Palmer?

PDX

PDX

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I just picked this up today. It is in pretty nice shape and surprisingly, it is a light cue, 13.7oz butt and 3.9oz shaft, but it moves the ball like a heavy cue. I am pretty sure it is a Palmer Model E from the second catalog, but since the foil only says the name "Sam Scheivley" without the "original by Palmer".

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Patrick
 
Well. It's strange that is doesn't sy Palmer and the sizes on the collars are different then typical Palmer.

Maybe a custom. I'd contact chris Tate.
 
I was looking at old pics of palmers and noticed the collars look different. I also noticed some writing on the wood pilot. Looks like 68. The collar is 1/2" and the joint is 1".

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Patrick
 
could be a viking. they substituted people's names for the viking mark on the foil. don't know if the joint matches up to the old vikings.

could also be a rich q, the joint looks closer to a rich. they also did windows like that.
 
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It does seem as though the titlist blank goes all the way down to the butt handle, if that helps figuring it out.
 
I'm about to head out of the house shortly, so I figured I would post some numbers hoping it might help.

Cue and shaft are both 28 1/2"
Wrap is 13 1/2"
butt handle is 3 1/2" 2 1/8" plastic and name, 1 3/8" delrin butt cap. Looks more milky than the stark white of my Runde/Schon R6 delrin butt cap.
Bumper is generic push in
Aluminum construction bolt, standard flat head, recessed 1/2".
Personalized butt handle is 2 ball blue with black rings. Silver foil with "Sam Scheivley" on it.
Wrap to joint is 10 5/8". Includes 1/2" joint collar.
Points are roughly 6 3/4" above wrap, 3 1/2" below joint collar.
Joint collar is 1/8" black phenolic, 1/4" MOP, 1/8" black phenolic.
1" stainless joint
5/16x18" pin, sticks out 5/8" past the joint.
The finish seems pretty thin and original.
The wrap, which seems original, old cortland, is wrapped with the linen coming from the bottom of the cue if the butt is in your right hand. This is opposite my Runde/Schon R6 and my McDermott D1.
Brass pilot with a wood collar and brass cap.
 
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Patrick,

Thanks for the PM. Since we don't know for sure, I have to guess.

The label looks like it was made on Palmer's stamping machine. It's a distinctive old time typeset print called "Hobo". Many of the parts look like Palmer, including all the butt sleeve parts, the joint, the shaft inserts. The weight bolt is not Palmer and the way the butt was bored to accommodate the rubber plus was done that way by Palmer after 1975, but by then they had switched over to brass nipples on the shaft instead of a wooden pilot.

I believe this cue is a custom titlist conversion made by a New York area custom cue maker who obtained most of his parts from Palmer. Palmer sold parts too. If a cue maker bought shafts, pearlized plastic and wrap material from Palmer and their customer wanted a label, I am sure Palmer would oblige. In fact, it was probably somebody who worked for Palmer too. The small markings on the shaft pilot were codes Palmer used to identify the way a shaft was to be built.

Anyway, that's my guess. Have you tried to unscrew the ferrule? It may be a screw on.

Chris
 
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe a mike fedunka. I have seen a million Karl mayers and none were built to The quality of this cue.
 
It doesn't unscrew. If the codes are a Palmer thing, what do they mean and why would the be on a non-Palmer shaft? I have been trying At first I thought it was 6B. I'll try to take better pics later.
 
We're probably not going to know for certain who built the cue.

Every once in a while you can locate the original owner if their name is unusual enough. I located one in Texas once.

I googled the name Sam Scheivley . It's a very unusual spelling, there are only a few Scheivley's in the entire country. He was a basketball player in Indiana and a minor league baseball player, born in 1919. Unfortuantely, he died in 2006.

Chris
 
Chris,
Would you date this to the late 60's vs the early 70's? If the cue is a custom from New York area, what would be a ballpark value?

I had a WB tip put on it yesterday and this cue is fun. Someone knew what they where doing. Stiff, little to no deflection, full tip and it moves the cue ball like a 20oz cue. Even with a light butt, it still balances at about 19-20" and feels heavier than it is when you are at the table.

I'm kinda glad I don't know who made it, that will probably help me hold on to the cue longer.

I appreciate the help gentleman. Maybe somewhere the joint rings will help me figure out who made it.
 
PDX said:
Chris,
Would you date this to the late 60's vs the early 70's? If the cue is a custom from New York area, what would be a ballpark value?

I had a WB tip put on it yesterday and this cue is fun. Someone knew what they where doing. Stiff, little to no deflection, full tip and it moves the cue ball like a 20oz cue. Even with a light butt, it still balances at about 19-20" and feels heavier than it is when you are at the table.

I'm kinda glad I don't know who made it, that will probably help me hold on to the cue longer.

I appreciate the help gentleman. Maybe somewhere the joint rings will help me figure out who made it.
Click to expand...

My guess would be late 1960's because it looks like 2nd catalog Palmer parts. The blue plastic is the same color as that used on some Model G Palmers.

The value I really don't know. If it were a Palmer maybe $500.

Chris
 
That's about what I was thinking if a Palmer. Regardless it plays amazing and is super cool. Thanks for the help.
What are the names of lesser known makers in that area?
 
There are alot. Karl Mayer and mike fedunka works by themselves and with Palmer. They had access Palmer parts. Like mike was the better maker of the two. The karl Mayer cues I've seen all looked like bad imports to me. Not well made at all
 
I was looking at pics of Palmers trying to find a similar joint ring. It looks like the thicker black and thinner MOP rings come from the parts that made up the collars on the model J, L and M from the second catalog.

I had the pleasure of shooting earlier at a pool hall that has 8 or so old Palmers behind glass and was able to hold my cue up next to them. The thing that I noticed immediately was the wrap on my cue was higher up than all the Palmers and the points where as high as the cues with Spain or Szamboti blanks. I also noted that the wrap was backwards from the Palmer's with original cortland wraps.

After playing with the cue today, I realized that the cue looks like it hasn't been played much at all. It has a nice older patina, but no wear and tear really. I looks as though tape was on a small section of the wrap in the past, as it is way cleaner in that section. I would assume that the tape was there for hand positioning purposes.
 
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