my thoughts on gambling

StormHotRod300

StormHotRod300

BigSexy
Silver Member
Ok, after reading Kerry Impson's thread on gambling, along with everyone else's response, it started to make me think as to why people feel the need to bet big on a game of pool?

Now i see it all the time at the pool hall i goto, mainly its regulars who either dont play well, or the ones who do play very good.

Now the ones who dont play well, or newbies, only want to get better, and i see no problem with that. But what happens is they might ask a better player if they can join them, to learn or something. And the better player only wants to play for $$ most of the time cheap sets, race to 3 for 10$ or 5 for 20$.

The average newbie is just some guy trying to get better, and probably doesnt have much more than 20 or 30$ on him at the time, and probably wants to practice for a couple hours. So if he bets on these quick games and lose where does it leave him? with no money and not being able to practice.

Now for most of the regulars who play very good, they see it as making it worth thier TIME, thats why they only want to play for 20$ sets or more. Plus its in thier favor because the newbie will probably get nervous and miss more balls in the quick race to 3 or 5 for money.

I myself would play basically anyone for time, because yes its cheap, and if you lose what are you out of? a couple bucks, maybe you learn something from the better player?

A friend of mine who is rated AA, played against me all the time, for time, or just to play. And he RARELY GAMBLED, why? because he didnt want to!! he has nothing to prove to anyone.

Now a couple days ago, two guys i know from the pool hall where complaining that its almost impossible to get a decent money game going. Well the problem is they wanna take money from all the newbies or average players, and dont want to play anyone at the same skill level, which there are plenty of in the area. Why? because they know thier chances of winning any money is slim, because they will probably break even.

If more guys like these would play lower skilled players for something as simple as Table Time, they would probably be helping thier cause to get more money games. Why? because its going to give the lower players a chance to get better or see someone better play and learn how to move around the table easier. Plus as they get better they are going to want to play for more than Table Time, and start to bet 10$ or 20$ on races to 3 or 5.

I know this because i ran into the same thing when i was trying to learn how to play pool better. I couldnt get any of these better players to play against me for Time. So i would just go and practice, for a couple hours.

Does it mean i dont like to gamble a little on pool? no, i just want a fair match. Plus i dont gamble beyond what i can afford. And i pick n choose who i wanna gamble with. Its my money and i will gamble when i want to and with who i want too.
 
well there are a couple things you addressed in your post.

the part about guys not wanting to match up with people in their same skill level happens all the time. ignore them, they are just out to rob someone.

as far as the experienced players only wanting to play for something.......well thats a different story.

most people who have gotten to a level where they are playing fairly "good" pool got there by a TON of table time, and a TON of money.

i personally have spent countless hours practicing, and quite a bit gambling, lessons, table time.......etc in money.

so now that i've gotten to a fairly decent level........what good is it for me to play someone that does not give me a challenge? it does my game no good, i could get more out of practicing. it only helps the other person's game........its a one way street.

now, say we play a race to 7 or 11 for 20(anything less than that, and you're just robbing someone). now i have something going for me, i'm probably gonna make a little, not much, but a little. also, i'm going to pay attention to the game, because there is money on it.

now its a two way street, the lesser player gets experience, and i get to make some of the money back that i gave away doing the same thing when i was in their shoes. and really, all i'll do with that money, is go play someone better than me for cheap sets. you gotta feed off the little fish to feed the big fish.........thats the quickest way to get better.

also, by playing cheap sets, the lesser player isn't losing a ton of money, and they WILL LEARN FASTER. if they start losing 40 here and 40 there, they will learn quicker than not losing anything at all.



any player that is trying to learn, but doesn't want to shell out a little time and cash.........aint gonna make it.


i don't want to make any assumptions about you personally, but its been my experience, that people that have a problem with the better players wanting to play for a little cash fits into a couple categories:

doesn't really take the game as serious as they claim.

hasn't reached a level that they realize that playing someone of a lesser level really doesn't do anything for your game, in fact it may hurt it.

or hasn't put in enough table time and money to know what its like to put that much into something, and then give it away for free.


in closing, i'll just say this.............if you put all your time and money into something...........would you give it away for free???? i don't........

VAP
 
I don't gamble and don't feel I have to justify that, suffice it to say I agree with most of what the original poster said. Let me add one thing that gambling is ok only as long as the only people lossing are the people doing the gambling. When it starts to take bread out of the mouths of their family then it's wrong.
My father was an alcoholic. The fact that he kept a roof over our heads and food in our bellys did not make up for what he deprived us of financially and spiritually. The same holds true for gamblers. If they keep their family clothed and sheltered, but deprive them of a more decent life style, then their gambling is wrong.
The fact that some people are alcoholics doesn't mean nobody should drink and the fact that some people are degenerate gamblers doesn't mean nobody should gamble. However, people who gamble should always be watchful of their gambling behaviour and it's effects upon the overall quality of their lives and the overall quality of lives of others around them.
 
Both of the above post are interesting. Personally I do not play for money, I play for the fun of it.

Also when money comes into any game you get what I call the CHEAT FACTOR.

Those who will do anything with in reason to win. Money has ruined many friendships.

If you must play for money do not play for big buck with friends, as you may soon not have too many friends if you win all the time.

Also GAMBLING on Pool, Cards, Horses, etc. has ruined many live, Do Not Gamble if you my Gamble any more than you can afford to loose.
 
catscradle said:
I don't gamble and don't feel I have to justify that, suffice it to say I agree with most of what the original poster said. Let me add one thing that gambling is ok only as long as the only people lossing are the people doing the gambling. When it starts to take bread out of the mouths of their family then it's wrong.
My father was an alcoholic. The fact that he kept a roof over our heads and food in our bellys did not make up for what he deprived us of financially and spiritually. The same holds true for gamblers. If they keep their family clothed and sheltered, but deprive them of a more decent life style, then their gambling is wrong.
The fact that some people are alcoholics doesn't mean nobody should drink and the fact that some people are degenerate gamblers doesn't mean nobody should gamble. However, people who gamble should always be watchful of their gambling behaviour and it's effects upon the overall quality of their lives and the overall quality of lives of others around them.
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Thanks for one of the better posts I've ever read on the forum.
 
All three of the above posts are valid. And all look at gambling from different viewpoints. It all depends on what kind of gambling you are talking about.

I know a guy who gambles because he is addicted. It is not winning or losing money that concerns him, only the action of gambling. And of course he keeps gambling until he is broke.

Another very good 1 pocket player will only play $2 games. He doesn't want to hurt anyone but he wants them to pay for his lessons, albiet a paultry sum.

Another guy matches up only when everything is in his favor. Will play as long as he wins but if he loses a couple of matches he quits immediately.

And there is the guy who plays $20 - $50 sets against the very best just to assess his level of play. And pick up a few pointers. He doesn't really have a chance of winning, he only wants to see if his game is improving. Will play 2-4 sets every couple of months.

And of course VAP has a very valid point. When someone puts in a lot of time, energy, money to get good at pool, he really does not want to just give all that valuable knowledge away. And that fact is not reached until a person gets to that level of pool. You just don't know what is behind that door until you open it and go inside.

And of course none of this applies to the pros. They are at a completly different level in the game of pool.

Jake
 
All of the previous replies make good points. I personally feel that gambling is the best way to improve a person's game. But I feel that it only improves your game if you bet with even or better players. As far as the fishermen in all pool halls that constantly gamble with suckers, sooner or later they will also become a sucker. For example, there is a guy at my local ph that I gambled with a couple months ago and we were a dead even match. But since then I have played with better players while he was constantly hustling no-gamers. Sure he's made more money than me the past couple of months, but his level of play has dropped drastically while mine has improved. I can now give this same guy a substantial spot and win when were we playing even only 2 months ago. While I do gamble and support those that don't get carried away with it, I'm more concerned with improving and gambling just seems to be the best way to do it for me. For a while though I got in a state where I didn't even want to play unless there was money on it. I noticed this was a problem and stopped gambling for a while. It was a much needed break and helped me regain the love of the game and now when I gamble I play even better because I realize that the fun of the game is the most important aspect. The only problem I see with gambling is sometimes it can make players lose passion for the game. Sorry for the long post.
 
catscradle said:
I don't gamble and don't feel I have to justify that, suffice it to say I agree with most of what the original poster said. Let me add one thing that gambling is ok only as long as the only people lossing are the people doing the gambling. When it starts to take bread out of the mouths of their family then it's wrong.
My father was an alcoholic. The fact that he kept a roof over our heads and food in our bellys did not make up for what he deprived us of financially and spiritually. The same holds true for gamblers. If they keep their family clothed and sheltered, but deprive them of a more decent life style, then their gambling is wrong.
The fact that some people are alcoholics doesn't mean nobody should drink and the fact that some people are degenerate gamblers doesn't mean nobody should gamble. However, people who gamble should always be watchful of their gambling behaviour and it's effects upon the overall quality of their lives and the overall quality of lives of others around them.
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Tap- Tap... great post!
 
Blackjack said:
Tap- Tap... great post!
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BlackJack,

I hope there are no hard feelings because of our posts in the earlier thread. Keep the good billiard info coming. I look forward to your insight into the game.

Mike
 
Mike Templeton said:
BlackJack,

I hope there are no hard feelings because of our posts in the earlier thread. Keep the good billiard info coming. I look forward to your insight into the game.

Mike
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No hard feelings at all. I respect and understand your opinions and your point of view on many subjects. None of us see things from exactly the same perspective, and it makes for great conversation.
 
OldHasBeen said:
But Boy, I Sure Do Like Betting On Myself In A Game Of Pool OR Gin!

TY & GL
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OHB,

If you ever get down this way, I know where there are several "high stakes" gin games. Let me know and I will try to steer you a little. One place I know is a bar from the old school like they were in the 70's. Same type of atmosphere as then. They also bet pool pretty high as well but it's harder to get them down at pool. You would fit in perfectly.

Mike
 
OldHasBeen said:
But Boy, I Sure Do Like Betting On Myself In A Game Of Pool OR Gin!

TY & GL
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I will stake Joe Kerr in some small or large games of internet gin with you. You would just have to teach us what we need to set to to be able to play. I think it will be fun for Joe and I'll love sweating the action. Let me know if we can work something out. amc
 
amc4 said:
I will stake Joe Kerr in some small or large games of internet gin with you. You would just have to teach us what we need to set to to be able to play. I think it will be fun for Joe and I'll love sweating the action. Let me know if we can work something out. amc
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AMC4 - SEE POST LISTED - "Gambling to be the best" OR call me @ (800) 645-3913, anytime. - Tom

TY & GL
 
Blackjack said:
No hard feelings at all. I respect and understand your opinions and your point of view on many subjects. None of us see things from exactly the same perspective, and it makes for great conversation.
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And me being 32 inches tall and butt level as I call it...I have a totally different view than most.

For me to gamble, it has to be money I am willing to flush down a toilet and not even blink.

Shorty
 
I keep reading in several replies here about the money a person has spent to get as good at the game as they are. I have spent that money. And a lot of it, to include table time, lessons, equipment, beer, and lots of cheap games.

According to what your saying, 'now it's my turn', right. Not really, What happened to the enjoyment of the game. What happened to pride and 'I beat you because I'm better than you are at the game'. That is what I want for my practice and money that I've spent. I want to be better at the game than you are. That's all. I didn't spend that time and money so that I could get the money back later at some point. If you don't play as well as me and you want a game, all you have to do is ask. If along the way I can help you improve your game, great.

I'm not a rich person. Probably slightly lower middle class. I don't have enough money to gamble much without sacrificing some of my families expectations. So, Yes throwing away $50.00 is too much. Spending $50.00 on some entertainment is not to much. Gambling is more like throwing it away than spending for entertainment. And I don't play pool to make money either. I play pool because I like to compete. In other words, if I ever did win a Planet Pool event, do you think I'd give a shit about the money? Money would be gone in a very short period of time. I'd rather have a trophy. Give me something I can sit on the mantle and look at 20 years from now when I can't get out of my wheel chair and think 'I played pretty good that day'.
 
I'm not a rich person. Probably slightly lower middle class. I don't have enough money to gamble much without sacrificing some of my families expectations. So said:
I'm with ya on this one Captain my Captain!
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CaptainJR said:
I keep reading in several replies here about the money a person has spent to get as good at the game as they are. I have spent that money. And a lot of it, to include table time, lessons, equipment, beer, and lots of cheap games.

According to what your saying, 'now it's my turn', right. Not really, What happened to the enjoyment of the game. What happened to pride and 'I beat you because I'm better than you are at the game'. That is what I want for my practice and money that I've spent. I want to be better at the game than you are. That's all. I didn't spend that time and money so that I could get the money back later at some point. If you don't play as well as me and you want a game, all you have to do is ask. If along the way I can help you improve your game, great.

I'm not a rich person. Probably slightly lower middle class. I don't have enough money to gamble much without sacrificing some of my families expectations. So, Yes throwing away $50.00 is too much. Spending $50.00 on some entertainment is not to much. Gambling is more like throwing it away than spending for entertainment. And I don't play pool to make money either. I play pool because I like to compete. In other words, if I ever did win a Planet Pool event, do you think I'd give a shit about the money? Money would be gone in a very short period of time. I'd rather have a trophy. Give me something I can sit on the mantle and look at 20 years from now when I can't get out of my wheel chair and think 'I played pretty good that day'.
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You still have the love of the game. I have seen so many great upcoming players that start gambling and then lose their love for the game. They only love the gamble and the action. Pool becomes boring to them. I still like to play just for fun or in tournaments.
Chris
www.hightowercues.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com
 
Ok, i have no problem with the more experienced player making some money off the lesser player, as long as its in good taste and the lesser player is given a fair chance.


Now i probably should have mentioned this in the first post, With alot of the better players, they wanna take the lesser players money in one set. I have encountered this many times, where someone ask's me how much money i have on me, and i might lie or claim i have less on me than what i really do. But if was to say i have 25$ on me, they always say, well lets play race to 5 for 25$.

Now if thats really all i have on me, i think its stupid for me to play for 25$ because if i lose, i have no chance of winning my money back AKA having barrells.

The last time i played a lesser player for money, was probably in Feb, and i was giving him the call 7, wild 8 in some cheap sets, race to 3 for 5$ now, it really made me bare down and play smart. And its not the money, But it was the fact that if i missed on a ball, i was probably going to lose. Now i ended up taking 15$ off the kid, and he was a kid, being 17yrs old lol. But in the end i told him to practice 3 different shots you will commonly face when getting down to the last 3 balls.

And he practiced those shots for about and hour and actually thanked me when he was done. So it made me feel like i did my good deed of the day :)

Now the last time i played someone of even skill for money was three weeks ago, and we started out the same, race to 3 for 5$ did that for 3 sets, and i was up 1 set, then we went to 3 for 10$ and i won the next 3 sets, and he left lol. I myself didnt think i was going to win like i did, he didnt win a game in the last 4 sets lol. But he had been nagging me to play for a while so i finally had to step up and play just to shut him up. lol

dave
 
Now i kinda rambled on in the last post,

But i dont mind gambling with someone more experienced, or seeing someone do it, but if I am going to gamble with a more experienced player, dont try and play me for all my $ in one set, and i do the same for lesser players, i dont wanna take all thier money in one set, cuz then they have no way of winning it back, and probably wont, come back to me for a re-match.
 
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