Only pool tournament players............

[hang-the-9]

Please answer this question ONLY if you play in pool tournaments.

I would like to get a consensus of opinion. It seems that I regularly play in pool tournaments and playing at different establishments it is VERY DIFFICULT to get a tight rack playing 9 ball or 10 ball.

If you play in pool tournaments, would you pay, $5 to use a Magic Rack or some other template rack, just for the event?

If not, what fee would you pay to use BRAND NEW template rack? And if you have a particular brand that you like to use, please state which one you like best.

If you don't believe in the Magic Rack and feel it should not be used in tournament play, please state why?

I've been thinking a lot about why the template racks are not used more often and think that the main reason is that some of the better rackers don't want to put everyone else on the same level playing field and will ***** about having it in the tournaments.

Also, if they said you could use a Magic Rack or other approved template rack for racking purposes or another kind of rack, say a standard wood, metal of even plastic rack, would you use the standard rack?

Thanks for responses from all of you tournament players.

JoeyA

For lower level tournaments (say D-C-B events) the Magic Rack or such are great. For pro and A level tournaments without some adjustment it makes the break way too easy to make a ball and play shape on the next one. I think that is why many tournaments like Snookers stopped using it for 9 ball. With players like Mike Dechaine, Tom (shorty), some other A+ players, magic rack with winner breaks was getting to be unfair for the lower level players that just could not keep up with almost a guaranteed ball or 3 on the break plus a top level player running out the rack after that.

Magic Rack with 10 Ball is a great thing though.
I think just that many players just have no idea what a template rack is, especialy the D and C players, they seem to be against it just on the fact that it looks odd if you never seen it.

 

[JoeyA]

For lower level tournaments (say D-C-B events) the Magic Rack or such are great. For pro and A level tournaments without some adjustment it makes the break way too easy to make a ball and play shape on the next one. I think that is why many tournaments like Snookers stopped using it for 9 ball. With players like Mike Dechaine, Tom (shorty), some other A+ players, magic rack with winner breaks was getting to be unfair for the lower level players that just could not keep up with almost a guaranteed ball or 3 on the break plus a top level player running out the rack after that.

Magic Rack with 10 Ball is a great thing though.
I think just that many players just have no idea what a template rack is, especialy the D and C players, they seem to be against it just on the fact that it looks odd if you never seen it.

Yah,
I am thinking:

Magic Rack
Alternate Break Format
9 ball on the spot
3 balls past the head string on the break
9 ball doesn't count on the break in the bottom two pockets.
Break from the box.




JoeyA

P.S. Anyone have any better suggestions (using the Magic Rack)

 

[rhatten]

You could also use marks on the table for the MR, Solo other and use 1.5 balls above the spot (or 1 ball above) hell we could flip for the position at the start of the match to add in "luck" to the whole match. Many ways to have a fair game. Break is important sure but we all should get to break the same 'ball set' to start a match. imo/ Accidental cheats are not a good excuse either for pool ... kinda like a piss-in to win 2 matches to win a tournament. Nobody likes to loose *(or win) on a pissed in ball imo..

Make the game fair so all will be willing to play more. r

 

[Atlatlien]

The reasons I don't like the templates are for the ones already discussed, i.e. wired balls and repeating layouts for higher skilled players, but also because I've seen balls change direction when they roll across the template slow after the break. It's usually slight, but it definitely doesn't happen at all when using a triangle rack.

I also like reading the gaps, to be honest... :sorry:

 

[JoeyA]

The reasons I don't like the templates are for the ones already discussed, i.e. wired balls and repeating layouts for higher skilled players, but also because I've seen balls change direction when they roll across the template slow after the break. It's usually slight, but it definitely doesn't happen at all when using a triangle rack.

I also like reading the gaps, to be honest... :sorry:

An honest man.

JoeyA

 

[Aaron_S]

For a 10-ball tournament, I would gladly pay $5 to use a magic rack or similar template. I think I would pass if it were a 9-ball tournament - just don't like seeing the wing ball wired every time. I'd rather fork out $20 to have a neutral racker for each match.

Aaron

 

[BryanB]

If you play in pool tournaments, would you pay, $5 to use a Magic Rack or some other template rack, just for the event?

NO

If not, what fee would you pay to use BRAND NEW template rack? And if you have a particular brand that you like to use, please state which one you like best.

Would not pay anything to use a rack other than what was provided

If you don't believe in the Magic Rack and feel it should not be used in tournament play, please state why?

As long as both players are using the same I have no issue

Also, if they said you could use a Magic Rack or other approved template rack for racking purposes or another kind of rack, say a standard wood, metal of even plastic rack, would you use the standard rack?

I like my Delta 13 rack over any wood or plastic house rack

 

[The Renfro]

Please answer this question ONLY if you play in pool tournaments.

I would like to get a consensus of opinion. It seems that I regularly play in pool tournaments and playing at different establishments it is VERY DIFFICULT to get a tight rack playing 9 ball or 10 ball.

If you play in pool tournaments, would you pay, $5 to use a Magic Rack or some other template rack, just for the event?

No reason to pay to use templates Joey.. I will send Accu-Racks out for free when asked as will Mark Griffin on the Magic Racks..



If not, what fee would you pay to use BRAND NEW template rack? And if you have a particular brand that you like to use, please state which one you like best.

Only one template I will use if the balls have wear =P

If you don't believe in the Magic Rack and feel it should not be used in tournament play, please state why?

If the balls are new and the cloth is not beat in give me a good rack like a delta 13 or an unworn diamond wood rack and put me in the rack my own zone... I make/sell templates because they are needed in most tourneys not because that's what I prefer..

I've been thinking a lot about why the template racks are not used more often and think that the main reason is that some of the better rackers don't want to put everyone else on the same level playing field and will ***** about having it in the tournaments.
Imagine that.... It's way worse opponent racks


Also, if they said you could use a Magic Rack or other approved template rack for racking purposes or another kind of rack, say a standard wood, metal of even plastic rack, would you use the standard rack?
Only if I was racking for them and not me.....
Thanks for responses from all of you tournament players.

JoeyA

We used our SOLO template for 261 racks at the Make it Happen event... There were zero slugs... Fricking Earl Strickland had nothing but good things to say along with 4 of the other best players on the planet... If those guys approve... It's time to reevaluate if you don't.....

 

[sjharr]

Absolutely nothing belongs on the playing surface of the table but balls.
Period.
Template racks - as good as their intention is - stay on the playing surface and do cause misdirection of balls that can sometimes lead to altering the natural path of a rolling ball, which can potentially change the outcome of a game.

Obstacles, other than spheres on the playing surface introduce even more intricacies into a game which I feel needs to be kept as simple as possible, not made more difficult.

That being said, I would not personally enjoy an added fee for a certain type of rack. Include any additional equipment fees in the tournament green fees.

Steve H.

 

[hang-the-9]

Absolutely nothing belongs on the playing surface of the table but balls.
Period.
Template racks - as good as their intention is - stay on the playing surface and do cause misdirection of balls that can sometimes lead to altering the natural path of a rolling ball, which can potentially change the outcome of a game.

Obstacles, other than spheres on the playing surface introduce even more intricacies into a game which I feel needs to be kept as simple as possible, not made more difficult.

That being said, I would not personally enjoy an added fee for a certain type of rack. Include any additional equipment fees in the tournament green fees.

Steve H.

I have seen table rolls affect outcome on the game way more often than a magic rack. Don't know how many times I've seen crappy tables pull a ball into or away from a pocket or mess up your position when it hits a slate line and all of a sudden the cueball takes a 45% turn to hook you. Magic rack very rarely affects the balls at all, usually when they are rolling slowly to the rack. Most of the time I can move the rack before anything gets to it.

 

[hang-the-9]

So you're saying if you paid $5 for a Magic Rack, you would want designated rackers to rack the balls. I'm not sure if the money makes sense or not.

64 players at $5 a rack is only $320. I don't know how many designated rackers you can get for a two day tournament.

I guess designated rackers are a completely different subject because of the cost involved.

With Magic Rack, rack your own, 9 ball on the spot, 3 balls past the head string, alternate break, seems to be my preference at least at this point. Also maybe 2 ball at the back of the rack.......

Still open to other suggestions. Just trying to find something that will lower the whine from everyone and increase participation in pool tournaments.

JoeyA

NO to 3 balls past the string. 2 maybe.

 

[Paul8ball]

Joey I agree with your proposed racking changes. I agree that the break must be from a defined box, 9 ball on the spot, 3 balls above the side pocket, and a template is needed. We, at Diamond, are contemplating changes to racking the 9 Ball portion of the upcoming Derby City Classic. Nothing is finalized yet.

I have used every rack template out there that I am aware of. The best one, hands down, is the Rack Tight. It consists of small rings that are glued to the cloth, similar to the spot. These rings are extremely thin, 1 mm. They do not cause the ball to deflect and they have the advantage of not permitting the rack to be tilted to wire a wing ball, when racking the 9 ball on the spot.

Grace Nakamura imports these from Japan. It has been used successfully in Japanese Pro tournaments for some time. She has set up Cue and Case to distribute these in the USA.

Another way to make the break more fair is to rack ten balls (standard 10 ball rack.) After the break, remove the 10 ball and go from there. That completely removes the issue of wiring the wing balls. In addition, I think it would be a strong incentive to break hard. In this scenario, I would still recommend using a rack template.

 

[rhatten]

Joey I agree with your proposed racking changes. I agree that the break must be from a defined box, 9 ball on the spot, 3 balls above the side pocket, and a template is needed. We, at Diamond, are contemplating changes to racking the 9 Ball portion of the upcoming Derby City Classic. Nothing is finalized yet.

I have used every rack template out there that I am aware of. The best one, hands down, is the Rack Tight. It consists of small rings that are glued to the cloth, similar to the spot. These rings are extremely thin, 1 mm. They do not cause the ball to deflect and they have the advantage of not permitting the rack to be tilted to wire a wing ball, when racking the 9 ball on the spot.

Grace Nakamura imports these from Japan. It has been used successfully in Japanese Pro tournaments for some time. She has set up Cue and Case to distribute these in the USA.

Another way to make the break more fair is to rack ten balls (standard 10 ball rack.) After the break, remove the 10 ball and go from there. That completely removes the issue of wiring the wing balls. In addition, I think it would be a strong incentive to break hard. In this scenario, I would still recommend using a rack template.

If you do I know of 4 more players that Will make the trip this year in any weather...

Randy

 

[The Renfro]

Joey I agree with your proposed racking changes. I agree that the break must be from a defined box, 9 ball on the spot, 3 balls above the side pocket, and a template is needed. We, at Diamond, are contemplating changes to racking the 9 Ball portion of the upcoming Derby City Classic. Nothing is finalized yet.

I have used every rack template out there that I am aware of. The best one, hands down, is the Rack Tight. It consists of small rings that are glued to the cloth, similar to the spot. These rings are extremely thin, 1 mm. They do not cause the ball to deflect and they have the advantage of not permitting the rack to be tilted to wire a wing ball, when racking the 9 ball on the spot.

Grace Nakamura imports these from Japan. It has been used successfully in Japanese Pro tournaments for some time. She has set up Cue and Case to distribute these in the USA.

Another way to make the break more fair is to rack ten balls (standard 10 ball rack.) After the break, remove the 10 ball and go from there. That completely removes the issue of wiring the wing balls. In addition, I think it would be a strong incentive to break hard. In this scenario, I would still recommend using a rack template.

hmmm no order history of a Paul in Indiana for Accu-Racks...

As far as RackTight not effecting the balls.... A human hair can effect the path of a slow rolling ball and Gracie's reinforcers STAY on the table all the time so even more chance for them to cause problems... Go buy some 3m Hole Reinforcers and you can racktight your table yourself and see.... They are thinner than 1mm but if they can hold a ball in place they can alter a slow roller.....

They really won't work well in a pool room or at a tournament simply because there is usually different wear on the different ball sets.. May work today but tomorrow if you get a different rack of balls and go to the same table assignment you may have problems...

At home you can move the reinforcers in on the corners or where needed and are good to go since you likely only have one set of ball to worry about... I had them on my old table a few years ago until I started to play one-pocket... No template is useful for 1pocket or 14.1.....