ehhh....personally I dont know why people dump lower sl's on the higher sl's. I'm a 6 in apa 9 ball (but I've had less then 20 matches total) and the other team dumped a 3 on me in the finals for our league last session. I kind of took it as an insult and then proceeded to smash the other guy to a 17-3 or 16-4 score. Honestly, I don't get it. Play safe, get ball in hand, and then run out. Kind of hard for a lower sl to 3 rail kick and hit the ball every time, no?
question for apa captains
- Thread starter lorider
- Start date
You always put your worst against there best even in bca. Yesterday at 9 ball tri cups we were beating a team 33 7 when they threw up there 9. I'm also a 9 but why throw me up for a tight match. Don't get me wrong I've played him in the regular season and love the challenge but that's not the play with that score. We put up our two...picked up 6 points. They shot there load. I think all they had was 4's left lol so we put up a 4 (who's a very strong 4)and so did they and finished them off.
i took over my sun night double jeapordy yeam which i started with when i joined apa 2 1/2 years ago. when i joined it was just a bunch of people having fun and basically enjoyed pool win or lose.
decent players but not serious. every time it come to playoffs or tri cups barely half the team would show up. it just got frustrating.
we have 3 players from that original team left. i picked up the best 7 in the league 2 sessions ago. this session i picked up the best 5 in the league. both of them are undefeated so far this session. i was a 6 but just dropped down to a 5 , i play like a 7 some nights and a 4 other times lol.
my gf is a 3 who is slowly improving due to coaching from our 7, she never would listen to advice i tried to give her, she called it criticizing her game. i picked up another 3 ladt session who is fair. now if i could just replace the 2 4s i have i would have a good team capable of competing with most teams come playoffs.
both 4's i have are just average and undependable as hell. there is a 4 in my sun night night league who is capable of kicking my ass on any given night. he approached me a few weeks ago and said his team was thinking about disbanding next session and would i be interested in having him. i said hell yes !!
if i get him and another 4 i got my eye on we will have a real strong team capable of winning cities at anytime .
just got to worry about the new 5 i got being raised. i cant touch him. he kicked my ass in napa league 6-1 and i was shooting my ass off that night.
3's may not have a chance against you personally but . . . .:wink:
If you went into the APA headquarters and did a computer summary of every single 3 versus 5 match for the last five years; I dare say the net would be near 50% wins for each.
In my experience (barring the sandbagging factor) the APA handicapping system works very well.
And how does that work out if you don't know their 4's strength, and your 4 loses?
You threw away 14 points on the hope that your 'super 4' was better than their 4, but if he isn't then you just lost 14 points for nothing.
I don't really like throwing off, even though I've done it upon occasion, usually after its been done to my team and the balance is now off.
In my experience, its been more successful in 9-ball, where making just a few balls can get you a decent split.
We haven't started the new 8-ball scoring yet (and won't until the summer session) so I don't have any experience in that format. I expect it could make throwing off a little more strategically sound, or perhaps a more viable option occasionally.
I like to try and keep our matches within one skill level either way, most of the time. Which can be difficult with a 7, but he's the exception.
Of course, this all works well in session, where we know everyone and their ability. Going to Tri Cup and States adds complication.
In my experience, its been more successful in 9-ball, where making just a few balls can get you a decent split.
We haven't started the new 8-ball scoring yet (and won't until the summer session) so I don't have any experience in that format. I expect it could make throwing off a little more strategically sound, or perhaps a more viable option occasionally.
I like to try and keep our matches within one skill level either way, most of the time. Which can be difficult with a 7, but he's the exception.
Of course, this all works well in session, where we know everyone and their ability. Going to Tri Cup and States adds complication.
I just find it funny how people get all offended when you throw a lower rank against them. Same exact scenario happened last weekend at APA cities; this SL5 was all mad at me because I threw a SL3 against him, he literally came up to me and told me "I cant believe you threw off on me, I thought you were gonna play when I put myself up". I am a SL7 in 8ball and a SL9 in 9ball with a high win %, but you dont see me getting mad when people make me play a SL3 or SL4. Its all part of the game, you have to learn how to play all handicaps, honestly the chances of a SL5 beating me in 8ball are a whole lot lower than a SL3 beating a SL5 even if you were a SL6 at one point. What he did not know is that I was not throwing off on him, I literally thought that my SL3 had a good chance of winning.
Racing-Robbie
Registered
We have 3s in 8 ball and strong 6s in 9 ball ( one person) here in louisiana. Giving up games to start with against a player that shoots your speed or better is tuff to beat.
hmmmm
Throwing a 3 is interesting. Theres a couple of ways to think about this in a positive manner. Personally i see it as a compliment. They clearly did not like the matchup of you playing their 5/6 or heavy hitter. And im assuming that they know that the teams playing each other have been previously acquainted so they know as well that you have been a 6 up until recently. In a 4-2 race their is not much room for error on your part. An SO8 or any other error could cost you an entire match. And who knows maybe that 3 you are playing has been a 4 up until cups...you never know
Throwing a 3 is interesting. Theres a couple of ways to think about this in a positive manner. Personally i see it as a compliment. They clearly did not like the matchup of you playing their 5/6 or heavy hitter. And im assuming that they know that the teams playing each other have been previously acquainted so they know as well that you have been a 6 up until recently. In a 4-2 race their is not much room for error on your part. An SO8 or any other error could cost you an entire match. And who knows maybe that 3 you are playing has been a 4 up until cups...you never know
Here's why
If my team for example...has a secret weapon, but he's not as good as your secret weapon...and I have a scrub, that's not as good as your scrub...the odds set with your team winning both of those matches if I allow it to go that way...now...
If my 3 was gonna lose to ANY of your players, and I can use him to knock out the threat, you have a win...but I STILL HAVE MY SECRET WEAPON...guaranteed win(pretty much) so I leveled the playing field even though your weapon was better than my weapon, and your scrub was better than my scrub...now it's up to the mid range players and I could win the match...even though YOU had the upper hand on me with 2 players..
I'm not saying that this is how you play every match, but I think the strategy has its place depending upon the field at the time.
If my team for example...has a secret weapon, but he's not as good as your secret weapon...and I have a scrub, that's not as good as your scrub...the odds set with your team winning both of those matches if I allow it to go that way...now...
If my 3 was gonna lose to ANY of your players, and I can use him to knock out the threat, you have a win...but I STILL HAVE MY SECRET WEAPON...guaranteed win(pretty much) so I leveled the playing field even though your weapon was better than my weapon, and your scrub was better than my scrub...now it's up to the mid range players and I could win the match...even though YOU had the upper hand on me with 2 players..
I'm not saying that this is how you play every match, but I think the strategy has its place depending upon the field at the time.
when i 1st became a 5 i had 3's beat me occasionaly, but i was just strictly pocketing balls all the time then. since i have learned more about pattern play, cue ball position, and defense the chances of 3's beating me has greatly diminished.
but we all know on any given night anything can happen in a short race.
i was not offended at all, i just thought it strange that the majority of players i faced were 3's.
i guess i should take it as a compliment that they would rather not have their higher level players face me.
much like the time i joined masters ( as a 4 ). i faced a 7 who happened to ask what my skill level was. when i told him he said he would hate to face me in a handicaped match. later he joined my sun night division. a few times we have faced his team and i threw myself out and jokingly told him i want you. he has yet to face me. not saying its a sure win but i like my odds.:grin-square:
I don't think you can necessarily say that's the wrong strategy, though. What if the 7 is 80% likely to win (no matter who they play) and the 3 is 80% likely to lose (again, no matter who they play)?
If you put someone else on the 7 and play the 3 later, you have a 40% chance of winning one of the two matches and a 4% chance of winning both. If you put the 3 on the 7 and use the other player (say, a 50-50 winner against anyone but the 7), you get maybe a 4% chance of beating the 7 and a 50% chance of winning the other match. That would give you a 54% chance of winning one of the two matches and 2% chance of winning both. I think most captains would take the second scenario, unless they absolutely had to win both matches.
In other words, it's a choice between two probable losses or one guaranteed loss and one 50/50 (or better) match.
The numbers could be different, and they could favor matching up the other way in some cases. The better you are at knowing or estimating those numbers, the better your chances of choosing the match up that's mathematically correct. But even that doesn't give you any guarantees.
We just had this happen in the playoffs. We won 2 of 3 matches in 9 ball and all they had left was a 2 and a 7. So we decided that I should go up because there 7 was complaining about having to Play me . Thy discussed it FOREVER lol then finaly put there 2 against me. I was stunned. Im a 9 so I would have had to spot him and if I were him I would have looked at it as a good challenge. I couldn't believe he backed out. I mean it was a must win and you put your 2 up? I killed the poor girl but I will say it is very nerve wracking playing a 2 spotting them all those balls !
I'm the new team captain for our 9 Ball team 9 (this is my first season as captain, the hubs is co-cap). I've only played 20 matches in the APA I just moved up to a 3 a couple of weeks ago.
I've smoked a 6 twice, he wanted a re-match after the last lashing I gave him. So I smoked him twice as tough for telling me I got lucky last time I went up against him. He made 14 points, I reached my 19, we had 12 defensive moves- 8 his and 4 mine with 18 innings.
I've been put up against 6's, 5's, 4's, 3's, 2's ... and won 10 of the last 12 matches against anyone else as a two. I've got no fear of going up against a high level player, I do my safeties as much as they can and I get out of them nicely a high majority of them, not always but at or higher of 80% of the time. All of my SL2's are brand new. We usually talk with the team with regards to who they want to go against, and if they want to play that night. I'd put my 2 against a 5 any day. It's not easy but it's not impossible and I know they can do it.
My line up is below
SL2 - 4 players
SL3 - 1 player
SL4 - 1 player
SL5 - 2 players
JuicyGirl
I've smoked a 6 twice, he wanted a re-match after the last lashing I gave him. So I smoked him twice as tough for telling me I got lucky last time I went up against him. He made 14 points, I reached my 19, we had 12 defensive moves- 8 his and 4 mine with 18 innings.
I've been put up against 6's, 5's, 4's, 3's, 2's ... and won 10 of the last 12 matches against anyone else as a two. I've got no fear of going up against a high level player, I do my safeties as much as they can and I get out of them nicely a high majority of them, not always but at or higher of 80% of the time. All of my SL2's are brand new. We usually talk with the team with regards to who they want to go against, and if they want to play that night. I'd put my 2 against a 5 any day. It's not easy but it's not impossible and I know they can do it.
My line up is below
SL2 - 4 players
SL3 - 1 player
SL4 - 1 player
SL5 - 2 players
JuicyGirl
if i read your post correctly a 5 made 8 defensive shots in 18 innings against you with you being a 2. so almost half his shot were defense huh ?
sounds to me like you got into his head and threw his game off. :wink: he was more worried about you getting points than getting points for himself.
congrats on being moved up to a 3 and hope you continue to improve .:thumbup:
Yup, but my opponent was a 6 not a 5
!!! I was aware that I was getting close to what I needed to win but, when his Captn' told me he made 14 points after we finished, I almost fell over. I knew he had made a few safeties too but, it didn't seem so bad to me while we were playing. To be honest I was so confused a week later by what happened that I asked some the old timers (on the other teams) if it was possible that this guy threw the game, sandbagged me or something..... Because it was that bad of a game for him. Everyone agreed that I've been making good progress in my game, and that he shot incredibly bad... and I would just add... Again
BTW don't ever tell me I got lucky:angry:
Loren
Yup, but my opponent was a 6 not a 5
To be honest I was so confused a week later by what happened that I asked some the old timers (on the other teams) if it was possible that this guy threw the game, sandbagged me or something..... Because it was that bad of a game for him. Everyone agreed that I've been making good progress in my game, and that he shot incredibly bad... and I would just add... Again
BTW don't ever tell me I got lucky:angry:
Loren
i am not one to accuse any body of sandbagging unless i know their true playing ability.
did he throw the game , only he knows. i honestly dont think he was sandbagging with the number of safties he played. some people just play down to their opponents level. i know, i have been guilty of it numerous times.
it may have just been one of those bad nights for him also. again, i have plenty of those also.
i really think you just got into his head and threw his game off, by the number of safties he played, it seems he was really worried about you getting points.