Pocket size?

[Nyquil]

Will those two balls drop together into the pocket? I don’t think so, although it looks a tad larger than the ProAms I played at in the Skinny Bob’s tournament. The only tight table in the joint was being used by hacks.

Negative, the benefit to leagues though is if you have two balls close to the pocket as pictured you can shoot one in on pro cuts once you two balls contact the outside points of the jaw they are stuck and that pocket is frozen. Nothing wrong with that but if you play a lot of 8 ball that extra .25 will allow one to go.

 

[madmartigan]

Anyone have a good picture of a Diamond Pro Cut pocket as well as their 4.75 league cut?

4.5 in Diamond pro cut, which is the perfect size IMO:

 

[Fatboy]

Had nothing to with 8ball. B'wick had their 'Tournament' version and Diamond has the 'ProCut'. Both were aimed at better players/pros. 5" pockets are generally what you see in a pool hall. The idea is for recreational players to have fun and come back. Putting tight tables in one's house is one thing, putting them in a pool room is ok if its just a table or two. A room full of snug 9fts. is not a good idea imo.

That mistake was made in Los Angeles in lots of pool rooms that put the screws on all pockets making them 4-4.25”. The bangers were playing 2 racks a hour wondering why pool cost $7.50/rack.

I watched and listened to them at HOB on Wilshire plenty of times talking. “Why are the games lasting so long?” “This seems hard” lots of bangers lots of times not knowing why it wasn’t as “fun” to play.

It’s stupid from a biz prospective to make the back tables difficult.

Best
Fatboy

 

[Fatboy]

4.5 in Diamond pro cut, which is the perfect size IMO:

View attachment 613730

Yes for people who can play a little. I agree, for bangers way to tight. For players those are great for all games as a good average size. Maybe a hair tight for 14.1 or banks, maybe a hair big for 1P, good for rotation. Overall that’s the correct size for general purpose tables & for practice drills.

 

[TrxR]

4.5 in Diamond pro cut, which is the perfect size IMO:

View attachment 613730

Thats looks to be what i would like. Im no professional but am a decent player. Anyone that would playing in my table would also be decent players and not bangers.

 

[Fatboy]

Thats looks to be what i would like. Im no professional but am a decent player. Anyone that would playing in my table would also be decent players and not bangers.

On my table that was in my Vegas house 95% of the players were super strong to pro’s. And 5% were bangers(friends or non-players). So I always kept my set up dialed in for pro’s and it worked out nicely. The 1-20 banger didn’t know the difference and that’s just social pool. No harm-no foul. Man I miss that room. Those who saw know-that’s all I can say. I was too stupid to take pics of it.


Fatboy <——-hates living in the past, but that was a good one

 

[Patrick Johnson]

4.5 in Diamond pro cut, which is the perfect size IMO:

View attachment 613730

To pick a nit: isn't 4 1/2" when two balls jam at the points? This looks more like 4 5/8" or so.

No big deal, obviously; just a nomenclature technicality.

pj
chgo

 

[Bavafongoul]

To pick a nit: isn't 4 1/2" when two balls jam at the points? This looks more like 4 5/8" or so.

No big deal, obviously; just a nomenclature technicality.

pj
chgo

The opening on that CP pocket allows more than 3/4 of the two balls (2 1/4” diameter) to pass between the points.
It’s a 4 1/2 “ pocket which narrows like pool table pockets do. I already posted these photos and the pockets don’t
use shims. This is my friend’s table that was restored and its pocket sizes make this table play like a beast. And when
we occasionally play golf, the Pro Pocket reducers are used that transforms the table into becoming maniacally hard.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

The opening on that CP pocket allows more than 3/4 of the two balls (2 1/4” diameter) to pass between the points.
It’s a 4 1/2 “ pocket which narrows like pool table pockets do.

Sorry, I don't get this. The way I measure pocket width is simply the distance between the pocket points, as below. Your friend's pocket looks to be about 4 1/8" by my measurement.

pj
chgo

(Balls are on a slight angle compared to points, so lines are angled too for accuracy.)

 

[straightline]

The opening on that CP pocket allows more than 3/4 of the two balls (2 1/4” diameter) to pass between the points.
It’s a 4 1/2 “ pocket which narrows like pool table pockets do. I already posted these photos and the pockets don’t
use shims. This is my friend’s table that was restored and its pocket sizes make this table play like a beast. And when
we occasionally play golf, the Pro Pocket reducers are used that transforms the table into becoming maniacally hard.

The pocket reducers need to be cut to allow passage down the rail. For that matter, I wish they would make pockets cut that way available.

 

[Tin Man]

I would say 4.5 inch on a Diamond is ideal. I wouldn't go any less. I think players get caught up in the idea that smaller pockets will make them a better player. I don't find that to be true.

Being able to run a few racks on a 4.5 inch Diamond builds up your shot making confidence and allows you to get in the zone to push toward that higher level of play. If you're always playing on uncomfortably tight pockets you'll spend way too much energy and stress on basic shotmaking causing struggles and lack of confidence.

Agreed 100%.

My Diamond is 4.5". It is just fine. Once the cloth is broken in and the balls get gritty it plays plenty tough. I played at the US Open and the tables were 4.25" but the balls were clean and the cloth was new, it played much softer than my table does today. So 4.5" is plenty tight on a Diamond.

I can't speak to Gold Crowns. If I bought a table it would be a Diamond.

I absolutely agree that going tighter doesn't necessarily result in reaching a higher level of play. I can still practice tough shots all I want. Today was elevated off the end rail / combination shot day at my place. Trust me, nothing is easy when I train.

 

[Lawnboy77]

Agreed 100%.

My Diamond is 4.5". It is just fine. Once the cloth is broken in and the balls get gritty it plays plenty tough. I played at the US Open and the tables were 4.25" but the balls were clean and the cloth was new, it played much softer than my table does today. So 4.5" is plenty tight on a Diamond.

I can't speak to Gold Crowns. If I bought a table it would be a Diamond.

I absolutely agree that going tighter doesn't necessarily result in reaching a higher level of play. I can still practice tough shots all I want. Today was elevated off the end rail / combination shot day at my place. Trust me, nothing is easy when I train.

Great post! As usual, and I was going to say basically the same thing. I’m out here practicing max length shots with various inside spins to get position back up table on a 3 inch paper circle. If you miss the zone within the pocket, you will miss position, so really in this case the pocket is much smaller anyway.

Stephan Curry never used a basketball hoop half the diameter to become the greatest shooter in the history of basketball.

 

[phreaticus]

If you can try the table, set up a shot where the cue ball is one half balls width off the long rail at the baulk line. The object ball is one half balls width from the long rail by the spot. Shoot the shot, making the ball and draw the cue ball back to baulk. If you can't do it consistently the table is too tight for you. If nobody can do it, the table belongs in a landfill.

Ok, you got in my head with this one. Best I can do on my home GC6 TE with 4-1/4” holes is stop it, and even this is super tough and I definitely can’t do it consistently - literally every shot rattles out. Today on a Gandy with 4-5/8” pockets I can make it and draw it all the way back to the base rail, still super hard for me, but can do it. Interesting & great+frustrating stroke drill. What a difference ~0.375” makes... Thx for sharing.

BTW, my pocket dimensions are referring to the mouth opening @ the outer nose of cushion ends as the simplistic way to compare table pocket sizes - obviously the tables also have entirely different rails, inner pocket angles, shelves, facings, etc.

 

[Bavafongoul]

One of the things a good player knows is their limitations.
You ascertain that from performance measurement drills.

Draw stroke drills confirmed my draw stroke’s reliability is
a maximum of five diamonds distance between CB and OB.

When the distance is greater than that, I tend to stroke too
hard & rattle the pocket so instead I use follow, stop or stun.

 

[maha]

i always use the narrowest part of the pocket to determine size. if two balls can go down side by side its too tight for me to play for fun on.
if you use just the points to measure than you really dont know how wide the pocket is. you could have a 5 inch pocket that was 4 inches in the back and few balls would go in most would rattle when hit harder.

 

[madmartigan]

To pick a nit: isn't 4 1/2" when two balls jam at the points? This looks more like 4 5/8" or so.

No big deal, obviously; just a nomenclature technicality.

pj
chgo

I see what you’re saying. I think what’s happening here is the rail height is a bit greater than the the radius of a ball, so when putting two balls side by side in the pocket together a small portion of their combined 4.5in width falls UNDER the rail, as seen below.

Lining up the calipers as best I can to the corners of the pocket mouth gets pretty close to 4.5 in.

 

[Willowbrook Wolfy]

Ok, you got in my head with this one. Best I can do on my home GC6 TE with 4-1/4” holes is stop it, and even this is super tough and I definitely can’t do it consistently. Today on a Gandy with 4-5/8” pockets I can make it and draw it all the way back to the base rail, still super hard for me, but can do it. Interesting & great+frustrating stroke drill. What a difference ~0.6” makes... Thx for sharing

I always thought the draw dropped easier than a stop or a follow on that shot. maybe just me.

 

[phreaticus]

I always thought the draw dropped easier than a stop or a follow on that shot. maybe just me.

Sorry, I don’t know what that means. Sounds like you play like god & rest of us are chumps

 

[Willowbrook Wolfy]

Sorry, I don’t know what that means. Sounds like you play like god & rest of us are chumps

Maybe I got no follow. But a draw down rail really hard will rattle and drop with draw and tighter pockets before a follow. as there is more follow on object ball to push it in. Physics my man. It compresses nipple more with more topspin too. Or pushes it out of the way more depending how you see it. W shims maybe not.. I’m talking hitting it hard though. Maybe you all are talking soft to medium stroke.

 

[Willowbrook Wolfy]

You can just take the cue ball set it 1” off the rail and aim for the inside of the nipple with different Englishes to see what I’m talking about. The more follow the easier it falls. If you want more follow on an object ball you need to draw it. When you draw off the nipple it can get under the cushion an kick out or get slowed down going in. Why do you use left English on left cuts down rail? Because that gives the object ball follow. Hit it not perfect but good it still falls. Hit it with right English and it doesn’t fall as easy. Essentially hitting a straighter shot with draw down the rail is the same as using English towards the pocket on a hard cut.