How to safety? Step 1

[JuicyGirl]

This week I've been focused on improving my safeties. I've tried a few exercises. Like trying to lock cb and ob together. Or trying to use english to lead cb in to a spot. I'm not doing well at either. Another is moving my grip further up the cue to reduce the force of my stroke.

I'm getting better at driving the cb to a difficult position for the other player.. But it's still a shot in the dark. And it makes me super anxious too.

Thanks in advance.
Loren

 

[Tony_in_MD]

Start simple, work on half ball, quarter ball and third ball hits. Learn the angles the OB and Cueball come off each other with a centerball stroke. Stay away from spin until you master each of these hits and can use them to create a snooker.

The half ball hit is the most predictable as both balls will move almost exactly the same distance from each other. A very useful shot that if you can master, will help with your safe game. Once you learn how the balls come off for each of these shots then you work on the touch necessary to create a safe. This is a skill that is much harder than shotmaking.

Good Luck.

This week I've been focused on improving my safeties. I've tried a few exercises. Like trying to lock cb and ob together. Or trying to use english to lead cb in to a spot. I'm not doing well at either. Another is moving my grip further up the cue to reduce the force of my stroke.

I'm getting better at driving the cb to a difficult position for the other player.. But it's still a shot in the dark. And it makes me super anxious too.

Thanks in advance.
Loren

 

[JuicyGirl]

Start simple, work on half ball, quarter ball and third ball hits. Learn the angles the OB and Cueball come off each other with a centerball stroke. Stay away from spin until you master each of these hits and can use them to create a snooker.

The half ball hit is the most predictable as both balls will move almost exactly the same distance from each other. A very useful shot that if you can master, will help with your safe game. Once you learn how the balls come off for each of these shots then you work on the touch necessary to create a safe. This is a skill that is much harder than shotmaking.

Good Luck.

thanks for the input I'll try to grab a video when I've made some progress on those:thumbup:

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Donny Lutz]

Teaching defense

This week I've been focused on improving my safeties. I've tried a few exercises. Like trying to lock cb and ob together. Or trying to use english to lead cb in to a spot. I'm not doing well at either. Another is moving my grip further up the cue to reduce the force of my stroke.

I'm getting better at driving the cb to a difficult position for the other player.. But it's still a shot in the dark. And it makes me super anxious too.

Thanks in advance.
Loren

Defensive strategy is one of my specialties. If you're ever up this way, give me a call or drop me an email.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

 

[FranCrimi]

You'll find it's much easier if you focus on placing either the cue ball or the object ball. It's generally not necessary to place both balls, especially if there are still several balls left on the table.

 

[Randy9Ball]

Defensive strategy is one of my specialties. If you're ever up this way, give me a call or drop me an email.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

Loren,

I would strongly suggest taking Donny up on his offer if you can get to Gainesville. He's not kidding when he says defensive strategy is one of his specialties.


Donny - I sure wish Billy was still around. As you know, he had defensive play down to a science as have you!

Regards,

Randy

 

[JuicyGirl]

Defensive strategy is one of my specialties. If you're ever up this way, give me a call or drop me an email.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

Thanks Donny! I'll definitely take you up on the offer soon
Loren

 

[JuicyGirl]

You'll find it's much easier if you focus on placing either the cue ball or the object ball. It's generally not necessary to place both balls, especially if there are still several balls left on the table.

That makes sense. Thanks for the tip
Loren

 

[PGHteacher]

If you can find someone who knows 1 pocket well you could get them to play with you, ask for some weight and don't be afraid to do so Although there are ideas and shots that are quite game specific (in 1P especially) there are still some great ideas, and most importantly it will teach you endurance for safety battles. The # of games I have won where my opponent "lost his cool" in the safety battle, tried something of very low % and lost is staggering, when I get involved in a safety battle I usually whisper to one of my teammates "this is my favorite part" and for me it is.

Prolonged safety battles and learning to like them is something few 8 & 9ball players have in their arsenal, here is a good link with some good info and 3 nice "rules of thumb". When you have your opponent in "1 ball hell" your chances of winning the game have gone up dramatically (in 8ball).

http://www.jimloy.com/billiard/safety.htm

Another is moving my grip further up the cue to reduce the force of my stroke.

This is good and I have something for you here it's called "flick"; there are some times when you need "absolute minimum power" so as not to peak an OB or foul, this is also good for those "touch" shots like just tapping an OB in the side from a really shallow angle. Lock your elbow in place and don't move your forearm at all just use 100% wrist action, it will take some getting used to; practice this by putting an OB 1 diamond away from the side and the CB in the center of the table and "flick" them in, it is a weird feeling at 1st but it comes in handy. Also it does get that wrist loosened up so your other shots will get a little more action when you practice this.

I'm getting better at driving the cb to a difficult position for the other player.. But it's still a shot in the dark. And it makes me super anxious too.

Thanks in advance.
Loren

There is little difference between a safety type shot and any other shot, If I had a dollar for ever time I have heard someone say "I hate safes" I would be a rich man. Try to think of them in terms that you would think of them in any other shot, safeties require a little more creativity than most offensive shots (especially 8 & 9ball) because a safety that is answerable by a good safety; a "countersafety" if you will is not a good safe, so you really have to think about what their answer will be. Usually leaving a "difficult position" isn't enough against a good pool player. Good luck with this stuff and welcome to a brave new world.

I always tell my students that 99% of the time you approach a pool table with your shooting cue you have 3 choices 1. Run the table 2. Safe 3. Sink & safe (I do not mean here shoot a ball down and call safe, why so many people think that is still a mystery to me, I mean that in your plan you have the intention of ending your inning by playing a safety) Out of those 3 choices pick the best one, out of those 3 pick the one that affords you "The best chance to win the game". I have a flow chart that explains this thought process very well; if you want it just PM me your email address and I will send it to you.

 

[JuicyGirl]

There is little difference between a safety type shot and any other shot, If I had a dollar for ever time I have heard someone say "I hate safes" I would be a rich man. Try to think of them in terms that you would think of them in any other shot, safeties require a little more creativity than most offensive shots (especially 8 & 9ball) because a safety that is answerable by a good safety; a "countersafety" if you will is not a good safe, so you really have to think about what their answer will be. Usually leaving a "difficult position" isn't enough against a good pool player. Good luck with this stuff and welcome to a brave new world.

I always tell my students that 99% of the time you approach a pool table with your shooting cue you have 3 choices 1. Run the table 2. Safe 3. Sink & safe ....

I don't give myself credit for any lucky safes. But when I grow the courage to use a safety I tend to fail. Miserably! While improving the other parts of my game I've gained greater control of the ob and cb and finally took a dive into safeties.

In the past week. I've been able to successfully complete my desired safety a few times ... Others I end up with a different safety than what I expected And of course the worst one I set them up Which drove me to start my thread.

After posting I realized that my biggest problem with them is that I hate safeties.... Because I tend to think there is a shot I just need to find it. Maybe there ain't a shot for the next ball and this is where I do a safety. And instead I should have made a safe on the 1 before screwing myself on the 2

Everyone's guidance is greatly appreciated.:thumbup:


Loren
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Donny Lutz]

Nip Stroke

If you can find someone who knows 1 pocket well you could get them to play with you, ask for some weight and don't be afraid to do so Although there are ideas and shots that are quite game specific (in 1P especially) there are still some great ideas, and most importantly it will teach you endurance for safety battles. The # of games I have won where my opponent "lost his cool" in the safety battle, tried something of very low % and lost is staggering, when I get involved in a safety battle I usually whisper to one of my teammates "this is my favorite part" and for me it is.

Prolonged safety battles and learning to like them is something few 8 & 9ball players have in their arsenal, here is a good link with some good info and 3 nice "rules of thumb". When you have your opponent in "1 ball hell" your chances of winning the game have gone up dramatically (in 8ball).

http://www.jimloy.com/billiard/safety.htm



This is good and I have something for you here it's called "flick"; there are some times when you need "absolute minimum power" so as not to peak an OB or foul, this is also good for those "touch" shots like just tapping an OB in the side from a really shallow angle. Lock your elbow in place and don't move your forearm at all just use 100% wrist action, it will take some getting used to; practice this by putting an OB 1 diamond away from the side and the CB in the center of the table and "flick" them in, it is a weird feeling at 1st but it comes in handy. Also it does get that wrist loosened up so your other shots will get a little more action when you practice this.



There is little difference between a safety type shot and any other shot, If I had a dollar for ever time I have heard someone say "I hate safes" I would be a rich man. Try to think of them in terms that you would think of them in any other shot, safeties require a little more creativity than most offensive shots (especially 8 & 9ball) because a safety that is answerable by a good safety; a "countersafety" if you will is not a good safe, so you really have to think about what their answer will be. Usually leaving a "difficult position" isn't enough against a good pool player. Good luck with this stuff and welcome to a brave new world.

I always tell my students that 99% of the time you approach a pool table with your shooting cue you have 3 choices 1. Run the table 2. Safe 3. Sink & safe (I do not mean here shoot a ball down and call safe, why so many people think that is still a mystery to me, I mean that in your plan you have the intention of ending your inning by playing a safety) Out of those 3 choices pick the best one, out of those 3 pick the one that affords you "The best chance to win the game". I have a flow chart that explains this thought process very well; if you want it just PM me your email address and I will send it to you.

I've been teaching this shot for a long time. I call it the "nip stroke". The way I do it requires merely a closing of the grip hand (from loose to slightly tighter) with a gentle snap. With practice, this method will allow you to create and control a one half inch stroke, a quarter inch stroke, etc.
Great for that finesse safety where you need to just nudge whitey.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

 

[justadub]

Loren, from another beginner, let me assure you that you are not alone in discovering how difficult it is to play a good safety. The great thing is that you realize this, and how important being able to play safe is. And you're trying to learn how to do so, better....very cool. Many folks who are learning the game, like us, either don't care or won't try to improve this part if their game. Very cool.

When i started a few years ago, my buddy who was teaching me would get frustrated with me when I would choose to take a shot over a safety. He does a good job explaining.g a lot about the game to me, but for some reason he couldnt understand that to me, making a good (successful) safety was more difficult than making the shot at hand. Doing it right is just another challenging part of this game.

Fortunately, I've stuck with it, and now I do my best to "safe" him whenever I can. He's pretty good at getting out of trouble, so it takes a really good safety to be successful. Perhaps you can try something like this upon occasion, with the right opponent. Trying to play safe in a game situation, for the practice of it, as often as possible. It gives you multiple different scenarios, and encourages you to look for the best options.

Matter of fact, I need to do that exercise again soon. Along with many other drills, heh.

Good luck, Lorenzo. Stitch'em!

 

[PGHteacher]

I don't give myself credit for any lucky safes.

You shouldn't; you should look back and figure out why you didn't put the CB where you wanted it

But when I grow the courage to use a safety I tend to fail. Miserably!

So you blow your safe; so what, think of it like this did you sink every high %/easy shot when you 1st started? Well of course not, think of safeties just like that. Also plenty of games are lost on blown safeties. The lower level player tends to think of this as a mistake in their strategic decision rather than in their execution of the shot.

Just because you blew the safe does not mean that it was the wrong decision any more than just because you missed the shot means that it was the wrong decision. Here is another aspect, just because you made the shot doesn't mean it was the right decision either, the lower level players are confused like nobodies business on these points.

While improving the other parts of my game I've gained greater control of the ob and cb and finally took a dive into safeties.

In the past week. I've been able to successfully complete my desired safety a few times ... Others I end up with a different safety than what I expected And of course the worst one I set them up Which drove me to start my thread.

Sounds like you need to do some CB control drills and you need to decide the exact path of the CB and where it is going to come to rest with more specificity. I have a practice game that you might try that helps with this as well as speed control just PM me if you want me to send you that to.

After posting I realized that my biggest problem with them is that I hate safeties....

See you're thinking of them as something other than any other shot and you can't think of them that way. You have to take them on as aggressively as any other type of shot.

Because I tend to think there is a (offensive) shot I just need to find it.

So I inserted in parentheses what many players mean when they say this, again this is a dangerous line of thinking, if you do this you are playing a different game than pool, I call it "try n run the table" try pool it's more fun.

Maybe there ain't a shot for the next ball and this is where I do a safety. And instead I should have made a safe on the 1 before screwing myself on the 2

Everyone's guidance is greatly appreciated.:thumbup:

Loren
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

Look at the safe as just another shot, this is important; also look at it from a % standpoint, that is really what pool is all about. When you look at that table and say what is my highest % shot to win the game and take that shot out of the 3 options you have 1. Run 2. Safe 3. Sink & Safe and can make accurate assessments of what is your highest % shot you have this 1/2 way licked.

 

[PGHteacher]

I've been teaching this shot for a long time. I call it the "nip stroke". The way I do it requires merely a closing of the grip hand (from loose to slightly tighter) with a gentle snap. With practice, this method will allow you to create and control a one half inch stroke, a quarter inch stroke, etc.
Great for that finesse safety where you need to just nudge whitey.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

Thank goodness; I was a little apprehensive about posting what you call the "nip" and what I call the "flick". I was afraid someone would say AHH NO don't do it like that. WHEW!

 

[bbb]

Thank goodness; I was a little apprehensive about posting what you call the "nip" and what I call the "flick". I was afraid someone would say AHH NO don't do it like that. WHEW!

i was surprised to read about that stroke in an book as i had never seen it mentioned before
its also very useful in one pocket when you want to take an intentinal foul and just nudge the cue ball or when the balls are very close and you want to keep the balls close together
pgh teacher your sugestion to juicy girl about learning one pocket i liked because as you said its a different mentality and "moving ability" ie safety play is a skill to be reckoned with
in fact when a player makes agreat safe you say GREAT SHOT (going along with your concept that the safety is just another shot

 

[JuicyGirl]

Flick or Nip

Nip or flick... Its freaking hard no matter what you call it. I tried it last night, but like you said it's a bit odd. I'll get it.
Thanks everyone.
Loren

 

[PGHteacher]

Nip or flick... Its freaking hard no matter what you call it. I tried it last night, but like you said it's a bit odd. I'll get it.
Thanks everyone.
Loren

A flick shot came up last night for me; I noticed when I do this my stance is quite a bit more errect than my normal shooting stance, in fact it's a lot like my breaking stance. Maybe you want to give that a try.

 

[JuicyGirl]

A flick shot came up last night for me; I noticed when I do this my stance is quite a bit more errect than my normal shooting stance, in fact it's a lot like my breaking stance. Maybe you want to give that a try.

I see. That's totally not what I was doing. Thanks for the tip.
Loren

 

[JuicyGirl]

Defensive strategy is one of my specialties. If you're ever up this way, give me a call or drop me an email.

Donny L
PBIA/ACS Instructor

OK! Donny I sent you a PM:thumbup:

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Sounds like Donny Lutz was super-helpful to you in person, that's great. I like to think about what fraction of the cue ball hits the object ball. If you hit a shot 3/4 full, following impact the object ball has 75% of the speed (approximately) from the cue ball, which retains 25% of the speed.

This helps when choosing, for example, whether to send the cue ball far away or leave it and move the object ball, as in this interesting safety drill.