Question on metal rings

[Tommy-D]

> I'm not trying to debate the philisophical reason FOR using or not using metal ringwork in cues.

What I would like to discuss here is HOW to use metal rings without having to have the theoretical cue come back for a refin due to ring "pop".

My inspiration for this thread is this. I see pics of cues here that have suffered from it,and often read in people's sale descriptions of cues much newer than my Schon for example that have it. My Schon has ZERO finish damage on any of the rings,even though there is no clearcoat left on my shaft collars,and it's close to 20 years old.

If your customer requests metal rings,how do you do it RIGHT?

What is the limit you can take the surface finish to and still expect sealer/finish to stick? 400 grit "brushed",or "wedding band" polished?

Flush with surrounding materials or slightly undercut? Also,how close are you cutting them to the surrounding materials before taking a taper pass?

What tools are you using,such as specialized files,single-point cutters,etc?

What metal works best,aluminum,brass,or the nickel/silver? It seems to me like the nickel/silver would polish out best,if it behaves anything like guitar fretwire. Tommy D.

 

[dave sutton]

I don't know that there is a perfect way to do them. Some cues pop. Some don't. Not sure why. I think it's multiple factors. I've undercut with a file and with a single point tool and still had then pop. I've not undercut at all and no pop at all. I think too much sanding is a factor too. Wood and phenolic obv sands faster then metal. Also wood expanding and contracting doesn't help.

 

[qbilder]

I think finish prep causes it. Sanding &/or cutting the ring to undercut it or shine it up, causes it to heat up a lot & the heat breaks down the adhesive holding it. I have found that the cleaner your final taper cut is, the less sanding required to shine the ring, meaning less heat. The adhesive holds strong & the metal ring won't be able to move so much. Just a thought based on my relatively little experience with metal rings.

 

[Tony Zinzola]

I agree with Eric. The main factor for the rings popping is that by the time you spray the cue, you've already broken the glue bond. It doesn't take much heat for this to happen. Just a quick sanding with 220 is enough. Those little rings heat up quick.

If I build a cue with metal rings, which almost never happens anymore, I build the rings on phenolic, then bore them out so there will only be around .020" of metal and then re-sleeve that over another piece of phenolic. It actually takes me more time to make a cue with simple metal rings than it does for my inlaid rings. I use West System. If you use 5 minute epoxy, you can pretty much be sure you will feel the rings at some point. I'm not sure if this has helped or not as I haven't seen any of the cues I've done it with since they were shipped.

You might want to experiment with gluing them up with Gorilla glue too. Heat doesn't break that bond. I've never tried, so not sure if it will help or not.