LD shaft recommendation.

T

tomatoshooter

Well-known member
So, I'm starting to use sidespin and figure I should make the move to an LD shaft. The problem is I am reluctant to drop $200+ for something I may not like. I'm also a little confused about the exact benefits.

In this article (http://www.sfbilliards.com/Misc/Shepard_squirt.pdf) he discusses Bob Jewett's technique for measuring squirt (page 10) and suggests that a low deflection cue will have a pivot point 40 inches from the tip. It seems like the Ideal pivot point would be at the bridge hand, making back hand English automatically correcting. Is it easier to use front hand English with an LD cue? Does moving the stick parallel get you close enough? The pivot point of my main cue, a Schmelke with a standard maple shaft, seems to be about 20-24" from the tip, although I'm not sure my technique is precise enough to guarantee the results. I seem to get my best results by lining up a shot, shifting my bridge a bit and then adding a little more with my other hand.

I like doing swerve and semi-masse shots, how are these shots different with an LD cue?

It also seems like there would be a range of deflection among shafts that are considered LD and it could get expensive trying them to figure out what I like.
 
tomatoshooter said:
So, I'm starting to use sidespin and figure I should make the move to an LD shaft. The problem is I am reluctant to drop $200+ for something I may not like. I'm also a little confused about the exact benefits.

In this article (http://www.sfbilliards.com/Misc/Shepard_squirt.pdf) he discusses Bob Jewett's technique for measuring squirt (page 10) and suggests that a low deflection cue will have a pivot point 40 inches from the tip. It seems like the Ideal pivot point would be at the bridge hand, making back hand English automatically correcting. Is it easier to use front hand English with an LD cue? Does moving the stick parallel get you close enough? The pivot point of my main cue, a Schmelke with a standard maple shaft, seems to be about 20-24" from the tip, although I'm not sure my technique is precise enough to guarantee the results. I seem to get my best results by lining up a shot, shifting my bridge a bit and then adding a little more with my other hand.

I like doing swerve and semi-masse shots, how are these shots different with an LD cue?

It also seems like there would be a range of deflection among shafts that are considered LD and it could get expensive trying them to figure out what I like.
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Here's the Reader's Digest condensed version. Use "swerve and semi masse" only when absolutely necessary. LD/CF shafts will keep the cue ball on a straighter path, relative to your aim point, and stroke. Find somewhere, or someone who has a few LD shafts, and try them out. While the performance differences may be similar, they all have different feels, and acoustics, which will be part of your buying equation.
I hope this helps a little.
Good luck, and best regards.
Joe P
 
j2pac said:
Here's the Reader's Digest condensed version. Use "swerve and semi masse" only when absolutely necessary. LD/CF shafts will keep the cue ball on a straighter path, relative to your aim point, and stroke. Find somewhere, or someone who has a few LD shafts, and try them out. While the performance differences may be similar, they all have different feels, and acoustics, which will be part of your buying equation.
I hope this helps a little.
Good luck, and best regards.
Joe P
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Thanks, I'll have to try to find some to try. I guess it's also a bit difficult because I'm still not competent enough with sidespin to fully evaluate them but I should be able to notice some differences. If I get good with sidespin then my position play should improve reducing the need for swerve and masse. My current cue will become my break cue so that option will still be available most of the time.
 
measureman said:
Save your money and just learn how to play with a maple shaft.
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I would like to see what the fuss is about but I am having much less trouble compensating than I expected. When I look at prices and see maple shafts for $60 and LD shafts for $225... I like to have a spare shaft... That would go a long way towards redoing my pool table.
 
My opinion....

Good new maple shafts of the proper weight, are at least $225. +
If your not a big table player with the top pros and you focus on the 7' footers, then the benefits of the LD's too me are not as great.
A good $60 maple shaft is NOT a realistic number, unless it's a low end cue.
 
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Low deflection shafts are total B.S., take hard maple shaft 13mm and drop the tip at around 12mm in the last 6 inches. You will never put english and draw shot as much as solid maple shaft with a low whippy deflection shaft.
With a solid maple shaft you don't need to go as much on the cue ball edge to put high spin than a low deflection shaft, for the same results the deflection is the same between the 2 shafts, but you will make more miss cue with the L.D. when you will need extreme spin, nobody around me can do what I do with their L.D. shaft and my shaft is a selected very stiff 13.25mm taper ash shaft dropped down to 12mm at tip.
Today people and companies talk about carbon fiber break cue low deflection phenolic tipped, incredible.
 
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Island Drive said:
My opinion....

Good new maple shafts of the proper weight, are at least $225. +
If your not a big table player with the top pros and you focus on the 7' footers, then the benefits of the LD's too me are not as great.
A good $60 maple shaft is NOT a realistic number, unless it's a low end cue.
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I bought a real good maple shaft on E bay for $60.
I was really surprised at the quality.
Certainly not the same as a custom maker but really good enough.
Custom makers have to make a lot more money per shaft then ones mass produced in China.
 
EL Picos said:
Low deflection shafts are total B.S., take hard maple shaft 13mm and drop the tip at around 12mm in the last 6 inches. You will never put english and draw shot as much as solid maple shaft with a low whippy deflection shaft.
With a solid maple shaft you don't need to go as much on the cue ball edge to put high spin than a low deflection shaft, for the same results the deflection is the same between the 2 shafts, but you will make more miss cue with the L.D. when you will need extreme spin, nobody around me can do what I do with their L.D. shaft and my shaft is a selected very stiff 13.25mm taper ash shaft dropped down to 12mm at tip.
Today people and companies talk about carbon fiber break cue low deflection phenolic tipped, incredible.
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Sorry but little of what you say here is backed up by facts.
 
Island Drive said:
Like your first new car. Don't start off with a Cadillac, get a Toyota.
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Might decide when you mature all you need Toyota, to get you from point a to b.🤣
measureman said:
Save your money and just learn how to play with a maple shaft.
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The people, companies, pushing, and pimping the next greater better then magic wand invention. Hate how you think, truth is Pool is a game of skill, and if this new fad was so great?

How was Willie Mosconi able to play so good with junky old school stuff?🤪
 
EL Picos said:
Don't be sorry and continue to believe all your marketing facts, it's good for the economy
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Not one thing you stated about spin and shafts is correct. Spin is determined by tip offset, not material or deflection. LD shafts are not the cause of mis-cues either. How people keep believing this nonsense is beyond me.
 
You say you aren't sure of the exact benefits. For a maple LD shaft, the benefits are right in the name. If you like to perform masse shots, an LD shaft is not optimal for that task. If you choose a carbon fiber shaft, those also provide varying degrees of lower deflection plus the added benefit of less maintenance.
 
Well I am waiting to see the next great super shaft.

Remember when Predator Laminated Shaft were the hot ticket, now no one say much about the laminated shafts.
 
garczar said:
Not one thing you stated about spin and shafts is correct. Spin is determined by tip offset, not material or deflection. LD shafts are not the cause of mis-cues either. How people keep believing this nonsense is beyond me.
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You are completely wrong, for the same material the LD shafts are more whippy and not just a bit, you think that a whippy shaft will make as much spin than a stiffer shaft in hitting the cb at the same offset, that's totally wrong and if you don't know that, you miss a lot of things. I have 3 C.F. shafts custom here, 13.3mm at 6 inches of the tip and 11.8mm at tip and a 12.9mm revo can't do the same spin, my 3 shafts are 2.5X more stiff than the revo, the tests are done and in changing players vs shafts. For the same shaft a hard tip will put more spin than a soft tip also.
 
Well gentleman I know had carbon shaft he let me play with his cue one afternoon.

I did not say wow, being polite I said intresting experience.

Interesting means not running, or walking to buy one.

Honestly for recreational players it was nothing that would turn me into world class player.
 
EL Picos said:
You are completely wrong, for the same material the LD shafts are more whippy and not just a bit, you think that a whippy shaft will make as much spin than a stiffer shaft in hitting the cb at the same offset, that's totally wrong and if you don't know that, you miss a lot of things. I have 3 C.F. shafts custom here, 13.3mm at 6 inches of the tip and 11.8mm at tip and a 12.9mm revo can't do the same spin, my 3 shafts are 2.5X more stiff than the revo, the tests are done and in changing players vs shafts. For the same shaft a hard tip will put more spin than a soft tip also.
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Was the same kind of tip on all these shafts? I spin the ball better with my “whippy” Meucci pro with a medium tip than I do with my “stiff” revo 12.4 with a hard tip.
 
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