# Measuring one's skill level

#### LAlouie

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I
C- = 15 ball high run

C = 20

C+ = 25

B- = 35

B = 45

B+ = 55

A- = 75 ( fyi - I'm here with a 78. Never got a 100. But I'm old. LOL )

A = 100

A+ = 150+ ball high run

Using increments of pluses and minuses is too overdone. Just using A B C D open and pro, I'd add 10 balls to each number. Pro level should be at least 250, and open about 160. But yes, 14.1 is the best indicator because as you say it's not subject fortuitous rolls or the layout of a table after the break. If Earl breaks 4 times and never sinks a ball on the break, do we give him a zero for no runs?

In 14.1 YOU create the table. It is your responsibility and yours alone. No one to blame, not even bad rolls or fate, only yourself.

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#### Tramp Steamer

##### One Pocket enthusiast.
Silver Member
More than likely Mr. Capelle's publisher asked him to come up with a few more pages to fill out the book.
The best way I know of to find one's skill level is to play an "A" level player and if he cleans your clock, you're not one of them. Go on to a "B" player and if the result is the same, you're not one of those either. Keep going until you find your own level.

#### BeiberLvr

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
More than likely Mr. Capelle's publisher asked him to come up with a few more pages to fill out the book.
The best way I know of to find one's skill level is to play an "A" level player and if he cleans your clock, you're not one of them. Go on to a "B" player and if the result is the same, you're not one of those either. Keep going until you find your own level.

How do you know the "A" player is really an "A" player?

It's a chicken vs egg dilemma.

#### philly

##### AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
More than likely Mr. Capelle's publisher asked him to come up with a few more pages to fill out the book.
The best way I know of to find one's skill level is to play an "A" level player and if he cleans your clock, you're not one of them. Go on to a "B" player and if the result is the same, you're not one of those either. Keep going until you find your own level.

You said it more succinctly than I did in post #19. Using this method you find out pretty quickly where you stand. :thumbup2:

#### 7forlife

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In my mind, when I think of A-D, I think of what level of ghost a player can beat in rotation (not once, but more than half the time in the long run).

Roughly, I think it comes out to about
Pro: 12 or more
A+: 10
A: 9
A-: 8
B+: 7
B: 6
B-: 5
C: 4
D: 3

Of course, it depends on the equipment, but on a reasonable 9-footer, I think this ranking system generally comes out with about the right grade when people say "A" "B" "C" etc.

I don't understand this system. What's the race, what's the time frame? Does the D player need to beat the ghost 3 times in a week for a few weeks?

#### Tramp Steamer

##### One Pocket enthusiast.
Silver Member
How do you know the "A" player is really an "A" player?

It's a chicken vs egg dilemma.

I know the skill level of all the players who frequent my pool hall, I beg your pardon, my sports bar and grill, and you probably do do. If you don't, you should. Eggs and chickens have nothing do do with it.
If this guy is a league player...then who cares? :smile:

#### ineedaspot

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't think you understood his post, if you did, what you said made no sense. He was proposing a ghost level like "the 4 ball ghost". Meaning that a C player will beat the 4 ball ghost (typically). For instance. That means he breaks and runs 4 balls with ball in hand (there are only 4 balls (or whatever remains after the break) on the table as the game begins). And plays a race to whatever, 10 for instance, like that. Most C players will manage that most of the time. I still don't think it's better than straight pool as a tool to measure ability, but it should be fairly accurate given a large enough sample size. I believe this is most accurate at the highest and lowest levels. The difference between the 6-8 ball ghost is IMO negligible.

Yes, this is correct. Straight pool might be better, but it depends what game people play more. These days, there are a lot more 9-ball players than straight pool players so I think it is probably better to rate people based on a 9-ball type game. Especially if you're talking about matching up in 9-ball or handicapping a 9-ball tournament.

The other problem with high runs is that it depends very heavily on how many times you try. If it's going to be straight-pool based, I'd rather see something like try 10 runs and then take the total, or the biggest, or something like that.

As far as the scale, yeah, it's pretty arbitrary, but then again, if an A is 9 and a C is 4, that means Bs are somewhere in the middle.

#### bdorman

Silver Member
The measurement of playing ability is the same whether you use 9-ball or straight pool as the yardstick. With either one it's just a measure of how well you perform vs. other players, i.e. an "A" is going to be an A regardless of the game. If one game is more difficult than another, it's going to be more difficult for all the players.

It's like asking "Which measure is more accurate: millimeters or inches?"

You can argue all day long about which game is more difficult, but that's a different matter and largely dependent on an individual's skill and personality (in 14.1 you basically play against yourself; you're at the table until you make a mistake. One-pocket is a much better test of how well you handle competitive pressure -- you vs. your opponent).

#### ineedaspot

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't understand this system. What's the race, what's the time frame? Does the D player need to beat the ghost 3 times in a week for a few weeks?

It basically means beating that number ghost more than half the time in the long run. It's not any specific race or time-frame, because anything can happen in just one set.

So a D player would be a slight favorite to beat the 4-ball ghost in say a race to 10, but an underdog to beat the 5-ball ghost. An A player would be a favorite to beat the 9-ball ghost, and so on.

#### Tramp Steamer

##### One Pocket enthusiast.
Silver Member
You said it more succinctly than I did in post #19. Using this method you find out pretty quickly where you stand. :thumbup2:

I'm sorry, philly, my good friend. Sometimes, especially early in the morning, I skim over these things a bit faster than I should. Didn't mean to steal any thunder. :smile:

#### LAlouie

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You can always play bowling.

Bowling is a game where you break a 10ball rack and give yourself 2 misses to run the table, and score with a modified bowling scoring system. It is not break dependent because you run the rack like straight pool. The better you get the more consistently you will run the table without using up a miss or 2 misses. It is a VERY measurable game that can be charted on a week to week basis.

Playing against an opponent, like 9ball, is not as easy to measure because it depends on the opponent, and at the end of the week all you have to go by is "i'm playing more successfully against him now". In bowling, you can chart how many racks you run with no misses, or 1 miss or 2 misses, from week to week

#### fastone371

##### Certifiable
Silver Member
You can always play bowling.

Bowling is a game where you break a 10ball rack and give yourself 2 misses to run the table, and score with a modified bowling scoring system. It is not break dependent because you run the rack like straight pool. The better you get the more consistently you will run the table without using up a miss or 2 misses. It is a VERY measurable game that can be charted on a week to week basis.

Playing against an opponent, like 9ball, is not as easy to measure because it depends on the opponent, and at the end of the week all you have to go by is "i'm playing more successfully against him now". In bowling, you can chart how many racks you run with no misses, or 1 miss or 2 misses, from week to week

I thought if you ran all 10 that was a strike, 1 miss while running all 10 was a spare, and frame ends at 2nd miss if you have one????

#### 3andstop

##### Focus
Silver Member
I thought if you ran all 10 that was a strike, 1 miss while running all 10 was a spare, and frame ends at 2nd miss if you have one????

That sounds like fun. I assume the break is free then running all the remaining balls in 1 inning would be a strike regardless if a ball went in on the break or not. Missing once gives you the first half number for a possible spare.

Completing the rest of the balls without a miss results in a spare. A second miss is an open frame.

I like that as a great game to play to improve also.