Optical Illusions???

B

benny2

Registered
Great Forum!

I've been playing for approximately one year and have improved a great deal. However, I still struggle at times pocketing balls. When cutting balls to the right, I tend to over cut the shot, and when cutting to the left I frequently under cut the shot.:confused:

I've tried to make sure my alignment is always the same, and that my stroke is straight. I can usually get around this by hitting my cuts to the right fuller and vice versa, but sometimes my guesstimate of the necessary compensation is wrong.

Does anyone else have this problem? Could this be a technique problem? BTW - I'm right eye dominate and have that eye over the cue.

Thanks in advance for any insight you can provide.

Ben
 
It sounds to me like you are gripping the cue very tight at the end of your stroke and when you tighten the grip the cue hits the wrong spot on the cueball. Just for the heck of it try holding the cue losely on two fingers not against your palm with thumb hanging down the side, this straightend out my cutshots and straightins more than anything else in 40 years.--Leonard
 
You could try this drill for pocketing progressively harder cut shots.

Put an OB on the spot and the place the cueball one ball from the side rail, opposite the third diamond. Pocket the OB ball.

Put another OB on the spot and place the cueball one ball from the side rail, only this time put the cueball one ball closer toward the end rail.

Each time move the cueball one ball closer toward the end rail so you can pocket balls until you get past the second diamond.

If you miss start over. I think you will get a good idea why you are missing if you do it progressively from the third diamond each time. IMO
 
Leonard,

Thanks for the response.. I do have trouble finding the center of the cue ball at times. I'll try to monitor my grip during the stroke to see if I'm inadvertently tightening-up through the shot.

I'm not sure that would explain why my cuts to the left seem to need more cut, and cuts to the right need less than my eye sees!

Any instructors seen this issue before?

Thanks,
Ben
 
Hi Ben,

It sounds like you are serious about improving your game and if so, let me give you the best advice you'll ever get. Reguloars here may be tired of this post because they've seen it from me before but get a full day lesson from a top instructor or teaching pro.

There are several who post here regularly and some who travel.

The very issue you are struggling with is EXACTLY the sort of thing...among many others that a top teacher would spot in 5 minutes.

And trust me on this, the kind of rock solid "mechanics" and basic fundamentals you will learn in a single day will remain with you the rest of your life.

You will SIGNIFICANTLY speed up your learning process because all you are doing now is "grooving your flaws" which over time, will be that much harder to overcome.

I urge you to inquire here about available instructors who are near or may be traveling to your area. You will get replies.

Also, please know that I have no affiliation with any pool instructor and am not one myself. I am only giving you this advice because it is correct!!!

(-:
Jim
 
Ben,
I see this kind of thing quite often. The most frequent cause is having your head positioned off center over the cue. This changes the way you see your aiming line. It sounds like you are always hitting a little left of where you think you are aiming. A minor shift of your head position to the left might allow you to see the actual line more precisely. Other than that, I would probably need to see you shoot in order to see if there is any other issue like steering the shot, or a slight sideways movement of your cue during the stroke.
Steve
 
I see this kind of thing quite often. The most frequent cause is having your head positioned off center over the cue.
Click to expand...

Wrong head position is my first guess too, but I don't think the head necessarily should be centered over the stick. The correct head position is different for every player, and centering it over the stick could be wrong too - it could be what's wrong now.

This changes the way you see your aiming line. It sounds like you are always hitting a little left of where you think you are aiming. A minor shift of your head position to the left might allow you to see the actual line more precisely.
Click to expand...

I agree with this. Shifting the head to the right may be *more* off center (or less), but it sounds like the right direction based on how balls are being missed.

pj
chgo
 
Wow, thanks for the great advice and drill. I do plan on getting some lessons in the near future. I have a feeling that I am hitting left of where I'm looking - never thought of that! Can't wait to try that drill and see if different head positions might help.

Thanks again for the excellent advice!

Ben
 
Allow me to be the one who validates your comment/question in the original post.

Yes, you very likely are seeing the angles differently when you cut to the left or the right. It's very possible that your alignment is off, also that your stroke isn't straight. There are many possibilities. But speaking as a person who sees the cuts to the right and left, and straight in too, for that matter, differently, you should understand that your brain is quite possibly not seeing the angles correctly.

Merely shifting your head right or left over the cue may help, but if your brain is not seeing the angles correctly, simply shifting your head over the cue may not help.

If you haven't already, take a look at the Third Eye Stroke Trainer, http://joetucker.net/start.html

Joe Tucker has taught hundreds of students and has found that a very significant percentage of them do not see the angles correctly.

I'm one of them.

His Third Eye Stroke Trainer really helped me figure out what was going on.

I went to have my eyes examined, and tried to get a prescription that would let me see straight, but believe me, that prescription doesn't exist.

At this point, I no longer fight my eyes; I just adapt and on each and every shot, part of my preshot routine is grooved into compensating for the left/right angle thing.

BTW, I've also taken lessons, and Mark Wilson helped me improve my stroke, which sure has made shotmaking and position play much more consistent.

So, by all means, get with a good instructor. Get the stroke trainer. Watch Joe Tucker's videos on his website, as they go into the perception issue very well.

And good luck!

Flex
 
Advice

Open your left eye - works wonders. It is possible you have developed a little astigmatism. How many years since you had your eyes checked?

For awhile when converting from hard contacts to soft lenses, and going through trial periods waiting on my eyes to settle down, the temporary lenses were not quite right, and there were 3 shots I couldn't make. I would see them one way, and my cue ball would end up a 1/4" off from where I needed to hit the shot, every damn time. Cost me a $150 one night. Now though, I have no problem with any shot, and have better eyesight than I have had most of my life, at 59.
 
i used to use this same "Optical Illusion" phrase when i was being instructed by Tom Rossman. at times i was certain i would aim the cue ball at a certain spot, and then when it got there it was left/right of where i thought it should have been, and thus missed the shot.

IIRC, he explained it to me like this, which, i believe, is what others have said on here. basically if your shoulder, forearm, and cue are all not pointed in the same position your eyes can deceive you. a player might think they are aligned, yet they arent. thus, when you shoot the ball, it goes a hair left or right of where your eyes were looking because the shoulder, forearm, and cue werent lined up exactly.

in other words, if Allison Fisher had a straight in shot, there is only one spot - just one - on the entire planet where she can position her shoulder, forearm, and cue to make that shot. and her eyes have to be zeroed in on that spot with proper alignment of the shoulder, forearm, and cue.

seems like Tom Rossman further explained thats why its so important to "Step Into The Shot" and not just "Bend Over Into The Shot" if you want to achieve shot success.

just my $.02.

DCP
 
Which eye is your dominant eye? And which eye are you shooting with?

When I was about 6 months to a year into the game, I was having the same issue... talked to a better player, said my stroke was straight and everything else looked good, had him stumped. I ended up reading some book about a completely unrelated topic and it mentioned dominant eye, got me thinking...

sure enough, that was the trick.
 
CURED!!!! I hope.....
I can't thank all those that responded enough, even the eye-candy was QUALITY!!LOL

Since my chin has been just to the left of my cue, I assumed (I know,I know) my dominant right eye was over the cue - wrong. Using a mirror showed that my head was tilted to the right. Once I leveled my eyes and put the cue directly under my chin, I'm now hitting where I'm looking -cool! It is making my neck sore, but I will get used to it. Even my stop shots are better - I hope this lasts. I'm all too familiar with how a new swing thought (golf) suddenly stops working.

Now I just have to get used not compensating or the new compensation?

Thanks again to all that posted, especially sbe!:D

Ben
 
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