In House Tournament

Patrick0595

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I am looking for ideas for a payout that will fit for my local club. The league that we all play in during the season is a beer league, no ball in hand, one or two games per night per player, not handicapped.

We have had weekly tournaments over the past few summers during the off season. A typical night includes a single game of 8 ball with a double elimination bracket for $5 per player. This is done on 2 tables, we have a third if we feel it's necessary to use. On average, we would have 10-14 shooters, sometimes 20.

The problem is that there would be a regular winner of the tournaments. People complain and stop showing up. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Pat
 
Since you have a predictable weekly winner, then the other players may feel like they're dead money with no opportunity to win. Have you considered handicapping the tournament by money? Double the entry for previous week's winner so it would be $10 instead of $5.
 
If the same guy wins every week, that's trouble. You need to implement a rule that says the same can't win more than once a month. So he wins, and sits out 3 weeks. That's fair to the other players.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
 
We had a same problem on our weekly tournament. The format was later changed to scotch double with random drawn partners and that solved a lot of problems.
 
If the same guy wins every week, that's trouble. You need to implement a rule that says the same can't win more than once a month. So he wins, and sits out 3 weeks. That's fair to the other players.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Yeah, that is a horrible idea.

Guy #1 wins week #1
Guy #2 wins week #2
Guy #3 wins week #3

Every week starting at 4, you have three guys who can't play. Chances are that some of them don't come back. You effectively kill the tournament top-down instead of bottom-up.

Just let the tourney keep going the way it is. If some dude is coming to a tourney to win $30-50, he either really needs the money, or he likes the people/place. If you pander to those who aren't competitive, you devalue the win.

I played foosball tourneys for almost two years before I ever got in the top 3. I would have hated to have gotten there if there were restrictions on who could play (we had 2-5 nationally ranked pro-master level players at every tourney).
 
We have a similar situation. A guy (nice guy) bought a little shop for pool and dart supplies - he has 2 tables, and on Sat. night a $10/person double elimination tourny. Think he's won 5 out of the 6 so far. He does pay out on top 4 finishers .. but still .. I think he needs to sit out some weeks. He's getting 12-20 people ... so it is a nice little chunk of change. I figure he's making money with tables and sales anyway - kinda goes against my grain when he wins the tourny. I like the guy and all - but still.
 
We have a similar situation. A guy (nice guy) bought a little shop for pool and dart supplies - he has 2 tables, and on Sat. night a $10/person double elimination tourny. Think he's won 5 out of the 6 so far. He does pay out on top 4 finishers .. but still .. I think he needs to sit out some weeks. He's getting 12-20 people ... so it is a nice little chunk of change. I figure he's making money with tables and sales anyway - kinda goes against my grain when he wins the tourny. I like the guy and all - but still.

And I think you should tip him for running the tourney and allowing people into his shop.

But, I bet that doesn't happen.

It isn't a nice chunk of change when you consider that he is probably working without any sales. He maybe ends up with $100 for being at his shop for several hours when he'd likely be closed.

I expect if he didn't play there would be no tourney there. But you are upset because he gets to have a little fun and make a nearly inconsequential amount of money.

I generally tip TD's who don't play in the tourney regardless if I place in the money or not. I generally tip TD's who play but don't place in the money.

I always tip the staff very well when playing at a tourney.
 
Who cares if the same guy wins all the time? It's a $5 tournament. If the same guy is winning all the time that just means the other guys need to practice more and if they choose not to it's only $5.
 
Switch to 9ball, at a local level most bar guys can't run 4balls in order and people love to send the 9 lookin for a pocket. Probably get different winners unless that one guy is heads and tails better than the rest.
 
Who cares if the same guy wins all the time? It's a $5 tournament. If the same guy is winning all the time that just means the other guys need to practice more and if they choose not to it's only $5.

I agree with this.

If you alienate the guy who always win, you've just lost an opportunity for everyone to watch the best player play for a measly $5.
 
And I think you should tip him for running the tourney and allowing people into his shop.

But, I bet that doesn't happen.

It isn't a nice chunk of change when you consider that he is probably working without any sales. He maybe ends up with $100 for being at his shop for several hours when he'd likely be closed.

I expect if he didn't play there would be no tourney there. But you are upset because he gets to have a little fun and make a nearly inconsequential amount of money.

I generally tip TD's who don't play in the tourney regardless if I place in the money or not. I generally tip TD's who play but don't place in the money.

I always tip the staff very well when playing at a tourney.

I understand your point (and while I don't "tip" him, I do always buy at least $20 worth of stuff.) He doesn't open the tables - so there's the quarters for that as well. He's also been averaging about 3 cue sales (and 1-2 cases) per week. (He apparently got a good supply of somebody's Sneaky Pete's for a really good deal). Now once the novelty wears off - I understand that those kind of sales are not lasting.

If he were pulling in the top 15 - 20 players in the area - I would agree with you more; but he's head and shoulders above the "average players" who he's courting to enter it.

To each his own I suppose - just think he's alienating some by having the tourny and then just keeping the money. I think he'd be better served by providing instruction rather than having a tournament.

Staff? ummmm ... he doesn't have "staff"

And "upset"? Ahhh hell no - way to old for that crap. Nothing much bothers me at my age - was just joining in on the conversation by suggesting a few things.

But still - going back to your very first sentence:
"Allowing people into his shop"? That's a pretty piss poor attitude for any businessman to have. Maybe the very top tier of a given profession can afford to have that attitude. But for someone just starting out - not likely to make a go of it if you're treating your customers like you're doing THEM a favor.

One thing I didn't mention - we're not in NYC, or Chicago ... just a little back woods small town place. Ton of bars with their little 7' tables - so he's got a LOT of competition for places to play.

Now like I said: "I like the guy", and we're quickly becoming pretty friendly. He's a good person, and I'll do my best to throw business his way. I even spend a few extra bucks through him rather than order cheaper elsewhere. But you go ahead and knock me it that's what floats your boat - don't bother me none. You folks have a great day.
 
I am looking for ideas for a payout that will fit for my local club. The league that we all play in during the season is a beer league, no ball in hand, one or two games per night per player, not handicapped.

We have had weekly tournaments over the past few summers during the off season. A typical night includes a single game of 8 ball with a double elimination bracket for $5 per player. This is done on 2 tables, we have a third if we feel it's necessary to use. On average, we would have 10-14 shooters, sometimes 20.

The problem is that there would be a regular winner of the tournaments. People complain and stop showing up. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Pat
After about a 10 year hiatus I ventured into the local pool hall for a visit. I noticed the atmosphere has changed dramatically.

I'm talking to the owner of the establishment and brought up tournaments as he had them every Tuesday and Sunday when I quit playing. He said they only have the annual memorial tournament now. The younger players got tired of the same guys winning every week. The weekly tournements eventually died. Since that conversation I've been thinking of ways to attract the younger players to play, so we can get tournaments going again.

How about making the tournament a race to 2 winners and losers, and the previous weeks winner started off in the losers bracket for the next tournament? If he/She is that strong of a player they wouldn't have an issue with it, right? Or if they opted to not start off in the losers bracket they could skip a week.....just throwing some ideas out there. Not everybody is a world beater, so the game needs to be fun for all levels of play.

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Yeah, that is a horrible idea.

Guy #1 wins week #1
Guy #2 wins week #2
Guy #3 wins week #3

Every week starting at 4, you have three guys who can't play. Chances are that some of them don't come back. You effectively kill the tournament top-down instead of bottom-up.

Just let the tourney keep going the way it is. If some dude is coming to a tourney to win $30-50, he either really needs the money, or he likes the people/place. If you pander to those who aren't competitive, you devalue the win.

I played foosball tourneys for almost two years before I ever got in the top 3. I would have hated to have gotten there if there were restrictions on who could play (we had 2-5 nationally ranked pro-master level players at every tourney).
The ones that complain the loudest are the biggest tight wads that spend a minimum. The smart ones will consider it a $5 pool lesson and watch and learn from the winner. My first $5 pool tournament was at the White Spot in Fife, WA. Killer Wed. night nine ball with 30-40 players every week. I played in it for a year and a half before winning a beer for 7-8. I was proud of that! A few years later I was capable of winning the tournament.
 
The ones that complain the loudest are the biggest tight wads that spend a minimum. The smart ones will consider it a $5 pool lesson and watch and learn from the winner. My first $5 pool tournament was at the White Spot in Fife, WA. Killer Wed. night nine ball with 30-40 players every week. I played in it for a year and a half before winning a beer for 7-8. I was proud of that! A few years later I was capable of winning the tournament.
I agree with you to an extent. I'm competitive, and came up the same way. You wanted to be at the top of the bracket.....you earned it! But the fact is times are changing, if we don't adapt, the game gets lost. Hell, from what ive read, some places arent even calling it the losers side of the bracket anymore.....the "B" side? Gimme a break!We weren't raised in an environment where you got a participation trophy. These are 18-20 something's that are still getting an allowance, or better yet, living on mom and pops craft card! In a very minor instance they are working part time and have a limited income. To keep the game alive this is what we are catering to.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 
Update:

A couple of years ago around Memorial Day I was on my way to the Outer Banks from the Pittsburgh area. My wife and I spent the night in Elizabeth City before our house was available. This is where I met Jimmy Cartwright of Colonial Cues and friended him on Facebook. I just recently saw a post from him that mentioned a chip tournament. I had never heard of the chip tournament before so i did a little research and found little information.

Anyway, I handicapped the tournament using the chips, each player gets 2-4 chips.
Winner stays on the table, loser turns in a chip.
Newer players start with 3 chips.
Known advanced players will start with 2 chips.
Players having lesser skill start with 4 chips.
Top 3 get paid and will all start with 2 chips the following week.

Is there any additional information out there about chip tournaments?
 
9 ball throws luck way more into it on a shot race tourney.I have seen hopeless- can't hit the back rail if they tried- bangers KO some pretty good players in a race to 1 or 2.

And on principal I hate any tourney they ban guys for being too good.It's un-American.
 
My 1st rule: Take the number of tables there are available and multiply by 4 to determine the maximum size of the field allowable. In your case that would be 8 players. Keeping the players at the table (little waiting around) and concluding the function in a timely manner is crucial to repeating the tournament every week.

The point I am making is that *sometimes* if everything else is right, a repeat winner becomes incidental.

Good Luck!
 
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