my apa story

B

baller4lifeii

Registered
Hello all, I am relatively new to posting on the forum, though I have been stalking in the b/g for a while. I want to share my story, and along with it hope to possibly gain a better understanding on how the APA rating works.

I've been playing pool for about 1.5 years and recently joined an apa 8-ball league. Prior to joining, one of the house pros pegged me as a 4, possibly 5. Regardless, I started out as a 4 since apparently that's how it works. Here's my story.

W1-SL4: played against a 6 (race 3-5) and shot quite poorly due to nerves. But the guy (who is super nice!) also haven't played in 2-3 years, so I barely won with a score of 3-4.
W2-SL4: played another 6 who had a bad week and luckily won 3-1.
W3-SL4: people said I should have moved up, but our LO was out of town so I stayed a 4. Anyway, I played another 6 who had a bad week and got out 3-0.
W4-SL6: I jumped to a 6, which is understandable with my good streaks. I played a strong 3 (race 5-2) and barely got out 5-1.
W5-SL6: played a 6 and had one of my best weeks. Thanks to my 2 lucky 8-on-the-break's, I won 5-0 in 9 innings (once-in-a-lifetime kind of week for me).
W6-SL7: Understandably, I went to a 7. But clearly I cannot keep a 7 speed, I was slaughtered by a good 6 (race 5-4) and lost 3-4.
W7-SL6: The loss dropped me back to a 6. I played a 5 this past week (race 5-4) and once again _barely_ got out 5-3. He was on the hill at 3-3 and I had to take the last 2 to squeak by. No good runs or anything, it was a very scrappy game.

This brings us to the current week. I have league in a few hours and found out I was bumped to a 7 again. This surprised me. I definitely didn't shine and actually shot quite poorly. I honestly think there are other 6's in our league that shoot much better than me, even some possible 5's. There's one guy who had also won 6 out of 7 matches, all against other 6's and 7's. He remains a 6 the whole time.

I definitely don't shoot at a 7 speed. I didn't even think I could hang with the 6's. People tell me that our LO doesn't usually make people 7's unless he has seen the players in person. This puts me in a bind because I get slaughtered as a 7 and I feel bad to my team for losing. I will still try my best, but I already know it won't be pretty.

My teammates say my rating is volatile because I am new. Regardless, I am not whining (much). I love playing in the APA so far, and like socializing with other teams. I just want to know more about how it works because I don't think my previous week's performance deserves a bump to a 7. So my question for those that are familiar with the system is: does my record indicate a 7 speed? Oh and most of my matches average like 3-4 innings. I've had 1 break-n-run and 2 8-on-the-breaks. And if it matters, we play on 8-foot tables.

Thanks.

P.S. Hopefully this is in the right forum. I will update how my second match as a 7 go tonight. Keeping fingers crossed :).
 
All male players start off in the APA as 4s, and you move up or down after that. It takes about 10 matches before your level is stabilized.

Previously, league operators have posted that the grading system goes to to 1/10th level. So, you could be a 4.9 playing a 5.1, while the sheet for your captain just shows a SL4 and SL5.

My previous APA team captain told me your max ball run roughly correspond to your level. Seeing that you had a break and run (8-balls), maybe you are a SL 7 compared to other players in your area. The APA gives out patches for break and run.

The APA 8-ball handicap scale only goes up to SL7, while APA 9-ball goes up to SL10. Not sure how APA 9-ball handicap translate into ABCD. I asked a few SL7s in my area, and they ranged from C+ to open when they play in 9-ball tournaments. You could have a C+ playing an A or Open level, but both are SL7 in 8-ball and play an even race.

What exactly are you trying to get out of playing APA league. If you're looking to improve, maybe you already outgrown APA 8-ball. Is there APA 9-ball, or more advanced level leagues in your area?
 
I'd say ur a strong 5 good 6 speed that being said all league opp pep are diff I've seen a guy be a 6 for years and beat the opp guy bad and went too 7 just cuz of that I'd give it a lil bit once u have few months in then u will be set it tends too jump around a lot at first but sounds like ur doing pretty good the same things happen too me I'm now staying at a 6 but a lot of teams are fussing over me so ill prob be going up too 7 and staying there good luck in the apa hope u make it too vegas!
 
Whether or not luck was on your side, I'd think that the computer would see it as somebody that's competitive as a 6. Being that early into it all, it isn't surprising that those performances have you teetering on a 7. Get some more matches under your belt and I'd guess that you'll settle into a mid or low 6. Good luck, shoot well and have fun.
 
Apa

Stop playing high level players, if u r under 10 games your rating , skill level... Undetermined... You sound like a good 5 maybe a starter 6.... Make many innings . Keep defensive low, if u have to make a safe make sure the other player can't make a shot which will give them a defensive as well. Any and all shots that are not intended to be made, yes even a kick is defensive. Every shot on the table has to have intent to if they don't use enough power on a kick or bank there's no intent... Defensive...... Mark it all.. This will help with sand bag, and rate the players the right way... I hope this helped.
Just my 2 cents Dom
 
i agree with the others. it sounds like you are a strong 5 or a good 6.

dont really worry about your handicap.... lol coming from me, i was worrying about my handicap for awhile and just recently decided to shoot my best and let it be what it is.

oh! keep an eye out for double d on here.:grin:
 
I have only been shooting pool seriously for about a year. I played around on the pool tables while stationed in Japan but never really took it serious.

Like the OP I started playing APA 8ball and thus far I am 5 and 1 and i started as a SL4. My first match was against a SL6 and I won that match 3-1. My second match was against a SL3 and that day I was thinking more about Alice going down the rabbit hole and not focused much on playing pool so I lost 2-2.

the 3rd and 4th matches were against SL5 and I won both 3-0 one with a rackless patch. My last math this past Tuesday was against a 2( I did not know men could be ranked so low) it was not a slaughter and the innings were pretty high because he would always seem to get a great leave after missing a shot and moving the balls all over the table. So I pushed my balls around till he finally left me an opening and got the win 4-0.

Thus far I am still ranked a SL4 which in my mind is about right because I do not consider myself a strong shooter but I am a good shot maker. I have a lot to learn as far knowing what English to put on shots to get the position I need to run out consistently.

My captain thinks I will move up after my tenth match which is fine by me I want to get better. Apparently my LO waits till the tenth match to get an idea of how a person shoots before moving them up or down..
 
Rio19 said:
I have only been shooting pool seriously for about a year. I played around on the pool tables while stationed in Japan but never really took it serious.

Like the OP I started playing APA 8ball and thus far I am 5 and 1 and i started as a SL4. My first match was against a SL6 and I won that match 3-1. My second match was against a SL3 and that day I was thinking more about Alice going down the rabbit hole and not focused much on playing pool so I lost 2-2.

the 3rd and 4th matches were against SL5 and I won both 3-0 one with a rackless patch. My last math this past Tuesday was against a 2( I did not know men could be ranked so low) it was not a slaughter and the innings were pretty high because he would always seem to get a great leave after missing a shot and moving the balls all over the table. So I pushed my balls around till he finally left me an opening and got the win 4-0.

Thus far I am still ranked a SL4 which in my mind is about right because I do not consider myself a strong shooter but I am a good shot maker. I have a lot to learn as far knowing what English to put on shots to get the position I need to run out consistently.

My captain thinks I will move up after my tenth match which is fine by me I want to get better. Apparently my LO waits till the tenth match to get an idea of how a person shoots before moving them up or down..
Click to expand...

Unless your LO is completely off the rails and going against the entire system, there is no "waiting", it's done by the computer. He or she may wait that long before manually adjusting anyone, but if the computer thinks you are supposed to move, it doesn't care how many matches you've played.

That having been said, the more matches you play, the more info the computer has when calculating where you should be.

As to the OP, I'm in agreement with the majority here. Based on the descriptions given here, he appears to be in the area of SL6, or perhaps a high level SL5. Without much more history, it's really hard to tell, and as has been discussed, people can bounce around a lot until they have a solid match history for a baseline.
 
ctyhntr said:
The APA gives out patches for break and run.
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For 50 cents! And then he can hang each one on his case! (Don't hang them on your case. It's cheesy).

Which brings up my silly story when I re-entered the APA a few years ago. Someone said that a B&R was 50 cents. I had four the first night. I thought they meant the APA was going to PAY ME 50 cents per B&R.

Freddie <~~~thought I was going to own a mansion and a yacht
 
You come off like you're trying a little too hard to be humble and won't honestly rate your own ability.

You "barely" got out 5-1? You "got lucky" 3-1, 3-0, 5-0?
Come off it dude! :)

The house pro underestimated you. Good thing to keep in mind if you ever wanted to gamble with him.

As for the part about 'the LO doesn't make people sevens unless he's seen them play'... I can't say for sure, but it sounds fishy. There's a user on here, APA Operator, who has answered a lot of questions on how the rating works. He can't go into full detail but basically, it's a mathematical thing and as much as possible they try to take 'judgment calls' out of it. The league operator is not supposed to interfere with the ranking the computer comes up with. I asked him if the LO can choose to manually raise people. This was his answer:

CreeDo said:
]Do you manually tweak ratings ever, when the win rate doesn't seem to jibe with the balls per inning / opponent rating / whatever?
Click to expand...

APA Operator said:
Yes, I do. Not often (probably less than 1%)
Click to expand...

He also said later in the same thread that while he can occasionally move somebody up, you are not allowed to manually lower people below the computer's rating without calling the central office and pleading for the change and making a big production out of it.
 
While your handicap seems to have fluctated a little more than I would have thought for the games played to date, be patient. At 20 games in you should be at a solid handicap if you play to win and your opponent also plays to win, with both of you marking the sheets correctly. The handicap system used by the APA is very good.
 
update

Thank you all for your comments. Last night I played a strong 6 (at least that's what my teammates informed me). I was killed 2-4. I couldn't get used to the table. From the lag, I thought the table was way slow, but then some shots still kept rolling :confused:. It took until almost the end of the match for me to realize it was the rails that played slow and refused to take any english. I have no idea why I couldn't figure that out sooner.

At that speed, I would have lost regardless of my rating. I think the mental block about not being able to keep up with a 7 speed that I put on myself got me (plus the table got to me a bit too). I completely dogged it and gave away at least 2 games. The guy also shot very well!

Out of that beating, plus all of your comments, came the lesson that I need to just play my game and forget about the rating. I also realized my position plays may be too dependent on english; and when the rails don't take them, I couldn't get where I wanted. All good lessons to know/learn, now the hard part ...

Thanks again. :thumbup:
 
One of the local leagues that started up did offer $10 for every break and run made during the season. Then it was changed to C or below, and now is awarded only to the highest total of B&R in the season.

If they are going to reward B&R, I think it should be on a sliding scale based on the contrast of difficulty for the level.

Cornerman said:
For 50 cents! And then he can hang each one on his case! (Don't hang them on your case. It's cheesy).

Which brings up my silly story when I re-entered the APA a few years ago. Someone said that a B&R was 50 cents. I had four the first night. I thought they meant the APA was going to PAY ME 50 cents per B&R.

Freddie <~~~thought I was going to own a mansion and a yacht
Click to expand...
 
Your captain should have never made you play all those 6's. that was the first mistake. Then it take around 30 games to establish your handicap. Keep losing if you cant play as a 7. Your handicap will eventually establish.

Then there will always be the super strong 4's,5's, and 6's that will just roll though you. Welcome to the apa

On a side note someone said with correct score keeping. That's a big problem with apa. Most people don't keep the score correct inning wise and don't mark safes.
 
Lots of good advice here. As stated, your rank is based on your best 10 matches out of your last 20.

You mention your wins and your ranking, but not the innings/match which is what your rank is based on. A 7 averages 2 or less innings per game, so you must have been shooting pretty well to work your way up to a 7 that quickly. As long as your team can afford a new player ranked that high, which it sounds like they can, enjoy it.

-Dave
 
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