Ki-Tech tips...(Outsville) Opinions?

The Renfro said:
I appreciate all the great reviews but the real thing that is missing is the accolades to the installers that actually installed the Ki-Techs correctly...

Install on our tips at this point may be more important than the tips themselves...

Installed correctly I will put a Ki-Tech up against anything on the market and we will leave them for dead after about 6 weeks... You won't out perform us and you sure as hell won't outlast us because we will play the same from cradle to grave...

Mr Moori changed the game over 20 years ago... We intend to change it back... Get off the layered tip bandwagon and quite wasting time and money...

Outsville is coming... It's not about the money.. It's about performance and value.... Outsville is coming......
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Hey Renfro, do you have any tips or guidance about the install? What in particular were you referring to above? I'll be installing mine this weekend and want to make sure I don't screw it up.

I also want to share with everyone: last week I ordered the sample tip set along with the Great White chalk kit (with the magnetic holder).

When I received it, I was VERY impressed with the quality of the packaging! It may seem like a simple thing, but it screams quality. The tips are shipped in individual packs, like pills. The chalk holder came in a fitted box, like a piece of jewelry. And the chalk itself comes in a hard plastic box with an extremely well fitted friction top: this should protect the chalk inside my case.

The magnetic chalk holder and the magnetic chalk is way cool. I've tried several different chalk holder systems, and they all fall down when the chalk gets a little used. This approach solves the problem very nicely.

So far I'm very impressed! I can't wait to get my new tip installed and give it try :grin:
 
I am also interested in the guidance about the install as I put a medium on last night and would like to find out if I did it correctly.
 
I've been using Ki-Tech Hards since the 2013 Southern Classic in Tunica.

I can echo every positive comment so far. Quality. Consistency. Price. Customer service. On and on.

But, what seals it for me is the feedback of the hit and the SOUND.
Renfro makes a Hard that cackles at you. Such a pleasant plink.

It's kinda like the book "Pleasures of Small Motions". Sometimes the sounds and feels of the game are what makes it worth playing. The Ki-Tech Hard scratches my itch.

Oh yea, I also use the Hammerhead and Ki-Tech Solid as breakers. Once you follow the instructions, they're the best breakers on the market.

The Accu-Rack is the best template out there as well.

If Outsville offered stock, I'd buy.
 
fathomblue said:
Oh yea, I also use the Hammerhead and Ki-Tech Solid as breakers. Once you follow the instructions, they're the best breakers on the market.
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This is the part that confuses me. This is the second time that there has been a hint that there are some special instructions, or something specific you are supposed to do to install these tips correctly.

I received no instructions with mine: I've installed hundreds of tips in my lifetime, so I can't imagine what would be different about installing these in particular.

Can someone please educate me?
 
My understanding is the installer needs to have sharp tools otherwise too much heat is introduced which apparently causes some kind of change in the tips chemistry. I guess this would be really true of the burnishing process. This is my understanding but the Renfro needs to say explicitly.

Al
 
ssbn610g said:
My understanding is the installer needs to have sharp tools otherwise too much heat is introduced which apparently causes some kind of change in the tips chemistry. I guess this would be really true of the burnishing process. This is my understanding but the Renfro needs to say explicitly.

Al
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Since I do all mine by hand, I doubt heat will be an issue :smile:
 
The Ki-Techs are put thru several chemical processes to get them to the COR and playability we look for...

One of the chemicals actually with get sticky if it gets hot... So anytime someone is installing a Ki-Tech on a lathe they need to use a new razor blade and either turn the speed down OR use a damp paper towel to moisten the tip during cutting to keep the heat down.... Kept at the proper temperature they will burnish nicely.. Too hot and they won't burnish well and may actually come apart from the fibers tearing....

The 2nd trick is the shaping... the final shaping step should be to use 1200 grit or higher sandpaper and knock the fibers down to the tip radius.. If the fibers are left tall then the tip will play softer and not get as much action on the cueball as they normally would...


As far as the SOLID break tip.. It requires being set in... It will deform over the first 25 breaks or so and beat into shape... It will then sometimes require being trued up from any mushroom that happens.. Once it has went thru this process once you will pretty much only have to hit it lightly with sandpaper from time to time and it will be faster than the other leather based break tips on the market...

The set in factor is the main reason we don't push the SOLID... Our Hammerhead is a synthetic that is faster, holds chalk and is very easy to control so that is the car we usually take to the racetrack.....
 
ssbn610g said:
My understanding is the installer needs to have sharp tools otherwise too much heat is introduced which apparently causes some kind of change in the tips chemistry. I guess this would be really true of the burnishing process. This is my understanding but the Renfro needs to say explicitly.

Al
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The man who installs my tips knows the value of sharp tools....he has installed tips
that were exploding on other installers.
My medium is still getting rave reviews...thank you, Mr Renfro.
 
In the interest of balanced reporting... I didn't care for the Ki-Tech tip I tried. I didn't hate it, I just didn't like it more than the Hard Predator tips I've been using for a a couple years now. Every now and then I try something new, but keep coming back to the Predator tips.
 
murdoc23 said:
In the interest of balanced reporting... I didn't care for the Ki-Tech tip I tried. I didn't hate it, I just didn't like it more than the Hard Predator tips I've been using for a a couple years now. Every now and then I try something new, but keep coming back to the Predator tips.
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Nothing wrong with having a goto tip... I recommend the G2 and Ultraskins often to people who want layered tips...

Our bread and butter sellers are the medium and medium/soft... Our lowest seller is the hard and I have said on many instances most hard tips are going to be consistent and hold up similarly... Making hard tips is the easiest grade to make...

The main differences in hard tips are glazing and maintenance... There will be some performance differences but a hard tip is going to be over 70 on COR and have very short contact times so there will be little that can be told hitting different hards over the short term..
 
The Renfro said:
The Ki-Techs are put thru several chemical processes to get them to the COR and playability we look for...

As far as the SOLID break tip.. It requires being set in... It will deform over the first 25 breaks or so and beat into shape... It will then sometimes require being trued up from any mushroom that happens.. Once it has went thru this process once you will pretty much only have to hit it lightly with sandpaper from time to time and it will be faster than the other leather based break tips on the market...

The set in factor is the main reason we don't push the SOLID... Our Hammerhead is a synthetic that is faster, holds chalk and is very easy to control so that is the car we usually take to the racetrack.....
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I would love to see a side by side comparison with the Solid and the Taom.... I dont doubt anything you are saying, I just can't see how it could be that much quicker than the Taom.... Plus, I just put my Taom on 2 months ago, and I ain't takin it off just yet....LOL.
 
Tooler said:
I would love to see a side by side comparison with the Solid and the Taom.... I dont doubt anything you are saying, I just can't see how it could be that much quicker than the Taom.... Plus, I just put my Taom on 2 months ago, and I ain't takin it off just yet....LOL.
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In order of COR measurements fastest to slowest of the tips/materials we have tested... Higher COR is higher energy transfer which = more speed...

G10/G11
Hammerhead
White Diamond
Linen Based Phenolic (BK2)
Lower Grades of Linen/cloth Based (Atlas)
Taom
Solid-Leather Based
Samsara-Leather Based


In order of Shore Hardness D Scale.. Hardness and COR are related but generally have different ascensions and plateaus in their curves as a material is increased in hardness...

G10/G11
Linen Based Phenolic (BK2)
White Diamond
Lower Grades of Linen/canvas Based (Atlas)
Hammerhead
Taom
Solid-Leather Based
Samsara-Leather Based


The Glass phenolics are almost always harder than the cueball which is why they cause damage when used as break tips.....

I know you have to take this with a grain of salt because I am the one offering the results and the Hammerhead is our baby. I would be a skeptic as well.. All I can say is find someone with a Hammerhead and ask them.. We have tons of rave reviews on facebook and in emails...
 
I installed my Ki-tech Hard tip on Saturday and all I can say is this tip is fantastic! I wasn't sure I'd like a Hard tip, but so far so good. I get more draw than I did before with an Everest Medium and I seem to have more cue ball control than ever. I'm making far more banks, which I didn't expect, and my safety game went up a notch.

I played 5-hours of one-pocket Saturday afternoon and came out ahead while giving weight (8-6) for the first time ever. On Sunday I placed third in our weekly 8-ball tournament (should have made the finals but missed a crucial long rail cut shot). Last night I played my best league night ever, winning 7 of 8 games, several by huge margins.

I installed the Soft on my wife's cue. Definitely not my cup of tea: frankly, it feels like an Elkmaster to me, but she really seems to like it.

I'm also using the Great White chalk: it just made sense to use it with the Ki-tech tip. I love the holder and the magnet in the chalk, but I've noticed that the top layer is already starting to flake off.

All in all, I'm one very happy customer!
 
RakRunr said:
I installed my Ki-tech Hard tip on Saturday and all I can say is this tip is fantastic! I wasn't sure I'd like a Hard tip, but so far so good. I get more draw than I did before with an Everest Medium and I seem to have more cue ball control than ever. I'm making far more banks, which I didn't expect, and my safety game went up a notch.

I played 5-hours of one-pocket Saturday afternoon and came out ahead while giving weight (8-6) for the first time ever. On Sunday I placed third in our weekly 8-ball tournament (should have made the finals but missed a crucial long rail cut shot). Last night I played my best league night ever, winning 7 of 8 games, several by huge margins.

I installed the Soft on my wife's cue. Definitely not my cup of tea: frankly, it feels like an Elkmaster to me, but she really seems to like it.

I'm also using the Great White chalk: it just made sense to use it with the Ki-tech tip. I love the holder and the magnet in the chalk, but I've noticed that the top layer is already starting to flake off.

All in all, I'm one very happy customer!
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Once you are passed the top edges the flaking should quit.. If there is any chatter when we cut them to size we see some flaking but after that it goes away... The new formula is firmer and holds up better than the old and I am looking for ways to make the edges cleaner on the cuts...

Also glad to hear you are liking the Ki-Tech Hard and I agree on the soft. I play exclusively with our medium soft now =). But one thing to look at is the top of the soft... If the fibers are showing then it's playing softer than it should and you need to knock them down with 1200 grit or higher to the tip radius... It's still going to be soft but not elk soft LOL.....
 
The Renfro said:
Once you are passed the top edges the flaking should quit.. If there is any chatter when we cut them to size we see some flaking but after that it goes away... The new formula is firmer and holds up better than the old and I am looking for ways to make the edges cleaner on the cuts...

Also glad to hear you are liking the Ki-Tech Hard and I agree on the soft. I play exclusively with our medium soft now =). But one thing to look at is the top of the soft... If the fibers are showing then it's playing softer than it should and you need to knock them down with 1200 grit or higher to the tip radius... It's still going to be soft but not elk soft LOL.....
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I'll keep an eye on the chalk. I've already had a bunch of people ask me about it, presumably because it's white. I've been showing off the little white circles it leaves on the cue ball too.

The soft tip is almost "fuzzy", so I definitely need to knock the fibers down. I've got some 2000 grit, so that should do it.

I also want to say that I love how engaged you are on the forums, it had a lot to do with my decision to give your products a chance. Keep up the great work! :thumbup:
 
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