I think there is a lot of unneeded confusion out there. Carbon Fiber doesn’t automatically give you low deflection. It has to be well designed like the Revo to get the low end mass that drives deflection while maintaining good stiffness for energy transfer to the ball. CF is an excellent material for that but you can also make thick walled, poorly designed shafts with heavy core fill that can make deflection worse than a maple shaft. And CF shafts generally don’t warp or ding. I don’t understand the negative hype about the revo’s sound. I have never noticed it and if I did it wouldn’t bother me. Other brands have a more wood hit feel and sound maybe but often with more deflection and deflection is king for me, I play a lot of side spin and it matters a ton. There are some other shafts out there besides Revo with very low deflection, but certainly not all of them. And I have yet to test one that beats the Revo but I haven’t gotten to test a SMO, and I’m not convinced by their “leaked” test video. Just very little test data and why do you use a “leaked” video on your website. But expect it probably is very low deflection like the Revo, and could be lower but we will see. And yes you can get just as low of deflection with wood, but even spliced wood shafts will warp and ding. To me a good CF is the way to go and it’s far from hype that the good ones offer advantages over the good wood shafts. Wood has some advantages like being able to turn them down and the lighter color but neither of those are factors for me.
I fell for the Carbon Fiber Hype
- Thread starter Jason Robichaud
- Start date
I bought a 30inch 12.5 / 12.75 ( dont recall exactly which ) Jacoby black. That thing would deflect the cueball so bad it was pathetic.... biggest waste of 500.
Tried a 30 inch 12.9 revo played ok just didn't like the hit. But it's hard to beat how slick they are...definitely no friction...
Tried a 30 inch 12.9 revo played ok just didn't like the hit. But it's hard to beat how slick they are...definitely no friction...
what is a "SMO"?
Nice old thread bump... Since the first coming I have switched from my precious Z2 to a Mezz wx900. Still not a carbon offering that came close to what I was accustomed to with my wood shaft. The move to the wx900 was driven by a new cue purchase, that was merely a 'want' and not a 'need'.
The entertaining part is I had the 30" 12mm tipped wx900 turned down to match both the length and the tip diameter of my Z2. I could play just fine with the extra length and tip size, but it never 'felt' right. Played so well (all in my head), that I opted to buy another 900 and get the same work done.
The entertaining part is I had the 30" 12mm tipped wx900 turned down to match both the length and the tip diameter of my Z2. I could play just fine with the extra length and tip size, but it never 'felt' right. Played so well (all in my head), that I opted to buy another 900 and get the same work done.
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Don't see anything here that makes this thing worth 4bills. Few options too: 3 pins, 1 shaft size. Whatever.
Zerksies
Well-known member
I feel a little bit stiffer of a hit with CF then wood and it's not that much. It's close enough for me to work. One of the big things for me with CF is the weather aspect. The shaft does not change with humidty changes with wood i could definately feel it.
Most of the CF shafts are super high deflection. Only a few have been shown to be LD. Revo, Cuetec, and one or two others. The rest are typically based on the same blanks that are virtually impossible to make LD. Ask me how I know...
Jaden
HUH??? No they're not. I've hit a lot of them side-by-side. The Rhino i bought was just a hair more than either the 12.5Cuetec or the 12.9Revo. Every cf shaft i've tried so far as been less defl than maple, some WAY less. One of the home-made on-line guy's(can't recall name) shaft was about the same as maple. Its all in how they treat the front-end, that's where the 'magic' happens. You could have two identical tubes and if one was built with a better front-end it will deflect less. I've yet to hit a cf shaft i'd come remotely close to calling 'super high' in deflection.
Then I question your measuring method. Did you find each shafts pivot point and compare them? Yes, it's the front end that makes the difference, but unless they're cutting out CF out of the front of the blanks, they aren't making them very LD. I know because I've used several different of the blanks to make shafts. I made a very LD shaft using a straight tapered blank from a US CF manufacturer, not cue shaft blank just a tapered tube, but when working with the cue shaft blanks from overseas, they are not going to be LD no matter what you do with the front end, short of cutting away inner shaft material. It might be possible, but it's not easy and most makers don't.
I also have hit with a couple of CF shaft makers shafts and their pivot points are typically 6-8" where as your standard LD shaft is between 12-15" and your standard maple shaft is 8-10".
I haven't hit with the rhino, so maybe you're right about them, but if they are using the blanks from overseas I would doubt it.
When prototyping my shaft it surprised me because I thought the blanks would automatically be LD unless you added front end mass to them. I had already designed a successful prototype using the straight tapered tube and then when testing using the blanks, I found that no methods would make them particularly LD. Then I played with a couple of different CF shafts and they were WAY high deflection.
Unless you play with BHE, it could be difficult to tell. I have played with BHE for more than 20 years and have marked my pivot points on my shafts for more than 10, so I can tell you within 2 or 3 shots with a cue what it's pivot point is and where it falls on the deflection scale.
Jaden
Look, I'm not trying to disparage any cf shaft makers out there. I'm just stating the facts. I also have looked at many of the CF shaft makers websites and most do not have claims of low deflection. I think it would be obvious that if they're not making the claim, it's because they AREN'T. Most modern players prefer LD now and if someone isn't claiming that their shafts are LD, it would not make sense to do so if they ARE in fact LD. It would just be poor marketing.
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Zerksies
Well-known member
I see a ton of tubes being sold online.
Yep and all of them will be high deflection without cutting off or rather drilling out some of the first 5 inches of the front of the shaft. At least I think that it's the end mass there causing the higher deflection. I'll eventually drill it out some myself and test it. I'm not sure if it's possible to take off enough to substantially lower the deflection without making it too weak. Maybe tapering the drilling out of it will help with keeping strength while still lowering endmass.
Jaden
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I have drilled out two CF shafts to hollow out the core 5.5 inches. One drastically improved in deflection. One had no change. The one that had no change has very thick walls. That’s the key. It needs to be thin walled at the front section with no heavy filler.
do you recall the wall thickness of each shaft AFTER you drilled to hollow out the core.
Nyquil
Well-known member
I am of the way of the wood also. I got a Z3 s tuned shaft. It's my favorite shaft I have ever played with. Very crispy
As someone who was a die-hard "use the shaft that the maker made for the cue" guy... I will say, not all of the CFs play the same.
I originally bought a Pred CF when they first came out, mainly for collecting reasons, but decided to give it an honest couple months in court. Main reason for trying it for playing is that it's not longer really a consumable, like a wood shaft. Every few years I was going back to my maker to get new shafts made because after tip replacements, cleanings, and just plain usage, the properties of the shaft are completely different then they were when you first got it.
I ended up not liking the Pred CF and went back to the regular wood shaft that was made with my cue.
About 6/7 months ago, I decided to give the CF train another go and wanted to try the Mezz Ignite. I've been shooting with it ever since and I love it. I feel like it took all the decent parts of my game and made them better. It didnt take too long to get used to. Mainly just the low def properties as I was shooting with regular wood for decades. Once I adjusted for the new lack of squirt and deflection, everything just got better.
With all this being said, don't just write off all CF because you didnt like it from one company. They all have different properties and playability and there could be one out there that suits you.
I originally bought a Pred CF when they first came out, mainly for collecting reasons, but decided to give it an honest couple months in court. Main reason for trying it for playing is that it's not longer really a consumable, like a wood shaft. Every few years I was going back to my maker to get new shafts made because after tip replacements, cleanings, and just plain usage, the properties of the shaft are completely different then they were when you first got it.
I ended up not liking the Pred CF and went back to the regular wood shaft that was made with my cue.
About 6/7 months ago, I decided to give the CF train another go and wanted to try the Mezz Ignite. I've been shooting with it ever since and I love it. I feel like it took all the decent parts of my game and made them better. It didnt take too long to get used to. Mainly just the low def properties as I was shooting with regular wood for decades. Once I adjusted for the new lack of squirt and deflection, everything just got better.
With all this being said, don't just write off all CF because you didnt like it from one company. They all have different properties and playability and there could be one out there that suits you.
I think we can formally retire the word 'hype' when used to describe cf shafts. Its been roughly 8yrs since they hit the scene and with millions of users they ain't going away. They aren't for everyone but they do offer a lot of upsides with not many downsides. With a huge variety and prices from as low as $60-70bux all the way to six benjamins there's a cf shaft to fit about any game/budget.