Joints Screws What Do You Like, and Why

A

azbicyclis85376

Banned
Been contemplating the purchase of a New Cue, several Maker offer a variety of Joint Options, like 3/8 x 10, or Radial Pins. What are the pros, and cons of each.

Had an old Cue with a 3/8 x 11 I think,(wood to wood) that lasted for ever. But now they is the new fangled Radial Pin Joints, that I am unfamiliar with.

A little education please. ;)
 
I got a Layani. Since buying it I have never lost a game LOL. I personally think the joint or screw does not make a difference. I have a SW with a 3/8 x11, a CK with a radial pin, a Gilbert with a flat face and a Watson with a ivory joint. Guess what. I still miss a shot and lose. I think the tip is more important. The Layani has a Moori tip and it is not forgiving. If you do not have a true stroke you will miss. I have gotten beat by players that used a cue off of the rack. There are no magic feathers.
 
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I feel that the smaller 5/16" pin with flat faced joint with brass insert or phenolic insert in the shaft has a crisper hit with more cue ball action than the 3/8" pins do. The 3/8" pins create a slightly stiffer hit with a little less "feel". I think the more flat surface you have there with the smaller pin gives more energy transfer that doesn't have that slightly dead feel the 3/8 pins give. The stiffer hit is prefered by many, but the higher energy feel the smaller pin gives is my preference. That is why we can all sell cues, is that players have different tastes. I have hit balls with cues that clunked each time I hit the ball and the guy showing it to me was raving about how solid it hit. I personally didn't feel the cue played very special, and the sound it made seemed to me more like something was wrong with the cue. But the dealer for those cues say they all make that sound and that he loves it. And this guy that loves it is one great player. Different strokes for different folks.
Chris
www.internationalcuemakers.com
www.cuesmith.com
 
Radial pins are generally much more precise. The pin has a locator barrel in the middle of it that ensures perfect alignment. (assuming installer is competent) The tap for cutting radial is also much more precise than a regular 3/8-10 tap, as it has a guide on the front to keep it from wandering. 3/8-10 can be done very precisely too, but it commonly is NOT, and requires machining the threads. Brass inserts are pretty good, but due to the normal slop in most metal threads, piloting is needed to ensure a precise match at the joint.
 
pins

Sheldon said:
Radial pins are generally much more precise. The pin has a locator barrel in the middle of it that ensures perfect alignment. (assuming installer is competent) The tap for cutting radial is also much more precise than a regular 3/8-10 tap, as it has a guide on the front to keep it from wandering. 3/8-10 can be done very precisely too, but it commonly is NOT, and requires machining the threads. Brass inserts are pretty good, but due to the normal slop in most metal threads, piloting is needed to ensure a precise match at the joint.
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Hi Sheldon,

Joint pins and there names.

Most cuemakers do tap there shafts and butts when installing pins for butts and shafts.

Slop, I have seen several so called radial, pins sloopy. Taps are ok, but not as good as grinding threads with a tool, as I do.

Grinding threads, insures that it's straight and tight, as should be. No slop if done properly. So, with that in mind, the radial is no better than the guy who has "TAPPED"or ground his threads.



My pin!
I use a pin that some folks call a 3/8" pin. It is NOT, 3/8" pin. It's my own design and is in fact, .348" in dia. X 11.455 threads per inch, to set the record straight.It's no to heavy or to light in weight.

It's a BLUD pin. "NUFF SAID".

In my opinion, the so called "radial" is to heavy for a joint pin. It also makes the cues joint, too stiff for my liking.

THE TERM, "RADIAL"!

Radial, is all joint pins. Look it up in websters. Branching out in all directions from a common center. [the threads]. Therefore, all joint pins are in fact, "RADIALS" PINS....


blud
 
Blud,

What is your opinion on 5/16 type pins? I am trying to figure out the pro's and con's to either a 3/8 or 5/16. Any information on comparisons would be greatly appreciated. Chris stated his opinion which I also value, just looking for more than.

Thank you,
Dave

P.S. Normally I would post this on the Cuemakers section but seeing how it is here I will ask.
 
pins

DDKoop said:
Blud,

What is your opinion on 5/16 type pins? I am trying to figure out the pro's and con's to either a 3/8 or 5/16. Any information on comparisons would be greatly appreciated. Chris stated his opinion which I also value, just looking for more than.

Thank you,
Dave

P.S. Normally I would post this on the Cuemakers section but seeing how it is here I will ask.
Click to expand...

Hello Dave,

good to hear from you sir.

Pins, I have always maintained if it ain't broke.. You know the rest.


However, why have a brass insert and then a pin so small. [ 5/16X14, or 5/16X18,].Now with this configeration you have 3 things to worry about.

1.- you got to drill and tap or bore the shaft.

2.- now you add an insert.

3.-Now you got a pin going in the insert, which is in the shaft.


With my cues, I, only drill/bore/grind/threads in both the butt and shaft. Only one pin, no insert and glue to turn loose.

No problems down line.........

works for me.

blud
 
blud said:
Hi Sheldon,

Joint pins and there names.

Most cuemakers do tap there shafts and butts when installing pins for butts and shafts.

Slop, I have seen several so called radial, pins sloopy. Taps are ok, but not as good as grinding threads with a tool, as I do.

Grinding threads, insures that it's straight and tight, as should be. No slop if done properly. So, with that in mind, the radial is no better than the guy who has "TAPPED"or ground his threads.
My pin!
I use a pin that some folks call a 3/8" pin. It is NOT, 3/8" pin. It's my own design and is in fact, .348" in dia. X 11.455 threads per inch, to set the record straight.It's no to heavy or to light in weight.
It's a BLUD pin. "NUFF SAID".
In my opinion, the so called "radial" is to heavy for a joint pin. It also makes the cues joint, too stiff for my liking.
THE TERM, "RADIAL"!
Radial, is all joint pins. Look it up in websters. Branching out in all directions from a common center. [the threads]. Therefore, all joint pins are in fact, "RADIALS" PINS....
blud
Click to expand...

I am familiar with your pin, I have made a few shafts for your cues. Its a bit tricky to get the threads cut with the odd pitch, but with a little ingenuity, I was able to pulll it off. The nice thing about a pin like yours, or a southwest; is that you can bore the hole in the shaft just a hair undersized so the pin is nice and snug.
 
What makes it a "Radial" pin

FWIW I thought the term "Radial" in "Radial Pin" was referring to the curved shape of faces of the threads, as opposed to the flat or triangular shapes used on other thread types.
 
AuntyDan said:
FWIW I thought the term "Radial" in "Radial Pin" was referring to the curved shape of faces of the threads, as opposed to the flat or triangular shapes used on other thread types.
Click to expand...

That would be correct, Sir!
:D
 
Thanks for the info Blud. Great to hear that Janice is doing better too.

Kind regards,
Dave
 
radial

THE TERM, "RADIAL"!

Radial, is all joint pins. Look it up in websters. Branching out in all directions from a common center. [the threads]. Therefore, all joint pins are in fact, "RADIALS" PINS....


blud[/QUOTE]

thanks blud confirms my post on radial consistancy of predator shafts,all shafts have radial consistancy,more 314 bull pucky by the marketing guys.question,do you or anybody else know how to contact a cuemaker named bill hagan,originaly from miamisburg ohio and later moved to scottsdale arizona?
 
01rkclassic said:
THE TERM, "RADIAL"!

Radial, is all joint pins. Look it up in websters. Branching out in all directions from a common center. [the threads]. Therefore, all joint pins are in fact, "RADIALS" PINS....


blud
Click to expand...

thanks blud confirms my post on radial consistancy of predator shafts,all shafts have radial consistancy,more 314 bull pucky by the marketing guys.question,do you or anybody else know how to contact a cuemaker named bill hagan,originaly from miamisburg ohio and later moved to scottsdale arizona?[/QUOTE]



01rkclassic,

I think you might be a bit confused about the use of the term "radial" in two very different contexts when relating to a joint pin and Predators claim of shaft radial consistancy.

In the context of joint pin, it is simply referring to a particular type of pin used to connect the shaft to the butt.

In relation to "radial consistancy of predator shafts", it is not relating to the joint pin at all, but is apparently a performance property of the shaft which is due to the shafts "pie wedge" construction technique. The opposing wood grain orientation from the "pie wedge" means that no matter which way the shaft is oriented (rotated) the amount of cue ball deflection experienced should be similar to other rotatated orientations. On cues that are made from one solid piece of wood, the cueball deflects by sightly differently amounts in different rotations (hence some major manufacturers "dot" series, where the dot means "this way up").

Don't want to get into a dbate over which is better cause I have not used the predator, just wanted to clarify the terminology.

Cheers!
 
banger all shafts are round hence radial consistancy as i said in my post,not refering to the joint pin,i've played with a 314 and would'nt dare put one on my southwest,lori would kill me for ruining a good cue,or the ivory jointed gilbert or ww cue that i own.
 
01rkclassic said:
banger all shafts are round hence radial consistancy as i said in my post,not refering to the joint pin,i've played with a 314 and would'nt dare put one on my southwest,lori would kill me for ruining a good cue,or the ivory jointed gilbert or ww cue that i own.
Click to expand...

I suppose you could say that anything that is round is radially consistant and be correct. However as far as I understand it, this is not what Predator are claiming when they say their shafts are radially consistant. I believe Predator are saying no matter what rotational offset the shaft is in, the degree of cue ball deflection will be the same.

When the term is used in this context of deflection I can personally say that not all shafts are radially consistant and have a cue that displays a different pivot point when rotationally oriented in different positions.

Perhaps the marketing guys at Predator could come up with a more descriptive way of phrasing radial consistancy.

Cheers!
 
01rkclassic said:
:p good one drivemaker,if you have to replace half your cue to get it to play right you bought the wrong cue!
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You outdid me...if you're not around the next time the Predator convention bus comes to town and they all start singing in unison as they unload, may I use that line? :cool:
 
drivermaker said:
You outdid me...if you're not around the next time the Predator convention bus comes to town and they all start singing in unison as they unload, may I use that line? :cool:
Click to expand...
I've thought the same thing (01rkclassic's quote) when the pred's first came out... and the raving began...

Thanks,

Jon
 
BiG_JoN said:
I've thought the same thing (01rkclassic's quote) when the pred's first came out... and the raving began...

Thanks,

Jon
Click to expand...


O.K., may I use your thoughts then...as long as I can wade through the perverse and demented ones. :eek: :D Where've you been, big boy?
 
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