OB1 let down

[Ballistic Billiards]

nice

Royce,
Thanks for taking the time to post regarding this.

-cOOp

 

[Burtus]

joint and tip

Did you try them all on the same cue?
My ob1 is a radial pin on a flat faced wood:wood joint.
You're using a lucasi which should be a uni-loc quick release
with a steel collar and a piloted insert in the shaft.
Big difference in the "feel" there.

I did try them on the same butt. It's a Lucasi with UniLoc pin and piloted insert. I don't know if the collar plays a big roll in feel but I think the collar is coco rather than steel. Picture is attached in case I'm wrong about it.

In any case, this shaft is too whippy and the tip sucks.
I'm going to put on a new tip and have the rest of the work
done that I'm planning on and I'll post a new thread then.
(that is if I don't sell the cue with the radial pin first)

Mine has the Talisman medium Tip as the other stock OB-1 shafts.

 

[Ballistic Billiards]

nice

Royce,
Thanks for taking the time to post regarding this.

-cOOp

ps. this shaft imparts a ridiculous amount of spin. (or maybe it's me)

 

[Vahmurka]

OB1-NO CAN BE

Sorry for off-topic but for me it reads much like Obi-Van Kenobi

 

[PKM]

Sorry for off-topic but for me it reads much like Obi-Van Kenobi

That's just silly

 

[Tennesseejoe]

The whole idea behind providing less deflecion is the shaft moves (or flexes if you will) so that the ball isn't pushed off line. If the shaft flexes then it makes since to me that it would feel a little more whippy, or like a Meucci as you stated. .

It is my understanding that deflection is caused by the weight of the first 7 or 8 inches of the shaft and has nothing to do with the the shaft flexing. A small diameter shaft should have more flex and should weight less but it is the weight that determines deflection.

I would appreciate any information to clear this up. Thanks.

 

[Ballistic Billiards]

flick

It is my understanding that deflection is caused by the weight of the first 7 or 8 inches of the shaft and has nothing to do with the the shaft flexing. A small diameter shaft should have more flex and should weight less but it is the weight that determines deflection.

I would appreciate any information to clear this up. Thanks.

You're right Joe, and you're wrong.

the "end mass" or weight in the end of the shaft affects cue ball deflection
in that the lighter the end of the shaft the faster IT(the shaft) deflects
away from the ball allowing the ball to go straight.

As opposed to a heavy ended shaft that won't get out of the way,
hence, the cue ball must deflect away from the shaft.

flex has little to do with reducing deflection, neither does tip diameter.

you can have a 12mm that's stiffer (read: different taper) and therefore flexes less than a 13mm.

there's a lot of terminology that's not common to the different manufacturers that makes
this all seem very confusing.

 

[RBLilly]

You're right Joe, and you're wrong.

the "end mass" or weight in the end of the shaft affects cue ball deflection
in that the lighter the end of the shaft the faster IT(the shaft) deflects
away from the ball allowing the ball to go straight.

As opposed to a heavy ended shaft that won't get out of the way,
hence, the cue ball must deflect away from the shaft.

flex has little to do with reducing deflection, neither does tip diameter.

you can have a 12mm that's stiffer (read: different taper) and therefore flexes less than a 13mm.

there's a lot of terminology that's not common to the different manufacturers that makes
this all seem very confusing.

Well put Coop! I agree with you a 100%.

It isn't very confusing to me, but the way all the different companies are explaining it isn't consistent, so it confuses several people.

Here is the easy way to think of it. If you can put more spin on the cue ball and not drive the cue ball off line then that is the cue I want! It requires less adjustment when applying a lot of English. So therefore it is an advantage in my eyes!

You are also right on this shaft being able to put an insane amount of spin on the ball. I was having fun showing it to my wife last night. She couldn't believe the way the measles ball was spinning on some stun shots or stop shots. It was a lot of fun!

I also got corrected by Royce that pad is Carbon Fiber not Phenolic. (I don't know why I had it in my head it was Phenolic.) It is to protect the balsa wood and the tendon and ferrule when putting on tips.

Thanks Royce for commenting and setting us straight. You have an awesome product, and I don't care if there are people that don't like it. You can't please everyone! But you sure as hell pleased me, and I will tell everyone I can about your shafts!

OB-1 company is the only one I don't mind getting the shaft from!!!! LMAO

 

[Tennesseejoe]

You're right Joe, and you're wrong.

the "end mass" or weight in the end of the shaft affects cue ball deflection
in that the lighter the end of the shaft the faster IT(the shaft) deflects
away from the ball allowing the ball to go straight.

As opposed to a heavy ended shaft that won't get out of the way,
hence, the cue ball must deflect away from the shaft.

flex has little to do with reducing deflection, neither does tip diameter.

you can have a 12mm that's stiffer (read: different taper) and therefore flexes less than a 13mm.

there's a lot of terminology that's not common to the different manufacturers that makes
this all seem very confusing.[/QUOTEA small diameter shaft should have more flex and should weight less but it is the weight that determines deflection.
]


Thanks for your interesting reply. In my statement, "A small diameter shaft should have more flex and should weight less but it is the weight that determines deflection", I was not implying a change in taper. I was more concerned with the end mass weight. Most Maple grown in the North has a higher density, is heavier, and more rigid. I believe that a fast growing softer Maple would be better for shaft wood. Using Balsa wood for a shaft could greatly reduce deflection due to its weight but the softness would be a critical drawback. I'm not sure where I was wrong in my statement.

 

[Jal]

....flex has little to do with reducing deflection..

I think it does. Stiffness is an integral part of endmass. The stiffer the shaft, the more endmass that comes into play (ie, lateral forces are transmitted faster and farther down the shaft during impact). Some people, for instance, seem to notice different amounts of squirt depending on the orientation of the shaft. Here you have the "same" apparent endmass, but the portion of the shaft that bends takes on a slightly different shape depending on orientation. That's why Predator uses radial laminations - to reduce inconsistencies - I believe.

Jim

 

[McKinneyMiner]

As Seymore so eloquently expressed...
It's not the arrow... It's the archer.

Let me jump in for minute as the ultimate example of one who has always believed in the archer v arrow theory.

I have never played with a Predator shaft. I have never played with a Tiger shaft and I have never played with an I shaft either.

In fact, I never would have played with an OB-1 except that tons of players in my league (Royce included) played with them and I got curious.

So, when one came up for sale at a steep discount here on AZB I bought it and put it on my McDermott. And I will say that I will never go back.

I'm not sure what it is about the shaft (more spin, more control), but I honestly believe it makes me a better player.

A year ago you could never have convinced me of that, but now I am solidly in Royce's camp and will tell anyone who will listen.

The OB-1 is a great shaft. Plain and simple.

And Royce doesn't pay me a nickel for saying so.

 

[rack'em zach'em]

I Love My Ob-1

Let me jump in for minute as the ultimate example of one who has always believed in the archer v arrow theory.

I have never played with a Predator shaft. I have never played with a Tiger shaft and I have never played with an I shaft either.

In fact, I never would have played with an OB-1 except that tons of players in my league (Royce included) played with them and I got curious.

So, when one came up for sale at a steep discount here on AZB I bought it and put it on my McDermott. And I will say that I will never go back.

I'm not sure what it is about the shaft (more spin, more control), but I honestly believe it makes me a better player.

A year ago you could never have convinced me of that, but now I am solidly in Royce's camp and will tell anyone who will listen.

The OB-1 is a great shaft. Plain and simple.

And Royce doesn't pay me a nickle for saying so.

i'LL NEVER PLAY WITH ANYTHING ELSE

 

[MikeJanis]

coopdeville, it's not the taper or the tip. This week was the 1st time I saw the inside of the OB-1 at the BCA Trade Show. The shaft is filled with a foam rubber core that dampens the vibrations and absorbs the sound that you feel and hear with other shafts. Also, the proprietary ferrule and balsa wood dowel give a low mass to the front of the cue which dramatically lowers deflection. These factors along with the overall construction of the shaft give it it's unique "soft" feel. Believe me, it is a very solid shaft but the construction techniques and materials used are what makes it feel "soft". Changing the Tip or Taper will most likely not change the way it feels.

Additionally, I know of several cue makers in the industry that deconstructed the OB-1 shaft. All of their opinions are that the OB-1 is the best constucted low deflection shaft they have ever seen.

Respectfully,

Mike Janis

I got an OB1 a few weeks ago and I'm really disappointed
with it... don't jump on me just yet.

I'm going to change the taper and the tip and see how I feel about
it after that.

It has about an 18-20" pro taper and a Triangle tip @ 12.75mm.
Is this what everyone else has and likes?
I think it feels like a meucci which is very far from my taste in
a shaft.

I'm told that the triangle might be no good, chalk slides right off of it,
and it'll be replaced.

It's a blank shaft and needs finished at the joint so I can have my guy
change the taper for me at the same time no problem.

The super long taper is just too "soft" for me, feels like a wet noodle,
but the shaft definitely performs.

 

[RBLilly]

i'LL NEVER PLAY WITH ANYTHING ELSE

I will never play with anything else again either!

And Royce doesn't give me a dime for singing their praises. I just believe in them so firmly that I won't buy anything else.

I have played and owned all 3 of the I shafts from McDermott, and I have played with a 314 and Z. I don't care for any of them like I do my OB-1 shafts. Again I won't use anything else now!

 

[gulfportdoc]

I should metion that one of the characteristics of our cue shaft is that it does spin the cue ball better than most. What most players find is that after adjusting they cue closer to the center of the cue ball. Cueing closer to the center will definitely reduce the "Shaking" you are talking about, and help you make more balls too.

Royce, I just yesterday tried out my new 12.75 mm OB-1 30" shaft, on my Phillippi butt. I was astonished at the complete absence of squirt!! I even attempted to cause deflection by placing the CB on the foot spot, then shooting at the center diamond on the head rail, using maximum side english with a hard stroke. There was absolutely no discernable squirt!! The CB hit the center diamond every time.

I've never used any brand of "low deflection" shaft before. I've only used cuemaker shafts or commercial production shafts, so I couldn't offer a comparison; but for one to perform like this, there could be none better.

I had to force myself to actually aim at the contact point for once when using english, rather than aiming wide to accdommodate the deflection.

I too notice the soft hit. I don't know if that would feel differently if a harder tip were installed.

I was having a little trouble with draw, so I imagine I'll have to force myself to aim a little lower on the CB. I'm used to a 12 mm tip, so the adjustments will come.

You've got a great invention there!

Art "Doc" Tripp

 

[RBLilly]

Royce, I just yesterday tried out my new 12.75 mm OB-1 30" shaft, on my Phillippi butt. I was astonished at the complete absence of squirt!! I even attempted to cause deflection by placing the CB on the foot spot, then shooting at the center diamond on the head rail, using maximum side english with a hard stroke. There was absolutely no discernable squirt!! The CB hit the center diamond every time.

I've never used any brand of "low deflection" shaft before. I've only used cuemaker shafts or commercial production shafts, so I couldn't offer a comparison; but for one to perform like this, there could be none better.

I had to force myself to actually aim at the contact point for once when using english, rather than aiming wide to accdommodate the deflection.

I too notice the soft hit. I don't know if that would feel differently if a harder tip were installed.

I was having a little trouble with draw, so I imagine I'll have to force myself to aim a little lower on the CB. I'm used to a 12 mm tip, so the adjustments will come.

You've got a great invention there!

Art "Doc" Tripp

You should have ordered it from Royce at his smallest tip size of 12.2mm!

Send it back and have him take it down for you!

I can draw this thing the entire length of the table with no problems!

I absolutely love this shaft!

As long as they are in business I intend to keep buying their shafts!

I know what you mean about no squirt, this thing is amazing! I can't say that about any other low deflection shaft I have tried.

I have a sniper tip put on both of mine OB-1 shafts, and it does hit soft but not too soft. It feels just right! (Well it feels just right for me! LOL ).

 

[Flex]

Royce, I just yesterday tried out my new 12.75 mm OB-1 30" shaft, on my Phillippi butt. I was astonished at the complete absence of squirt!! I even attempted to cause deflection by placing the CB on the foot spot, then shooting at the center diamond on the head rail, using maximum side english with a hard stroke. There was absolutely no discernable squirt!! The CB hit the center diamond every time.

When you shot it as described, where was the cue tip aiming? Was it aimed straight ahead, not at the diamond, but one half a cue ball's width to the right of the diamond, or AT the diamond?

Flex

 

[ScottW]

I figure, as with all low-deflection shafts, you gotta give yourself some time to get used to how it plays.

I love my OB-1. It won me a little tournament last night, including a couple of B&Rs (one being the final game of the whole thing, mwah!).

 

[Patrick Johnson]

If you like a stiff hitting cue, then you may not like the OB-1 cause some people say it hits soft. However it is stiffer than any of my McDermott or I-shafts.

However I have snipers on both of my OB-1 shafts, and love they way they play. I have mine down to about 12.2mm though!

The whole idea behind providing less deflecion is the shaft moves (or flexes if you will) so that the ball isn't pushed off line. If the shaft flexes then it makes since to me that it would feel a little more whippy, or like a Meucci as you stated. (However I don't feel it hits like a Meucci at all, and I feel it is a bit stiffer hit than any of my McDermott shafts! Not too stiff, but perfect!)

If the shaft is a blank shaft how do you know you don't like it though? If it isn't on a cue so you can try it how do you get an accurate feel for the shaft? I am just curious because you said it is a blank shaft, but that it definitely performs and you don't like the feel of it? How would you know if you can't put it on the butt of a cue?

Do you mean it came with threads, but that you need to have your cue maker match it up to your joint and butt? Then I could see how you were able to test it. I am just curious is why I asked.

If it were blank then it wouldn't have any threads, so that your cue maker would have to finish it totally.

"The whole idea behind providing less deflecion is the shaft moves (or flexes if you will) so that the ball isn't pushed off line."

I'm no scientist, but I understand from players who are scientists that shaft flexibility has little to do with cue ball deflection. They say it's all about the amount of "mass" in the first several inches at the tip end - which is why Predator (and now others) are hollowed out there. Meuccis, for instance, are not considered low deflection cues.

For another instance, I use a stiff shaft with a "conical" taper (no parallel "pro taper" part at all). However, because it's hollow near the tip and because the tip is very small in diameter (10mm), there's relatively little mass in the tip area and therefore little cue ball deflection.

pj
chgo

 

[Ballistic Billiards]

right

"The whole idea behind providing less deflecion is the shaft moves (or flexes if you will) so that the ball isn't pushed off line."

I'm no scientist, but I understand from players who are scientists that shaft flexibility has little to do with cue ball deflection. They say it's all about the amount of "mass" in the first several inches at the tip end - which is why Predator (and now others) are hollowed out there. Meuccis, for instance, are not considered low deflection cues.

For another instance, I use a stiff shaft with a "conical" taper (no parallel "pro taper" part at all). However, because it's hollow near the tip and because the tip is very small in diameter (10mm), there's relatively little mass in the tip area and therefore little cue ball deflection.

pj
chgo

I concur.
with everything except that part about meucci.
his cues are OBVIOUSLY the lowest deflection shafts on the planet.
Just ask him, or watch his video.