Non-Pool Industry Sponsors?????

Tom In Cincy

Tom In Cincy

AKA SactownTom
Silver Member
Where are they?

Every Billiard magazine I've seen only has POOL industy sponsors advertisements.

When you walk into a pool room, the neon signs are mostly provided free or at a small cost from the beverage and/or food industry in the area.

Why don't we have Buick/Ford/GM ads in this pool magazines? don't pool players buy cars? What about Walmart? I know just about every pool player has a monthly trip to Walmart or Sams or Costco..

Wendys, McDonalds, Taco Bell, PIZZA parlors all over.. .pool players patronize these fast food spots all the time...

CocaCola and Pepsi... and all those Speed Energy drinks.. can be found in most pool halls.

Why don't the magazines have other retail ads besides pool related industry vendors?

Is it that political? Is the Pool industry that protective of its domain?

I am just curious if I am the only one that cares about outside sponsor ship?

Pool has added Casinos in the last 10+ years.. that's a plus...
 
If the players are already going to Walmart, McDonald's, Wendy's, etc. already, then advertising them in the pool magazines would not really do much to increase sales. There really are not many people who read pool magazines, so big company's probably think it would be a waste to advertise in them....and they are probably right.

By the way, I think this is the first thread on AZ about outside sponsors...:thumbup:
 
I think the answer to your question is a very easy one. Corporate America spends their advertising dollar where they get the most return on their advertising dollar investment.

The reason Corporate America spend big bucks on advertising on NHRA Drag Racing , NASCAR, NFL Football, ML Baseball, NBA Basketball, PGA Golf, etc. Is the people who attend these have high credit score, extra income to spend, and are willing to spend dollars supporting these sports, and entertainment venues.

Pool Player as a group do not have the AVERAGE CREDIT SCORE of the fans who support the sports above. Yes we have Pool people who are very well off but IMHO they are a minority!

Trust me the Corporate America's Bean Counters spend many hundred of thousand dollars annually to get this information. Who has money to spend and on what.

Where would you set up a NEW CAR Ferrari, Porsche, Mercedes Benz Dealership if you had the choice?

Newport Beach CA, Beverly Hills CA, or East LA, CA or Watts LA, CA.

Think you got more chances of success in Newport Beach CA, Beverly Hills CA, where the wealthy live, than East LA, CA or Watts LA, CA.

JMHO! :smile:
 
As always Tom, you bring up valid points. I'm not sure the people that sell advertising in those magazines spend much time talking to the outside sponsors but it would be worth a shot.

The VA state 9 Ball Championships were here a few weeks ago and Joshua Dickerson was able to secure an outside sponsor. nTrust Wealth Management took a shot at the suggestion of the room owner, who is a money manager, and was one of the key sponsors. We made a big deal of it on the live stream, too.

You can see the sponsors at www.va-pool.com and catch some of the matches.

Seems to me, if I were the promoter of a Major tournament, I'd be talking to the various energy drink companies (5 hour energy sponsored the Va State champs a few years ago) as well as soft drinks and fast food places. Maybe they realize pool players are already buying that stuff and the money invested wouldn't bring in additional business. I can't say for sure but I'm not sure any one has done a demographic study on pool tournament watchers (i.e. pool players) to determine if it would be worth the money.

Brian in VA
 
Demographics, that is exactly the problem.

Major advertisers see it this way.

This is a knowledgeable guesstimate.

Billiard magazine ad cost $800 - $1,500
Distribution per month about 12 -20,000

Major publication ad cost $3,500 - 10,000 per month
Distribution per month anywhere between 150,000 - 500,000

Spend 10K and get your advertising for about 2cents per reader or spend $1,500 and get if for about 4X that cost.

The 4X price + the fact of the readership is why they don't advertise but definitely the biggest factor is the distribution numbers. + How many billiard magazines do you see sitting in DR offices or any waiting rooms for that matter. The big guys factor in the multiple readership # when considering which publications to advertise in.

That's my best educated guesstimate ...
 
geno said:
Demographics, that is exactly the problem.

Major advertisers see it this way.

This is a knowledgeable guesstimate.

Billiard magazine ad cost $800 - $1,500
Distribution per month about 12 -20,000

Major publication ad cost $3,500 - 10,000 per month
Distribution per month anywhere between 150,000 - 500,000

Spend 10K and get your advertising for about 2cents per reader or spend $1,500 and get if for about 4X that cost.

The 4X price + the fact of the readership is why they don't advertise but definitely the biggest factor is the distribution numbers. + How many billiard magazines do you see sitting in DR offices or any waiting rooms for that matter. The big guys factor in the multiple readership # when considering which publications to advertise in.

That's my best educated guesstimate ...
Click to expand...

Great post earns you a GREENIE
 
You and our buddy Joshua have always represented pool's best interests on the East Coast.

I've always thought that local sponsors are the key to a successful event.

I don't understand why regional promoters don't go after the local $$$. It is there, I know it. I got local retailers to donate $$$ and provide the signs/banners to hang around the pool hall when we have tournaments. It isn't that difficult.

Thanks Brian.



Brian in VA said:
As always Tom, you bring up valid points. I'm not sure the people that sell advertising in those magazines spend much time talking to the outside sponsors but it would be worth a shot.

The VA state 9 Ball Championships were here a few weeks ago and Joshua Dickerson was able to secure an outside sponsor. nTrust Wealth Management took a shot at the suggestion of the room owner, who is a money manager, and was one of the key sponsors. We made a big deal of it on the live stream, too.

You can see the sponsors at www.va-pool.com and catch some of the matches.

Seems to me, if I were the promoter of a Major tournament, I'd be talking to the various energy drink companies (5 hour energy sponsored the Va State champs a few years ago) as well as soft drinks and fast food places. Maybe they realize pool players are already buying that stuff and the money invested wouldn't bring in additional business. I can't say for sure but I'm not sure any one has done a demographic study on pool tournament watchers (i.e. pool players) to determine if it would be worth the money.

Brian in VA
Click to expand...
 
Good guesstimate... but why would the pool industry spend the money on ads that reach only a small amount of people interested in pool tournament results that are old and training articles that are a hair above basic instructions 101?

scratching my head.. and asking why?

geno said:
Demographics, that is exactly the problem.

Major advertisers see it this way.

This is a knowledgeable guesstimate.

Billiard magazine ad cost $800 - $1,500
Distribution per month about 12 -20,000

Major publication ad cost $3,500 - 10,000 per month
Distribution per month anywhere between 150,000 - 500,000

Spend 10K and get your advertising for about 2cents per reader or spend $1,500 and get if for about 4X that cost.

The 4X price + the fact of the readership is why they don't advertise but definitely the biggest factor is the distribution numbers. + How many billiard magazines do you see sitting in DR offices or any waiting rooms for that matter. The big guys factor in the multiple readership # when considering which publications to advertise in.

That's my best educated guesstimate ...
Click to expand...
 
:grin: But it is the first to address why the top 3 magazines all advertise the same products over and over.. and all the same pool industry giants keep spending the monthly cost doing ads that reach maybe 8,000 reader total?




rossaroni said:
If the players are already going to Walmart, McDonald's, Wendy's, etc. already, then advertising them in the pool magazines would not really do much to increase sales. There really are not many people who read pool magazines, so big company's probably think it would be a waste to advertise in them....and they are probably right.

By the way, I think this is the first thread on AZ about outside sponsors...:thumbup:
Click to expand...
 
Pool N Outside Sponsors

geno said:
Demographics, that is exactly the problem.

Major advertisers see it this way.

This is a knowledgeable guesstimate.

Billiard magazine ad cost $800 - $1,500
Distribution per month about 12 -20,000

Major publication ad cost $3,500 - 10,000 per month
Distribution per month anywhere between 150,000 - 500,000

Spend 10K and get your advertising for about 2cents per reader or spend $1,500 and get if for about 4X that cost.

The 4X price + the fact of the readership is why they don't advertise but definitely the biggest factor is the distribution numbers. + How many billiard magazines do you see sitting in DR offices or any waiting rooms for that matter. The big guys factor in the multiple readership # when considering which publications to advertise in.

That's my best educated guesstimate ...
Click to expand...


You know, I think alot of companys wouldn't mine doing some advertising in a Billiard magizine if they were just ask by the right people.

When my back was really bad (still is) I was at the doctor's office alot, so I would bring a hunting magizine for myself to read and would leave them, wasn't long, the doctors office had a subscrpition to most that I had left there, lol.....I was surprized at later visits to see them.

So I guess what I'm saying is that Billiard magizines need to give out a few magizines here and there to different places where they surely will be read, maybe they will pick up more subscribers, then maybe more outside sponsors will run ad's.


David Harcrow
 
Tom In Cincy said:
I've always thought that local sponsors are the key to a successful event.

I don't understand why regional promoters don't go after the local $$$. It is there, I know it. I got local retailers to donate $$$ and provide the signs/banners to hang around the pool hall when we have tournaments. It isn't that difficult.

Thanks Brian.
Click to expand...

Hmm, let me see, why don't regional tours go after the local advertisers?

OK, that's a simple answer. Most if not all Regional tour directors live more that 100 miles away if not a couple of hundred miles away from many of the events they run so they cant and have no time to hit local business because they are not in the area. Additionally, local room owners are either to busy to do the same or are not into that and if they were or knew how to successfully do it they probably wouldn't be hiring regional tours to come into there establishments in the 1st place.

I have had a little experience in this department and with what I know I would think that it would be an easy task but it really isn't that easy if you only have a few days to work on each events local business. It takes a lot of time, leg and phone work and is expodentially more difficult when you are not familiar with the local business.

It;s a great idea but not practical for regional tours. However, it is very practical for local rooms to do when running there own events.

There are a few more tricks room owners could also use that I have told to many room owners. It is this simple. START WITH GETTING SPONSORSHIP MONEY/PRODUCTS from the vendors you currently work with and buy from in your business. Most of the time they are very willing to throw something into the pot.
 
The BCA Trade Org. just signed a major sponsorship with Coca Cola....SPF=randyg
 
randyg said:
The BCA Trade Org. just signed a major sponsorship with Coca Cola....SPF=randyg
Click to expand...

You should probably read the details of the deal a bit more closely. It isn't a sponsorship, it's a group buying deal. And it wasn't Coca Cola signing on with the BCA, it was the BCA creating a new marketing entity called Bankshot Entertainment.

Not that anyone will listen though. Everyone just hears what they want to hear, which is why this guy thinks that Coca Cola is now a sponsor of the BCA. Oh wait, now I'm beginning to remember why I rarely chime in here anymore. Whatev.
 
Pool has many people who mimic the antic of this GREAT TENNIS Player who keep Corporate America at more than an arms length from wanting any thing to do with Pool, IMHO.
john-mcenroe-420-420x0.jpg


Than you have the Pool payer creating a great image for the sport. Who dress down, and are found at most pool rooms.
bum.jpg
 
Once upon a time Big Tobacco and Booze companies sponsored sports including pool. They either got banned from advertising and sponsorship or became regulated on "how they could sponsor and advertise".:mad:

Nowadays it's insurance/ investment, home improvement/tools, fast food, military, casinos/resorts and shipping companies sponsoring things.
 
I posted something on this yesterday in another topic, not sure where (OMG I must be getting old) but to me it would seem some basics we are dealing with here.

Too many asscoiations all vying for the same business none seems to be winning the race to be the top or only dog, do they even want to be? Imagine if every Conference in the NFL for instance were run by different associations it would never work, would it?

There is very little TV coverage of even major Pool events, TV coverage = sponsorship. Again what would the NFL, NBA or MLB be like with no TV coverage. There is even less coverage by the media in general. If we could get local or regional Media coverage of events it would be a stepping stone in the right direction. Promoters get with your local and regional media folks for your tournaments, get with them when local people are playing in major tournaments. Local TV in our area is lapping up stories of local people with good stories to tell. I am in a dialogue with them now about the Mosconi Cup in London, telling them that a local, Johnny Archer, will almost certainly be in the team. If I have to call them myself from London every night with results I will, if they would just show them. When you see some of the lame sports stuff on TV, like a camel race from the Australian Outback or some horse race from Mongolia surely we can beat them to TV airtime?

Corporate America likes to see it's $$ spent where they reach mass markets. Where their money reaches the most people for least the amount of money per person. Pool does have a good market, numbers wise, but no vehicle to get it there, until that happens it will remain where it is IMHO.
 
Tom In Cincy said:
Where are they?

Every Billiard magazine I've seen only has POOL industy sponsors advertisements.

When you walk into a pool room, the neon signs are mostly provided free or at a small cost from the beverage and/or food industry in the area.

Why don't we have Buick/Ford/GM ads in this pool magazines? don't pool players buy cars? What about Walmart? I know just about every pool player has a monthly trip to Walmart or Sams or Costco..

Wendys, McDonalds, Taco Bell, PIZZA parlors all over.. .pool players patronize these fast food spots all the time...

CocaCola and Pepsi... and all those Speed Energy drinks.. can be found in most pool halls.

Why don't the magazines have other retail ads besides pool related industry vendors?

Is it that political? Is the Pool industry that protective of its domain?

I am just curious if I am the only one that cares about outside sponsor ship?

Pool has added Casinos in the last 10+ years.. that's a plus...
Click to expand...

It's not just the pool magazines. The company that I work for produces magazines and we've had a noticeable drop in book size over the last few years. Advertisors have been dropping out like crazy from all of our titles. The "bigger" titles like a Vanity Fair still have lots of ad sales but the smaller titles are struggling. We used to see several GM ads every month on the back covers of books, but I haven't seen a single one since the governments involvement. Most of the titles that we produce have a large circulation(millions monthly) and the cost to advertise can cost hundreds of thousands each month. I'd love to see more outside industries get involved in pool, but from what I've seen, Companies have really cut back on their advertising and what's left, is going to where they get the best bang for their buck.
 
a good point, tougher than ever now!

sliprock said:
It's not just the pool magazines. The company that I work for produces magazines and we've had a noticeable drop in book size over the last few years. Advertisors have been dropping out like crazy from all of our titles. The "bigger" titles like a Vanity Fair still have lots of ad sales but the smaller titles are struggling. We used to see several GM ads every month on the back covers of books, but I haven't seen a single one since the governments involvement. Most of the titles that we produce have a large circulation(millions monthly) and the cost to advertise can cost hundreds of thousands each month. I'd love to see more outside industries get involved in pool, but from what I've seen, Companies have really cut back on their advertising and what's left, is going to where they get the best bang for their buck.
Click to expand...

There was a time period when I spent $25K-$30K a year advertising my local business. I also threw out a lot of advertising/community service type money that might get me a little good will but the chance of getting bang for my buck was zero.

When things got tight I cut back on my real advertising and targeted it a lot better and I cut back even more sharply on my things that were advertising in name only. When the economy is strong many local businesses will throw a dollar to a pool tournament if somebody just calls on them looking respectable and acting professional. When dollars are tight it is much harder to extract anything from local businesses and I suspect that holds true all of the way up the line to major businesses.

Hu
 
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