas decorations in the background.) I'm not asking to be a smart alec. Things can change in players' fundamentals over just a few months. Suddenly they've got a habit that they didn't have before. That's common.
 
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FranCrimi said:
How old is the video? (Christmas decorations in the background.) I'm not asking to be a smart alec. Things can change in players' fundamentals over just a few months. Suddenly they've got a habit that they didn't have before. That's common.
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That's okay it's only a few weeks old. My wife was in hospital for a long time and we decided to postpone Christmas until she got out.
 
stockbob55 said:
That's okay it's only a few weeks old. My wife was in hospital for a long time and we decided to postpone Christmas until she got out.
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Sorry to hear that about your wife and I hope she's doing well now. As for your video, if you have any issues, I think they're very subtle, because nothing is jumping out at me. If you pocket the shot a hair left or right within the pocket, the cue ball's response will reflect that. But as far as I can tell, all of the cb responses see to be within normal range.
 
FranCrimi said:
Sorry to hear that about your wife and I hope she's doing well now. As for your video, if you have any issues, I think they're very subtle, because nothing is jumping out at me. If you pocket the shot a hair left or right within the pocket, the cue ball's response will reflect that. But as far as I can tell, all of the cb responses see to be within normal range.
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Patrick Johnson said:
Hope it wasn’t too serious and she’s well on the mend.
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Thank you, she is home and on the mend :)
 
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Here's a good shot of Hawiian Brian's grip hand in his follow through. Notice the light grip of the thumb and index finger with the emphasis on at least the third and fourth fingers. This is not absolute proof that he used to play with the empasis on the last three, because it could also be the finishing position of players who roll the cue through their grip hand. But as an illustration, this is an example of the follow through position when pressure is taken off the first two fingers.

Great photo by Robert Ross.
 

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stockbob55, as Mr. Jewett suggested, placing donuts would greatly help evaluation accuracy. However in post #17 there are 5 frames that do help evaluation. In the 3rd frame you are pulling back the cue and your wrist cocks inside thus moving your cue butt to the left. In frame #5 you are final stroking and your wrist straightens out thus bringing you cue butt to the right. This makes the cue tip move to the left and is why you are striking the cue ball on the left. This rear video is seldom used but is so important in evaluation of the problem.

Concentrating on keeping your wrist straight could help. Using 'bowling wrist gloves' like Earl does at times may also help. Personally, I find that letting the cue rest on my ring finger and concentrating on pushing that to the object ball target point fixed my problem.

I am not an instructor but have 65 years experience playing pool.
 
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stockbob55 said:
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Bob, your video has great quality. When you are down and ready to shoot...all looks in prefect alignment. As you go through the shot it is obvious that your elbow goes away from your body which changes your cue direction . I think if you would raise your chin up 6 or 8 inches above the cue joint, the 'chicken wing' would disappear. Now this may not solve your problem but it may let you experience a freer flowing stroke without the 'chicken wing'. If this works, gradually lower your position.

Believe me, as you get older your body tightens up and you don't notice the changes. I hopes this helps a little.
 
Is it fixed yet? I'm late to the thread but TJ above brought the thread back to top so I got to see someone else may have run into same issue I did a year ago....

For me, my chest was getting in the way. I had put on a few (30ish) pounds over covid lockdowns and suddenly got a bit of right spin on my shots. I stroked in a mirror and instantly saw that I was coming out and away on my backswing to avoid my....lets call it a pec.... and then coming back in and overshooting slightly for maybe 1/8-1/4 tip of right spin. I was swinging the cue on an arc ala Bustamante (if you need an example of a guy who def went with adapt to a repeatable arc than fix it and make it str8). Either way, my stroke felt really solid and repeatable but it had this arc to it. The solution was simple and exactly as PJ mentioned earlier....I had to close my stance a bit which gave room for the cue to swing freely on a str8 line. I prefer closing slightly by just rotating shoulders slightly counter clockwise to give the arm some room but maintain the same shoulder/arm relationship and feel. I fear that with Fran's suggestion of keeping alignment and just shifting left, the arm would become more disconnected from the body and you lose the feel in your stroke. You don't need to move a lot, it is a slight curve, solved by a slight adjustment to the angle the cue crosses the chest at.

I think this may have been an issue for you too with the snooker background as snooker players are much more squared up in their stances. When you close the stance and have your body angled more toward your cue (in case your not a golfer and instantly know what a closed stance means), the arm clears easily and that big chest is no longer in play.

Whatever it was, based on last video you posted it seems okay as none of those shots had left spin on them and one or 2 had a bit of right spin.
 
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