Looking for Lathe
- Thread starter WildWestBilliar
- Start date
ratcues said:
Well maybe the person I talked to was full of crap. I don't know. But if you called them and thats what said then that's great. I was'nt trying to knock his product or disrespect him or his company. I was just going off of what I was told... Anyways What does Joe's machine do that is so great for cue building that the Hightower Deluxe lathe can't do. And if this machine is so great why dont you see or hear of more people using it. Once again I am not knocking there product, but just because it cost a lot more do not mean that it is a better product. And on that note how many whore stories have you heard about Chris's machines on this forum. I have only heard of one incodent and was an easy fix with the pinion gear. On the other hand the model B I've heard about alignment problems with the head stock and the tail stock, and bad head stock bearing just to name a few things. And these thing happned all with in a year or shortly after. And If it was'nt for the money issues everyone would have big metal lathes. Which in all reality you can get a good metal lathe for less than the porper model B. Its the tooling and some of the adaptions for cue building that will reach in your pocket.
I have owned and used a Porper 'B' and curently have the Unique Cuemaker lathe.
It is impossible to say which lathe is best because each has strong and weak points.
For me the Unique Cuemaker is best but others will feel otherwise.
For example:
The Unique chuck is a collet type with delrin jaws.
Great for accurate centering and safe for the fingers but can not hold material without using the tail stock.
The Porper has a metal jaw chuck that will hold material without any other support but is a bit less accurate and CAN rip up your fingers.
The Porper has a good power feed system but the Unique power feed is not as good and is offered as an option.
The Porper has no bearings on the saddle and the rails are hollow tubes.
The Unique uses brass oil-lite saddle bearings and solid rails.
Both are smooth, quiet, powerful, and worth every dollar they cost.
If I had not got a full size metal lathe I would still have the Porper 'B' lathe in my shop.
One word of advice ... dont go into cue making on the cheap.
You will not like the results and you will end up selling it off and replacing it with something better.
If you want to try to do it all with only one machine you should call Chris Hightower.
See how long it would take to get one of his lathes to you.
I have never used a Hightower lathe but I have done business with Chris and talked to him a lot when I first started making cues.
I think very highly of him.
It is impossible to say which lathe is best because each has strong and weak points.
For me the Unique Cuemaker is best but others will feel otherwise.
For example:
The Unique chuck is a collet type with delrin jaws.
Great for accurate centering and safe for the fingers but can not hold material without using the tail stock.
The Porper has a metal jaw chuck that will hold material without any other support but is a bit less accurate and CAN rip up your fingers.
The Porper has a good power feed system but the Unique power feed is not as good and is offered as an option.
The Porper has no bearings on the saddle and the rails are hollow tubes.
The Unique uses brass oil-lite saddle bearings and solid rails.
Both are smooth, quiet, powerful, and worth every dollar they cost.
If I had not got a full size metal lathe I would still have the Porper 'B' lathe in my shop.
One word of advice ... dont go into cue making on the cheap.
You will not like the results and you will end up selling it off and replacing it with something better.
If you want to try to do it all with only one machine you should call Chris Hightower.
See how long it would take to get one of his lathes to you.
I have never used a Hightower lathe but I have done business with Chris and talked to him a lot when I first started making cues.
I think very highly of him.
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JBCustomCues said:
I bought my Grizzly 37" metal lathe new for $1800 and that was to my door.
It is not the greatest metal lathe but it does what I need to get done.
The big factor that sells the cue lathes like Porper, Unique, and Hightower is portability.
You can pick it up and move it if you need to.
Moving a full size lathe is like moving a pool table.
The Porper has a very sloppy taper bar system and I do not know how anyone can cut a shaft on a Porper with out modifying it somehow.
Also the Porper 'B' comes without some needed tooling like a cutoff tool and a boring bar.
The Router is mounted as a side cutting router and if you want to cut slots for fancy rings you need to modify that.
I bought one new in 2000 and used it for two years before getting my Grizzly metal lathe.
I also had a Unique Taper/Shaper to make up for what the Porper 'B' could not do well.
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I personaly have a Hightower deluxe, Taper/shaper with quite router, cue monster, a small taig machine I use for sanding and other verious tasks, mini metal lathe not counting all my saws, sanders that are set up to do verious tasks. WilleeCue you right about one thing. If your serious about cue making you cant thing cheap but that still does'nt mean that if you buy the porper over the hightower your getting a better machine. Its all in the eye of the beholder. IMHO the only reason to have other machines is to make cue building easier. Theres a lot of wasted time in tear down and set up of a single machine. Not to mention all the wear and tear of doing it all on one machine. But anyways I have never had one problem with my Hightower Deluxe machine and for that matter I have a friend that has had a Hightower machine for 15 years or better and has never had to replace anything but drive belts and pinion gears. Now I think that that would speak for itself.
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I will be in the market to buy a bigger/better lathe this fall/winter and have one question. Does anyone have this onee from Harbor freight http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=46951
And how would it compare to grizzly? Not trying to hijack the thread, my apologies.
Dave
And how would it compare to grizzly? Not trying to hijack the thread, my apologies.
Dave
dave sutton
Banned
WildWestBilliar said:
no both are good but cuesmith mid size and deluxe u can me a full cue on.
both lathes have full legnth cutting where cue companion doesnt.
for the price i think chris' lathes are the best. down the road you need multiple lathe anyway.
unique may be a hair eatier to go to tourneys but mis size is only 4 ft long. not too bad for all the extra functions
JBCustomCues said:
If you ever go to any good sized tourney......such as the SBE, check out what machine almost everyone is using. The proof is in the pudding, so to speak. Out of the 15 or so guys doing repairs, 12 had Model B's.
The Model be has two motors allowing the feedscrew to run without have the spindle run. Can't do that on any other machine that I know of.
Willie talks of the slop in the carriage table, not the taper attachment. I have brought that to Joe's attention and all machine made from now on are corrected.
The Model B can make a cue from square stock to finish turn by itself. There is also a pantograph attachment on its way to me in the next month or so. Keep an eye open for that. Joe had the prototype in Vegas at the trade show.
ratcues said:
The Cue Maker w/ automatic cutter feed and the Hightower w/ power feed can both move without the spindle running. As for making a cue from square the Deluxe can and does do that with ease. The cue maker on the other hand you would have to purchase the tapering atachment. And then you could make a cue from Square. As for the pano attachment thats cool. Although he's kind of the last person on the block to make one. You can get a panograph for $1350 for hightower and $1295 unique. As for the numbers at the trade show I cant verify that. But how about we start a new thread and take a vote. Not about what people like but about what people have. See if we can take a pole if people own a Unique Cue maker, Hightower deluxe, or a Model B, Or metal lathe.
dave sutton
Banned
rhncue said:
i can tell you this... i havent encountered a problem that i couldnt call chris and he didnt walk me right through it.
his customer service is the best it can possibly be...
dave sutton
Banned
WilleeCue said:
very very very well said!!!
It was brought to my attention this morning that I may be taking this thread a little too personally. I think I have and here's why. Joe is my friend and has been since I got into cuemaking. I have had a lot of imput on the machine over the past 18 months and improvements have been made. The Model B is an ever evovling machine and gets better as each year goes by, part of that stems from this forum. I guess I feel that since Joe is not on the forum, the Model B gets knocked in the dirt by people that have never used it.
That being said, starting a poll about which lathe a person uses serves no purpose. There are so many variables that there is no way it could be accurate. How long have you been making cues? What was your starting budget? Did you try any other machines?
It boils down to this; use that machine that you feel comfortable with. Do not go off of what everyone else thinks or says. Each of the "big three" perform as advertised. Visit some shops and talk to the representative for the machine. Find out what YOU want to do and find the machine that fits, not the other way around.
Fair enough?
That being said, starting a poll about which lathe a person uses serves no purpose. There are so many variables that there is no way it could be accurate. How long have you been making cues? What was your starting budget? Did you try any other machines?
It boils down to this; use that machine that you feel comfortable with. Do not go off of what everyone else thinks or says. Each of the "big three" perform as advertised. Visit some shops and talk to the representative for the machine. Find out what YOU want to do and find the machine that fits, not the other way around.
Fair enough?
Ryan,
very well put and we should leave it at that. And on that note I would like to apologize for calling the model B a chinese lathe. Once again I meant no disrespect to Joe or his product. Good luck and good cue making.
very well put and we should leave it at that. And on that note I would like to apologize for calling the model B a chinese lathe. Once again I meant no disrespect to Joe or his product. Good luck and good cue making.
ratcues said:
use that machine that you feel comfortable with.
The problem with this is that it's difficult to try a machine without purchasing it. Since these litle machines cost so much money I would like to see the manufactures STAND BEHIND THERE PROUD NAME and offer it to people on a 30 day trial period! Maybe they already do, but i seriously doubt it.
I am a very new commer here myself. I have purchased probably 15 different machines in the last year. Yes I have had all three companies lathes for a short period of time. I even have a 13x 40 metal lathe. I think there are a lot of advantages to each individual machine. I think the biggest secret, or hardest part about makings cues is setting up the necessary equiptment. The best thing I like about desk top equiptment is that they are so small you can really get up close and personall with it. You can really hovor over it and not warry about getting hurt as bad. For instance on some machine,s I can but on a thick pair of working gloves, spin the motor full throttle and actually grab the head chuck and stop it. On a metal floor lathe,........Well is was nice knowing you. Metal lathes are the nutts if you can set it up right. Currently im not there yet.
The question asked, Was best lath for the money???? They are all good lathes, but I think Hightowers Deluxe get the award here! For right about $3000 you will have a very good start at what you need to build a complete cue.
My advise is to purchase all the litituare that you can find, books, videos, talk to people and what ever else. Pool cue making in my opinion is right up there with RC remote control car hobby as a 13 year old. At 13 its hard to come up with money, I remember wheeling and dealing to get what I wanted. Humm,.... Imagine that,..... I just thought of something at age 38 I am still acting like Im 13. Hummmmm,... Owell ,I guess some thing never change. Just take it slow. Good Luck!
bubsbug said:
Bubs, yer starting to scare me. This is a berry berry berry bad idea. Don't wear gloves around machine tools if you like your hands and fingers, and no long sleeves either ... if you have really long hair it might be wise to wear it up or under a hat. One of these days a weak machine is going to suprise you big time.
Dave, thinks a metal lathe is best, the resale market is stronger, but has never made a cue
Kelly_Guy said:
Agreeed! ETOH, MONEY were involved!! Again, agreed and STUPID!!!! But I also new the limitations and outcome. I was just trying to show someone new some differences, that all!!! A metal Lathe Is a BEAST!! And yes a bench top can hurt you but I would rather take my chance with a BT model over Metal floor lathe. Put another way, Car vs' Semi!! Which would you rather be in when a train hits. Either way it's going to hurt, but how bad!!!
Ok, maybe it was a bad senaro all together I dont like where this is going so Im done! Thanks
One famous cuemaker's assistance's hair got caught in the chuck.Kelly_Guy said:
It wun't pretty as you can imagine.
Joey~Thinks 3/4 HP belt drive lathe is dangerous enough~
Although I've never grabbed the chuck on these small lathes, I know what Bugs is talking about. In 96 or 97 I was at the BCA Trade Show and the Unique machine was first making it's appearance. They had two or three options at different prices concerning chucks and such. I was impressed with the little machine's portability. I met a friend there and talked him into getting one for his bar. I had a shop in Columbus OH at the time in the same mall as Cornfed Reds room. I was doing all of their repair work along with about 6 other rooms in the area. I decided to move back to Cincinnati so Cornfeds wanted to know what they should get to do their own tips and ferrules and such. I told them to get the Unique. A couple of months later I was at Cornfeds to do repair work for the Viking Tour 10,000.00 added end of year tournament. Instead of bringing in my booth and my traveling equipment I used the Unique instead. I was very disappointed to say the least. It was taking me 20 to 25 min. to put on a tip and clean and polish a shaft. After cleaning I use a leather to burnish the shaft and with the Unique I couldn't do this. Trying to burnish only stalled the motor and I couldn't keep it running fast enough to steam out dents.
I don't know if they have replaced these motors since then or not but if they haven't they surely should. Cornfeds don't use their lathe for travelling. They have a little booth set up for it. I told them that they should dump the little sewing machine motor and put on a 1/2 or 3/4 hp motor on it so that it would be usable. I don't know if they ever did or not.
Dick
I don't know if they have replaced these motors since then or not but if they haven't they surely should. Cornfeds don't use their lathe for travelling. They have a little booth set up for it. I told them that they should dump the little sewing machine motor and put on a 1/2 or 3/4 hp motor on it so that it would be usable. I don't know if they ever did or not.
Dick
JoeyInCali said:
I have this terrible image of some poor rookie cuemaker being spun and slapping against the ways each time 'round on Murrays lathe
... they'd only do that once, then we'd have the funeral ... but the lathe would clean up fine.Dave