How much skill does a player with a certain rank actually have?

After

52 years of playing (I am a old money player that plays tournaments now), I can usually guage a player's speed in 15 minutes, providing that he does not know I am watching him.

The only ranking that matters is the 'money ranking'. You can take a high handicapped league player, play for $50 a game, and they will not stand up under the pressure. Ralf Suquet is an exception. Money players are more seasoned, can adjust to the pressure better, and are better come from behind players than tournament players.

The APA league system is a joke, and should be treated as such. The only league system that comes close is the BCA advanced league.
 
ctyhntr said:
At the OP, what do you look for when you're trying to gauge a player's skill level?

A couple of years ago, I joined a 9-ball team headed by a D+ player. I out shot him in 9-ball, which is why he asked me to join his team. He wanted me to recruit my B level friend. My B level friend needed to spend more time with his family, and less time playing pool, so my friend suggested another player (Ray) who was currently ranked as D, but had higher potential.

I pointed Ray out to my team captain, and after 15 minutes of watching turns to me and said "Why do we need another D player" "I haven't seen this guy make a hard shot yet". Within a year, Ray's ranking in the local tournaments jumped up to C+, B. My skill didn't improve with that team, and I remained as a D and left after three seasons.

Are you looking solely at shotmaking, what about position play (make the next shot easy), or safeties? See what a player does when he/she gets ball in hand.
Click to expand...

I usually focus at a player's skills and technique, leaving more advanced strategic part of the game out of it. IMHO ranking players by strategic performance is an entirely different thing and I wouldn't mix those two up. I mean, a skilled player can make stupid strategic mistakes and a lower player can know all the tricks. But still, I did include the ability to make basic decisions in my system simply because a player's skills are useless if he doesn't know how and when to use them in obvious situations. I'll post the whole thing when I finish the text about it, for now I'll only name the factors:

- accuracy in shotmaking (consistency in easy, medium and difficult shots)
- skills at kicking/banking/combos
- ability to pocket multiple balls on occasions
- knowledge and performance in multiple rail shots
- accuracy and consistency in CB positioning (both for next shot and in safety play)
- positioning of other balls (setting up blockers, driving 8-ball away from opponent's last pocket etc)
- general position and safeties (for example, was anything left out in a safety, or was the 8-ball driven away somewhere where the opponent really can't hit it well)
- knowledge of different shot techniques and consistency in using them (various levels of power, cue elevation, english, masse, jumping, shooting from the air...)
- amount of technical mistakes (miscues, missing easiest shots, applying a wrong type of spin)
- lack of basic skills (usually beginners - unstable bridge hand, constant miscues due to terrible stroke problems...)
- mistakes in decision making (picking shots which are too difficult, applying completely wrong power level, missing out an obvious position or safety when everything else is too risky etc)
- quality of break
 
Last edited:
Havent read all the other responses but here is my take...

I think you can judge skill at the table but that doesnt translate directly some times into wins and losses in league play or tournament play.

I see people that shoot better than the play and others that play better than they shoot.

I like people that do what is necessary to win while not worry about what it looks like.
 
Tell us more about all of the ways you've figured out to clock players' speeds in an area where even the "pro" doesn't run out. So, when by their seventh turn at the table, they've already performed the RAM shot, does that mean they are rated a K or a Q?
 
i like Russes opinion of rankings,only because i gained a ranking or 2...lol...i have always considered myself a good "b" player but i have beaten good "a " players and would more often if i played them more,i have played and studdied the game for 25 years,and know it pretty well, my opinion is skill level is kind of relative to the competition in the area. My local friends consider me an "a" player,but thats because when i play them i never miss, and execute perfect 90 % of the time. Its for fun and i have all the confidence in the world i am going to win,because i know if i miss i am going to get another chance at the table,because they cant run out. That being said,its different playing in a state level tournament where guys will runout if you miss,i dont play quite as loose and confident ,so i dont look like an "a" player, so in short,its all relative to what kind of competition you are playing. But tthats part of competing is getting over the verves and learning to settle in and play your game and not worry about who your opponent is and what their skill level is. Our local apa 8ball skill level 7's are better then a small town north of us, and not quite as good as the sevens from the bigger cities around us, in short your only as good as your competition.
 
Banks said:
Tell us more about all of the ways you've figured out to clock players' speeds in an area where even the "pro" doesn't run out. So, when by their seventh turn at the table, they've already performed the RAM shot, does that mean they are rated a K or a Q?
Click to expand...

I didn't say nobody ever runs out. If I did, it was maybe because I forgot such occasions as they are ultra rare. But there's only one guy (maybe two) I've seen capable of running out regularly at least once in, let's say, a race to 8. However, he finishes 90% of his games in 2 or 3 innings, keeps the table against many pretty strong bar players (all way above me) for hours (to do that you need to win every single game, not a match, as house rules say race to 1), so he could qualify as a B player or at least a top C.

And there is this other dude, a friend of mine, also very skilled (but not even close to that guy), who regularly breaks by jumping forward and slamming the CB using the whole body weight. It's insanely powerful, but also looks skilled and proficient, and he always does it right. Not sure if that could constitute as a RAM shot... :D
 
A player's skill level is really just based on how hard they are able to hit the white ball.

Using APA for example:

SL2: When they actually hit the white ball, instead of one of the ringed balls it won't even make it to a rail.
SL3: Hits the white ball so soft it sometimes doesn't even move (not to be confused with the purposeful miscue. That technique is reserved for the higher SL players that are trying to hide their true speed).
SL4: Hits the white ball just a hair harder than the SL3's. The biggest difference between the 3's and 4's is the 4's have much better body English. The 4's know that if they really contort there bodies after contact with the white, the ball will go much faster.
SL5: They are really starting to hit the white ball hard. They will also have the scoop jump mastered. This is my favorite shot to pull out of my bag of tricks while I'm in a bar.
SL6: Hits the white ball hard enough to attract attention. After they break the balls, often you will hear an old timer who is sitting at the bar say "That kid's got a sledgehammer break!" Chicks are always impressed by them.
SL7: Can do the same as a SL6 but they also look cool while doing it. These players can do the 6 rail bank shots while chewing gum at the same time. Once I even saw an SL7 that was able to play while dangling a tooth pick from his mouth. 6's could never do this.

So, that's pretty much all you need to know but remember the key is how hard they hit the white one.
 
Last edited:
BasementDweller said:
A player's skill level is really just based on how hard they are able to hit the white ball.

Using APA for example:

SL2: When they actually hit the white ball, instead of one of the ringed balls it won't even make it to a rail.
SL3: Hits the white ball so soft it sometimes doesn't even move (not to be confused with the purposeful miscue. That technique is reserved for the higher SL players that are trying to hide their true speed).
SL4: Hits the white ball just a hair harder than the SL3's. The biggest difference between the 3's and 4's is the 4's have much better body English. The 4's know that if they really contort there bodies after contact with the white, the ball will go much faster.
SL5: They are really starting to hit the white ball hard. They will also have the scoop jump mastered. This is my favorite shot to pull out of my bag of tricks while I'm in a bar.
SL6: Hits the white ball hard enough to attract attention. After they break the balls, often you will hear an old timer who is sitting at the bar say "That kid's got a sledgehammer break!" Chicks are always impressed by them.
SL7: Can do the same as a SL6 but they also look cool while doing it. These players can do the 6 rail bank shots while chewing gum at the same time. Once I even saw an SL7 that was able to play while dangling a tooth pick from his mouth. 6's could never do this.

So, that's pretty much all you need to know but remember the key is how hard they hit the white one.
Click to expand...

You need measurable things that are naturally performed, i suggested the following earlier:

Put up $50 on the table (as a gift-collect $5.00 or $10.00 from each player) and ask them to run three 9 ball racks consecutively in front of a crowd, with a hard break (balls go above side pocket)
Give each 3 attempts, each time they miss start the count all over, if balls are touching each other separate slightly so each ball is free to go

A player could be classified as follows:

A C player (give him a ball in hand all three attempts), runs one rack, maybe reach the 8 ball and flunks
A B player (give him a ball in hand two trials), runs 1 rack for sure, maybe 2 racks
An A player, (give him a ball in hand for one attempt) runs 2 racks, plus
Any above A will runs 2 racks for sure without ball in hand, maybe more
Any above A will run three racks in three trial

9 ball combo does not count, or making 9 on the break, it goes up-sorry!
This is opinion only, i could be miss judging, any additional suggestions would help. Thanks.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top