Jackie Gleason's Cue from The Hustler

[MBL]

OK...so don't everyone pile on me at once. I'd like to see if anyone has some decent pics of Jackie Gleason's Rambow from the movie. The goal is to use my "not so good" example of a Willie Hoppe Professional cue, and convert it to be a close approximation.



Kinda like that one if the pic helps.

In watching the film recently, I think I noticed him using two different cues. One had a Hoppe ring and black cap...the other had a longer ivory butt cap similar or perhaps the same as Paul Newman used. The one I'd like to focus on is the first one with the Hoppe ring.In any event, I'd like to see if anyone could provide help on this.
Thanks!
Tim
MBL

 

[cfrandy]

If I'm not mistaken, the blank may have been a Brunswick Titlist...but the cue was made by Rambow. The story cues, Willie Mosconi brought both Gleason and Newman to Rambow's shop to have the cues made for the film.

There are plenty of Titlist cues still out there, and even more Titlist conversions. In addition, John Davis makes some awesome Titlist blanks which you can purchase and have made into a cue similar to Gleason's. What you are willing to pay is what you are likely to get!

 

[MBL]

I am pretty sure you're right. Brunswick Titlist blank. I am using a Willie Hoppe Professional as my raw material. So the idea is to have it turned down some...mine is WAY thick, add an Irish linen wrap...and extend the butt beyond the wrap by a little...not sure how much yet.



I found this pic of the one Willie Mosconi gave to Jackie. It seems to be close to the one he used in the film with the exception of the wrap.

I'd be using this as the base:





But if I get some "specs" from a Rambow collector, it would be a good start.
Tim
MBL

 

[terryhanna]

.........................

 

[GideonF]

I found this pic of the one Willie Mosconi gave to Jackie. It seems to be close to the one he used in the film with the exception of the wrap.

MBL

In what way is the wrap different? Looking at the wrap in the still from the movie I don't see an obvious difference.

Gideon

 

[MBL]

If you watch the movie the wrap is a white-ish color.
TimmBL

 

[ideologist]

The wrap is a gray nylon, I think.

Also, the wrap is extra long.

 

[WildWing]

It's well known that Willie Mosconi supplied the Rambow cues for the filming of The Hustler. I think the black-wrapped Rambow came later, as there wouldn't have been much of a reason for Willie to give Jackie Gleason the cue, absent the movie. It's not easy to find pictures of Willie playing with a Hoppe style Rambow, as most show him playing with the thick ivory buttplate Rambow. However, here's a fairly early one, with the Hoppe style. Was this cue supplied for the movie? Perhaps, but like a lot of questions about historical cues, no way to know for sure.

 

[Poolhalljunkie]

Gleason cue

I am pretty sure you're right. Brunswick Titlist blank. I am using a Willie Hoppe Professional as my raw material. So the idea is to have it turned down some...mine is WAY thick, add an Irish linen wrap...and extend the butt beyond the wrap by a little...not sure how much yet.



I found this pic of the one Willie Mosconi gave to Jackie. It seems to be close to the one he used in the film with the exception of the wrap.

I'd be using this as the base:





But if I get some "specs" from a Rambow collector, it would be a good start.
Tim
MBL

Dick Abott owned that cue he might be able to provide some history of it beyond Mosconi giving it to Gleason.

 

[cfrandy]

It's well known that Willie Mosconi supplied the Rambow cues for the filming of The Hustler. I think the black-wrapped Rambow came later, as there wouldn't have been much of a reason for Willie to give Jackie Gleason the cue, absent the movie. It's not easy to find pictures of Willie playing with a Hoppe style Rambow, as most show him playing with the thick ivory buttplate Rambow. However, here's a fairly early one, with the Hoppe style. Was this cue supplied for the movie? Perhaps, but like a lot of questions about historical cues, no way to know for sure.

I just recently have/sold the Rambow replicas (there were 3 that Willie used) from a limited edition collection of Willie's cues. The last one is the most ornate of all Rambow cues. The WMHR3. I have this cue for sale on Ebay right now . This cue, his 3rd and last from Rambow, is the cue he used to run 526 balls. I do have pictures (from the COAs of Willie using many of these cues.
He also owned 2 Balabushka's one of which is the cue he was seen using the most. The replica of that cue is the cue I use the most and is in my signature below. I also own several other replicas of his cues which are not for sale.

 

[cfrandy]

I am pretty sure you're right. Brunswick Titlist blank. I am using a Willie Hoppe Professional as my raw material. So the idea is to have it turned down some...mine is WAY thick, add an Irish linen wrap...and extend the butt beyond the wrap by a little...not sure how much yet.



I found this pic of the one Willie Mosconi gave to Jackie. It seems to be close to the one he used in the film with the exception of the wrap.

I'd be using this as the base:





But if I get some "specs" from a Rambow collector, it would be a good start.
Tim
MBL

Unfortunately, the specs you would get would not be the specs you would want. Most Rambow cues were 57" long and thick in the butt. You would be more pleased with deciding YOUR specs and having the cue made in that way. Most cuemakers will charge a minimum of $500 to convert a Titlist. This would not include any inlays, wraps, or shafts. So decide carefully, because the more you want in a conversion...the more it will cost. You may actually be better off trading your Titlist for a Rambow tribute cue that is already available since it may take up to 7 years to have one made. My Klein/Davis Balabushka tribute (in my signature) took almost 2 years from the time I asked (put on the build list) to the time I got the cue.

 

[cfrandy]

I am pretty sure you're right. Brunswick Titlist blank. I am using a Willie Hoppe Professional as my raw material. So the idea is to have it turned down some...mine is WAY thick, add an Irish linen wrap...and extend the butt beyond the wrap by a little...not sure how much yet.

I found this pic of the one Willie Mosconi gave to Jackie. It seems to be close to the one he used in the film with the exception of the wrap.

I'd be using this as the base:


But if I get some "specs" from a Rambow collector, it would be a good start.
Tim
MBL

Unfortunately, the specs you would get would not be the specs you would want. Most Rambow cues were 57" long and thick in the butt. You would be more pleased with deciding YOUR specs and having the cue made in that way. Most cuemakers will charge a minimum of $500 to convert a Titlist. This would not include any inlays, wraps, or shafts. An Ivory Hoppe ring could cost you $150 alone! So decide carefully, because the more you want in a conversion...the more it will cost. You may actually be better off trading your Titlist for a Rambow tribute cue that is already available since it may take up to 7 years to have one made. My Klein/Davis Balabushka tribute (in my signature) took almost 2 years from the time I asked (put on the build list) to the time I got the cue.
This is my own personal opinion...I have owned over 100 Titlist cues and other than a one-piece Titlist, I never liked the "hit" of a Titlist. This includes the many conversions I've owned. Modern blanks, such as those made by John Davis, look better and "hit" better than ANY of the old two-piece cues of the past. If you are indeed looking for a player, it may serve you well to use a Titlist conversion before investing a lot of money into a cue you will not like.

 

[classiccues]

This is a standard Rambow for sure and is in essence a titlist conversion. Find a titlist, or even an already two piece Hoppe and you should be able to get a reasonable facsimile quite easily. I would recommend Klein, J. Bender, Tascarella, but there are many that can accomplish this.

As far as hit, it is all opinion. Titlists play fine, I have had 60 year old Bushkas that play fantastic, my 40 year old Gus plays great, as does any Klein or Bender I have.

JV

OK...so don't everyone pile on me at once. I'd like to see if anyone has some decent pics of Jackie Gleason's Rambow from the movie. The goal is to use my "not so good" example of a Willie Hoppe Professional cue, and convert it to be a close approximation.



Kinda like that one if the pic helps.

In watching the film recently, I think I noticed him using two different cues. One had a Hoppe ring and black cap...the other had a longer ivory butt cap similar or perhaps the same as Paul Newman used. The one I'd like to focus on is the first one with the Hoppe ring.In any event, I'd like to see if anyone could provide help on this.
Thanks!
Tim
MBL

 

[MBL]

I tend to like older things...how they feel and function. I drive antique cars, play vintage guitars through vintage amps...play baseball using a 1940's glove...shave with a straight razor...

I've owned a few cues, and hate to admit that the best playing I've done was with an old house cue stashed in the corner of a pool hall.


I hit a ball with the Willie Hoppe Professional I have, and I like it fine. A shorter cue doesn't bother me either. The way it felt was close to the old house cue I used. Wider, but not as dense as my Helmstetter.

I appreciate any and all thoughts on the matter.

I simply want to swap out the wrap...have it turned down a little, and have and inch or so added to the butt. The forearm will retain most of the "character."

Mostly, I'm wanting to find out the likely but length. And the girth at the very back of the cue...from there I think the rest could be reasonably assumed. And if I hate it when done...I can use my other cue.
Tim
MBL

 

[MBL]

Pics of the cue to get the treatment. Terry from Gunn cues will be helping with it. I'm just wanting to locate specs best I can before he starts on it.

 

[deanoc]

does anyone have the ability to sign cues like that anymore

the signatures really enhance the cues

i really like these pictures,good post

i would like to buy the mosconi cue if it is for sale

 

[MBL]

OK. I realize this is bordering on the absurd, but a quick comparison shows, that perhaps the wrap on the Gleason cue is actually shorter than the one on the Hoppe Professional...but the butt length is close to the same. And yes, I realize this is a crude comparison.

But if I were to have this turned down some, I might be able to leave the original but end...and have the wrap cut in about an inch shy of the original Hoppe configuration.

Just thoughts.
Tim
MBL

 

[MBL]

Along those same lines.

So I suppose to get more confirm, I'd like to see if I can get someone to measure their Rambow that is a typical type of the time, to determine the length of the wrap.

Then the thickness at the end of the wrap...and the thickness at the very end of the butt.
Tim
MBL

 

[cfrandy]

Along those same lines.

So I suppose to get more confirm, I'd like to see if I can get someone to measure their Rambow that is a typical type of the time, to determine the length of the wrap.

Then the thickness at the end of the wrap...and the thickness at the very end of the butt.
Tim
MBL

Just out of curiosity, have you played at all with the Titlist you want to convert?

 

[MBL]

Yes I have.