Predator shaft nick/dent repair
- Thread starter cuejo
- Start date
Dent repair on a Predator shaft is no different than on any other shaft.
The preferred method is to swell the dent out with a drop of water.
This eliminates the need to introduce the wood to any dissimilar substance,
which in this case is CA.
Since wood and CA are of different densities and regardless of how well the
repair was done, there will likely come a time when the CA can be felt,
particularly if it's in the stroke-zone.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't acrylic urethane the tech-term for auto-clear? :scratchhead:
KJ
The preferred method is to swell the dent out with a drop of water.
This eliminates the need to introduce the wood to any dissimilar substance,
which in this case is CA.
Since wood and CA are of different densities and regardless of how well the
repair was done, there will likely come a time when the CA can be felt,
particularly if it's in the stroke-zone.
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't acrylic urethane the tech-term for auto-clear? :scratchhead:
KJ
Seems like the boys around My parts just love putting dents in their Z's and 314's, because I fix a lot of dents & nicks on them.
I agree with what KJ mentioned about CA fill, and although My approach is slightly different then What He mentioned, I'm basically doing the same thing By swelling the wood to fill in the void. I've been known to swell some nicks out that didn't seem possible, so I get My fair share of that kind of work.
Last week I had one with a gouge that was about an inch long, and about 1/8 deep, the wood was simply gone, and I did not have the missing piece. That shaft was basically screwed in My eyes, and I told the customer that I can get all of the other dents and nicks out of that shaft, but There is no way to swell the wood enough to replace that big of a chunk. From My past experiences with filling places like these I did not even want to do that. Even when You get them smooth, eventually the filled spot can raise and can be felt. Usually that can happen sooner then later, but regardless It seems to happen eventually. If not only that the CA grabs more then conventional sealer so the spot can be felt through the resistance in the bridge hand. also filler in larger voids is destine to pop apart eventually due to flex in the shaft.
Anyhow I get this shaft in the lathe and it's just driving me nuts. I don't want to fill a spot that big with a sawdust filler, and CA would not work in this large of a gash. Either would break and crack out from the flex in the shaft, but at the same time, structurally, to leave it as is seemed like the shaft would eventually split if something was not done, and this customer was spending a pretty penny on a high dollar tip, and having the rest of the shaft worked on, so i wanted to do the best I could for him. What I Ended up doing was carefully carving, shaping, and planing a small piece of maple to fit in the area, and laminated It onto the shaft using West G-flex epoxy. The end result actually wasn't too bad, I was able to smooth It out, but fill most of It with wood instead of fighting with trying to get a filler to work. IMO It was probably the best repair I could have done with this shaft, and I was able to go straight over that with My usual sealer. Once finished I could not feel the place, and looks wise not as distracting as a filler may have been. it sort of just looked Like a sugar spot. I had the shaft for at least 24hrs after the work was complete, and still could not feel any movement in that spot. I will be trying to keep an eye on that one over time to see how the repair holds up.
Greg
I agree with what KJ mentioned about CA fill, and although My approach is slightly different then What He mentioned, I'm basically doing the same thing By swelling the wood to fill in the void. I've been known to swell some nicks out that didn't seem possible, so I get My fair share of that kind of work.
Last week I had one with a gouge that was about an inch long, and about 1/8 deep, the wood was simply gone, and I did not have the missing piece. That shaft was basically screwed in My eyes, and I told the customer that I can get all of the other dents and nicks out of that shaft, but There is no way to swell the wood enough to replace that big of a chunk. From My past experiences with filling places like these I did not even want to do that. Even when You get them smooth, eventually the filled spot can raise and can be felt. Usually that can happen sooner then later, but regardless It seems to happen eventually. If not only that the CA grabs more then conventional sealer so the spot can be felt through the resistance in the bridge hand. also filler in larger voids is destine to pop apart eventually due to flex in the shaft.
Anyhow I get this shaft in the lathe and it's just driving me nuts. I don't want to fill a spot that big with a sawdust filler, and CA would not work in this large of a gash. Either would break and crack out from the flex in the shaft, but at the same time, structurally, to leave it as is seemed like the shaft would eventually split if something was not done, and this customer was spending a pretty penny on a high dollar tip, and having the rest of the shaft worked on, so i wanted to do the best I could for him. What I Ended up doing was carefully carving, shaping, and planing a small piece of maple to fit in the area, and laminated It onto the shaft using West G-flex epoxy. The end result actually wasn't too bad, I was able to smooth It out, but fill most of It with wood instead of fighting with trying to get a filler to work. IMO It was probably the best repair I could have done with this shaft, and I was able to go straight over that with My usual sealer. Once finished I could not feel the place, and looks wise not as distracting as a filler may have been. it sort of just looked Like a sugar spot. I had the shaft for at least 24hrs after the work was complete, and still could not feel any movement in that spot. I will be trying to keep an eye on that one over time to see how the repair holds up.
Greg
I was under the impression that swelling nicks on a predator would void the warranty.....
I agree that over time the ca will be felt on the repair, but I've also found that the guys who bang up there shafts usually have need for more nicks to be filled at a later date and we can review then
I dont use auto clear...I like the speed seal from Joe
Its urethane acrylic latex.....seems to fill some small nicks well
I swell and steam nicks on non-laminated shafts all the time, just been seeing a bunch of predator shafts lately with nick and dent repairs, trying to find a better way, without steam.....
I agree that over time the ca will be felt on the repair, but I've also found that the guys who bang up there shafts usually have need for more nicks to be filled at a later date and we can review then
I dont use auto clear...I like the speed seal from Joe
Its urethane acrylic latex.....seems to fill some small nicks well
I swell and steam nicks on non-laminated shafts all the time, just been seeing a bunch of predator shafts lately with nick and dent repairs, trying to find a better way, without steam.....
I was under the impression that swelling nicks on a predator would void the warranty.....
I agree that over time the ca will be felt on the repair, but I've also found that the guys who bang up there shafts usually have need for more nicks to be filled at a later date and we can review then
I dont use auto clear...I like the speed seal from Joe
Its urethane acrylic latex.....seems to fill some small nicks well
I swell and steam nicks on non-laminated shafts all the time, just been seeing a bunch of predator shafts lately with nick and dent repairs, trying to find a better way, without steam.....
I'm not as familiar with their warranty policy as KJ may be, and most of the people i do work for would not send it back unless It is fairly new damage anyhow, but I also doubt seriously that they would cover the kind of damage that I'm referring to. As far as swelling the dents out. I have never had one warp or delaminate as a result of any repair work that I did, because I am very careful not to over do it, and it is the best way I know of to save the diameter, while fixing the problem with a long term solution. What choices do we really have. I'm not knocking anyone for doing what they feel most comfortable with, I have done the same thing in My past, just that from My experiences, and IMO filling the dents is not the best option, and sanding the dents out reduces the diameter, so that more then likely is gonna void their warranty even easier, or It's very likely that they will not fix customer abuse for free. I only say this to make point, not to suggest being deceitful, but when I swell simple dents out, they would have a much harder time telling then they would telling that a diameter has been changed or there are fill spots in the shaft. I think the important thing is to make sure You customers are aware that any work done could void a warranty unless they send said cue or shaft back to the original maker. That can be said for most any make, and if not common knowledge, It should be before even considering anyone else for the work.
I was under the impression that swelling nicks on a predator would void the warranty.....
I agree that over time the ca will be felt on the repair, but I've also found that the guys who bang up there shafts usually have need for more nicks to be filled at a later date and we can review then
I dont use auto clear...I like the speed seal from Joe
Its urethane acrylic latex.....seems to fill some small nicks well
I swell and steam nicks on non-laminated shafts all the time, just been seeing a bunch of predator shafts lately with nick and dent repairs, trying to find a better way, without steam.....
All good points, let me address.
I specifically said a 'drop' of water (in the dent).
Never steam a Predator shaft. What the concern is, that the
glue bonding the pie-splices could break-down if gotten too wet.
Steam would probably de-laminate the whole damn shaft.
When you said 'acrylic urethane' I was wondering if you weren't speaking
of dents near the joint. Those can be done with A/U if prepped correctly.
I have had no problems or adverse effects when using a little water sparingly.
KJ
Thanks for the info KJ,
I guess I can "spot swell" some nicks out of predator shafts, my main concern was definately delamination of the splices.....
I was also curious if anyone was filling nicks with wood filler, bondo, putty....any type of filling agent
I havent had any of the CA nick repairs come back yet
I also swelled a couple small ones from my own predator shaft with no adverse reactions, although I will certainly do a lot of stuff to my own shaft that I wouldn't to a customers cue
Thanks for the input
I guess I can "spot swell" some nicks out of predator shafts, my main concern was definately delamination of the splices.....
I was also curious if anyone was filling nicks with wood filler, bondo, putty....any type of filling agent
I havent had any of the CA nick repairs come back yet
I also swelled a couple small ones from my own predator shaft with no adverse reactions, although I will certainly do a lot of stuff to my own shaft that I wouldn't to a customers cue
Thanks for the input
Wow, thats going out on a limb for a repair
I'm sure I would have tried to sell a new shaft:grin-devilish:
Wow, thats going out on a limb for a repair
I'm sure I would have tried to sell a new shaft:grin-devilish:
For Sure:smile:, the guy really did need a new shaft, because It was that bad, and I said as much to him. Shame too because other then that the joint finish was mint, and I could have made the rest of the shaft look new again if not for that chunk. I did not want to touch that spot but he wanted a tip anyhow, and he asked if I would do what I could for the chunk that was missing and fix the repairable dents. I basically agreed to fix the smaller ones but not the chunk. He told me that if he faced that part down so that It did not ride in his bridge hand that It would not bother him. I really did not want to touch the shaft at all, but he talked me into fixing everything but the chunk, and just wanted me to smooth the edges over there.
When I mounted It between centers I saw that It was much worse then I even first realized, so bad in fact, that i could not believe that shaft had not split yet. By that time I felt committed, I did not want to do all that work, charge the guy, then have the shaft split on him. Several people saw It and It was obvious that the shaft was toast before the repair, so I took a shot, and tried to save him the cost of a new shaft. Laminating the piece of maple in there was the best solution I could come up with at the time, It worked, so in the end all was well. I ended up having more time into It then I charged, but that's not unusual for a situation like that..