Revo Review

Tin Man

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I switched to the Revo at the beginning of the year. It is a 12.4m with the radial pin using a Kamui black soft tip on my Samsara cue stick. My former shaft was a 314-2 which was very thin and very low deflection.

Purpose of the switch: I was not looking for a magical shaft that would miss less balls. The main purpose of the switch is to acquire a shaft that didn't ding and didn't wear down. What prompted me to post today was a thread on 'how to get a ding out of a shaft'. Ug. That used to be me posting. It might have only been a couple of times a year, but it felt like I was always wetting my cue, taping it up, sanding it off. Or paying someone to do it. Or playing with dings. Or all of the above.

Then, after 10 years of playing my shaft seemed to have thinned out a bit. It was always a thin shaft, but it had gotten even thinner making the tip very narrow diameter. Striking the cue ball accurately felt it was getting more difficult, for example if I was close to a ball shooting to a distant pocket the slightest mishit could result in unwanted spin which would twist the ball out of the pocket. Getting a different 314-2 didn't appeal as each one seemed to hit slightly differently and I'd still contend with these other issues. Bottom line, the idea of having the last shaft of my life which wouldn't ding or wear down was very appealing.

How it hits: Interestingly enough the Revo has more deflection than my 314-2 did. Maybe my 314-2 was thinned out and deflecting less (it was as close to no deflection as I've ever used). I don't know. But I don't much care. Centerball doesn't deflect at all, and with a wider diameter tip I can strike center more easily, so in that way it's lower deflection (I understand this would be a benefit of any wider diameter but it's part of my overall comparison). Using moderate sidespin and moderate speed (less than one tip and at an average speed of delivery) it deflects a little, but not much. It is consistent and easy to account for. At high speed with extreme sidespin it deflects quite a bit more than my old shaft. Fortunately I don't hit warp speed strokes with extreme english on difficult shots very often. When I do my success rate is equally dismal regardless of shaft type. I have learned to adjust and make these shots with the closest thing to consistency I'll ever achieve. So overall I wasn't thrilled with the low deflection, but it wasn't too disappointing.

What I do enjoy is the solid feeling of the hit. I have deleted this sentence a number of times because it's hard to explain. Let me just say on 3/4 table shots I feel like I am pointing and clicking. I line up, bring the cue stick back straight, and smooth forward with a smooth delivery, and that cue ball goes right where I'm staring. OK, shouldn't all cue sticks do that? Of course. But with my last cue stick it felt like there was more distance to the object ball, or more adversity to be overcome to do exactly that. Point and click is the best way I can explain it. On shots where I have a flat angle and have to use a firmer pace to stun the cue ball my accuracy has gone up tremendously. These are very crucial shots in rotation games and I love it.

Finally (this could just be due to tip size, nothing particular with the Revo), I am able to get more on the cue ball. Shots where I cut a ball down the side rail with low outside I can get a full diamond further up the other side rail. You know the shot. It's like I can really grab the ball and twist it in the hole, and the draw on the ball bends the cue ball back, then the english grabs the rail and flings me up table. It's almost like before I could stun with a twist of outside, now I'm getting draw action with real spin.

Overall switching experience: The first few days I was excited to try and only noticed the positives. Then after a few weeks I went through a depression. Certain finesse shots seemed challenging. Gentle half masses, throw shots, touch shots. The greater deflection on hard spin shots. It was really a challenge, and for a couple of weeks I felt like giving it up. Then I looked over at my worn 314-2 with dings and decided to stick it out.

Ever since then I've grown to love it. I've gotten used to the feel of it and can now handle all of the little finesse and touch shots. My masse shots are still a hair off, this is the only thing that hasn't fully come back. But everything else is easier. I have a cue that feels brand new every day, that hits the cue ball where I'm looking, and allows me to generate more speed and power with a thrilling degree of accuracy. I feel more solid at the table and am playing better than ever. I don't credit the cue stick for being magic. I am the one doing the shooting. But it is nice to have a shaft that delivers what I ask of it.

Let me know if you have any questions and I'll be happy to share my thoughts. I should mention I play mostly 9/10 ball, then a mix of bar table 8 ball, one pocket, straight pool, and three cushion billiards in descending order of frequency.
 
Deflection

How it hits: Interestingly enough the Revo has more deflection than my 314-2 did.

Interestingly enough, I had the complete opposite experience. I went from playing with a 314-3 to a Revo both with Kamui tips. I learned quickly just how much I was adjusting for deflection with my 314. With the Revo I can aim at the exact same spot and play a little english with no problem. I consider my Revo to be a zero deflection shaft. Now I rarely play 2 tips of english, so it might cause a little deflection.
 
I just ordered my Revo 12.9 Super excited. How long have they been available again? I was only seeing them on the eBay for like 700 bucks for a while


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Tin man:

I'm glad your happy with your equipment. Seldom do people ever get there for the long haul.

I have the revo 12.4 on the LE roadline5.

I was more or less like you describe for about 6 months after getting it.

I like them but, and I don't know why but, here lately I've been leaving the revo in my case and playing with my pechauer cues again.

What prompted this change? Well, I've always been a favorite to beat the 10 ball ghost and still am.... but..... lately my win percentage has fallen drastically.

This is what I've experienced to date:

Before revo.... with my pechauer 11.75:
I was 67% favorite in 10 ball........72% favorite in 9 ball.

After revo purchase and adjustment period (about 6 months):
69% 10 ball favorite and (I was proud of this) 74% 9 ball favorite against ghost.

Well, several weeks ago I noticed my ghost scores were falling. I didn't know why. All I knew was that I wrote a program to track my ghost play and I had slowly fallen to:

64% in 10 ball and 68% in 9 ball.

I was very unhappy to say the least. I stopped ALL of my game play and did TONS of drills but a few weeks later.... I was even worse.

Then, not long ago I was out with wife and we stopped at a mom-pop restaurant that had a pool table. While waiting on our food, I grabbed a house cue and hit a few balls. Dont know why or what but when I got home that night, I got my wood shafts out and posted a 11-2 nine ball and 11-4 ten ball.

A week later my percentage to beat 9 and 10 ball ghost had got back and GAINED ground. Currently I'm at:

75% favorite in 10 ball and 87% favorite in 9 ball.

All I know is everytime I use my revo my performance falls. I use my wooden shafts and up-up and away again.

Again, I can't explain it but, if this pattern keeps up, I'll be selling my revo equipment and I have a ton of it.

Again, props on your newfound equipment/ improvements.

Rake
 
Tin man:

I'm glad your happy with your equipment. Seldom do people ever get there for the long haul.

I have the revo 12.4 on the LE roadline5.

I was more or less like you describe for about 6 months after getting it.

I like them but, and I don't know why but, here lately I've been leaving the revo in my case and playing with my pechauer cues again.

What prompted this change? Well, I've always been a favorite to beat the 10 ball ghost and still am.... but..... lately my win percentage has fallen drastically.

This is what I've experienced to date:

Before revo.... with my pechauer 11.75:
I was 67% favorite in 10 ball........72% favorite in 9 ball.

After revo purchase and adjustment period (about 6 months):
69% 10 ball favorite and (I was proud of this) 74% 9 ball favorite against ghost.

Well, several weeks ago I noticed my ghost scores were falling. I didn't know why. All I knew was that I wrote a program to track my ghost play and I had slowly fallen to:

64% in 10 ball and 68% in 9 ball.

I was very unhappy to say the least. I stopped ALL of my game play and did TONS of drills but a few weeks later.... I was even worse.

Then, not long ago I was out with wife and we stopped at a mom-pop restaurant that had a pool table. While waiting on our food, I grabbed a house cue and hit a few balls. Dont know why or what but when I got home that night, I got my wood shafts out and posted a 11-2 nine ball and 11-4 ten ball.

A week later my percentage to beat 9 and 10 ball ghost had got back and GAINED ground. Currently I'm at:

75% favorite in 10 ball and 87% favorite in 9 ball.

All I know is everytime I use my revo my performance falls. I use my wooden shafts and up-up and away again.

Again, I can't explain it but, if this pattern keeps up, I'll be selling my revo equipment and I have a ton of it.

Again, props on your newfound equipment/ improvements.

Rake

I should probably take a lesson from you
 
dimeshooter- I figured results varied. My 314-2 was extremely low deflection. Other 314-2's I had tested deflected quite a bit more. That is why I wasn't excited about simply replacing my shaft with another. I'd have to relearn either way. But the Revo is definitely low deflection and I am not dissatisfied.

Luxury- I waited a long time, maybe 9 months. Time flew quickly because I wasn't in a state of emergency. I just kept on playing until I got the call that it was in.

jrctherake- Good shooting! You have to be hitting them good to run the ghost over with those margins!

One challenge for pool players is trying to quantify how well you're hitting the balls. Another is trying to figure out why. With your ghost percentages the problem is sample size. You clearly play more ghost than I do, but I probably play the ghost 2-3 sets a week for a total of 20-30 racks. Even if you played 2-3 sets a day it seems like the largest sample size you could possibly have in a week would be not much over 100 racks. I'm not a statistician so I'm just guessing here, but I think the sample size needed to read into these numbers would have to be 500-1000+. In 100 racks anything can happen. You could have an unfortunate run of layouts, you could have an off day, you could just not be very focused or driven for a few sets. It's just hard to say.

To see and feel an immediate short term improvement after switching shafts is not uncommon. It's well documented that changing equipment creates a new feel which can call the brain's attention, keeping the mind in the here and now, detaching from expectations, and just being absorbed in the process of playing. These conditions mirror dead stroke. So while there is a technical adjustment to overcome when switching shafts as well as a mental barrier if one's confidence is impacted, it's very common to play jam up after making a change.

This is why I didn't post about the Revo for a few months. Sample size and adjustment period. Had I played with a Revo for a week and seen my performance improve I would've been very skeptical. Instead I've played with it for a few months and think my overall performance is very, very similar, but that I like the durability as well as what the stiff shaft and tip radius allows me to do on certain shots.

That all being said, you know what you like, and if you like the wooden shaft better then play with what you like. The bottom line is that if you can crush the 10 ball ghost day in and out and like what you have for equipment then life isn't all bad!
 
dimeshooter- I figured results varied. My 314-2 was extremely low deflection. Other 314-2's I had tested deflected quite a bit more. That is why I wasn't excited about simply replacing my shaft with another. I'd have to relearn either way. But the Revo is definitely low deflection and I am not dissatisfied.

Luxury- I waited a long time, maybe 9 months. Time flew quickly because I wasn't in a state of emergency. I just kept on playing until I got the call that it was in.

jrctherake- Good shooting! You have to be hitting them good to run the ghost over with those margins!

One challenge for pool players is trying to quantify how well you're hitting the balls. Another is trying to figure out why. With your ghost percentages the problem is sample size. You clearly play more ghost than I do, but I probably play the ghost 2-3 sets a week for a total of 20-30 racks. Even if you played 2-3 sets a day it seems like the largest sample size you could possibly have in a week would be not much over 100 racks. I'm not a statistician so I'm just guessing here, but I think the sample size needed to read into these numbers would have to be 500-1000+. In 100 racks anything can happen. You could have an unfortunate run of layouts, you could have an off day, you could just not be very focused or driven for a few sets. It's just hard to say.

To see and feel an immediate short term improvement after switching shafts is not uncommon. It's well documented that changing equipment creates a new feel which can call the brain's attention, keeping the mind in the here and now, detaching from expectations, and just being absorbed in the process of playing. These conditions mirror dead stroke. So while there is a technical adjustment to overcome when switching shafts as well as a mental barrier if one's confidence is impacted, it's very common to play jam up after making a change.

This is why I didn't post about the Revo for a few months. Sample size and adjustment period. Had I played with a Revo for a week and seen my performance improve I would've been very skeptical. Instead I've played with it for a few months and think my overall performance is very, very similar, but that I like the durability as well as what the stiff shaft and tip radius allows me to do on certain shots.

That all being said, you know what you like, and if you like the wooden shaft better then play with what you like. The bottom line is that if you can crush the 10 ball ghost day in and out and like what you have for equipment then life isn't all bad!

I agree 1000%!!!

Currently, I have 347 sets of 9 ball with races from 7 to 15. My 10 ball sets are 461, I play a lot more 10 ball than nine ball but I keep it in same set lengths.

Your correct on the wood vs CF vs "anything". 100% correct.

I may give CF another try, especially after someone puts out a shaft size I like 11.50 to 11.80...... and something i can see. I'm blind as a bat with things closer than ~3' and unfortunately, the tip on my cues are in that 3' range and are very hard for me to see.

Anyways, again... I'm really happy you are meshing well with the revo. I really wish I could because my predator/revo was a anniversary gift from the wife.

It didn't make her happy to see me put it away.... thankfully I have a comfy couch.... lol.
 
I should probably take a lesson from you

I appreciate the compliment but I'm the last person anyone should seek instruction from.

My success at the table (I can play but IM NO WORLD BEATER.....lol... not even close), has come from trial and error coupled with around 50 to 60 hours a week of drills and ghost matches.

If you do something VERY OFTEN.... your chances of improvement is MUCH greater. Especially, when you stop and look around to gauge what you did wrong or right for that matter.

Have a good one Sir!
 
What prompted this change? Well, I've always been a favorite to beat the 10 ball ghost and still am.... but..... lately my win percentage has fallen drastically.

This is what I've experienced to date:

Before revo.... with my pechauer 11.75:
I was 67% favorite in 10 ball........72% favorite in 9 ball.

After revo purchase and adjustment period (about 6 months):
69% 10 ball favorite and (I was proud of this) 74% 9 ball favorite against ghost.

Well, several weeks ago I noticed my ghost scores were falling. I didn't know why. All I knew was that I wrote a program to track my ghost play and I had slowly fallen to:

64% in 10 ball and 68% in 9 ball.

I was very unhappy to say the least. I stopped ALL of my game play and did TONS of drills but a few weeks later.... I was even worse.

Rake

I am having a hard time understanding how, upon the onset of using your Revo, that your scores at first improved and over time started to decrease.

How could you shoot so good early with the Revo and then your game goes (slightly) downhill and it becomes the fault of the Revo? Obviously the Revo performed well in your hands at your onset of you using it. I don't think the performance of the shaft changed...I think maybe it was more like something in the psyche of the player at work here. After all, at a particular point in time you proved you could shoot as well with the Revo, even slightly better, than your wood shafts let you.

Would you like to offer some type of explanation of why/how this could happen?

FWIW I am not a user of CF shafts of any maker and more than likely never will be, so I do not have a dog in this fight. I'm just wondering, and a bit skeptical, of how the Revo could be at fault in your case.

Care to make an attempt at an explanation?

Maniac
 
I am having a hard time understanding how, upon the onset of using your Revo, that your scores at first improved and over time started to decrease.

How could you shoot so good early with the Revo and then your game goes (slightly) downhill and it becomes the fault of the Revo? Obviously the Revo performed well in your hands at your onset of you using it. I don't think the performance of the shaft changed...I think maybe it was more like something in the psyche of the player at work here. After all, at a particular point in time you proved you could shoot as well with the Revo, even slightly better, than your wood shafts let you.

Would you like to offer some type of explanation of why/how this could happen?

FWIW I am not a user of CF shafts of any maker and more than likely never will be, so I do not have a dog in this fight. I'm just wondering, and a bit skeptical, of how the Revo could be at fault in your case.

Care to make an attempt at an explanation?

Maniac

The short of it is:

Vision issues. The larger and darker shaft and no ferrule came into play more and more as my vision got worse.

If someone comes out with a CF shaft that meets the following criteria I'll most likely try it out again:

Longer pro taper...... minimum of 16"
Diameter at 11.80mm or smaller
Have a white ferrule of at least .25" long
Offer it in the more common radial, 3/8x10... etc instead of a proprietary pin

At that point I'll probably jump back on the CF bandwagon.

I really did/do like the way the revo performs but if I can't see it, I can't hit it.
 
The short of it is:

Vision issues. The larger and darker shaft and no ferrule came into play more and more as my vision got worse.

I can at my age (66) absolutely understand this reasoning. It is the main reason I do not particularly want one.

I agree about the long pro taper and white ferrule of at least 1/4" too.

Maniac
 
I switched to the Revo at the beginning of the year. It is a 12.4m with the radial pin using a Kamui black soft tip on my Samsara cue stick. My former shaft was a 314-2 which was very thin and very low deflection.



Purpose of the switch: I was not looking for a magical shaft that would miss less balls. The main purpose of the switch is to acquire a shaft that didn't ding and didn't wear down. What prompted me to post today was a thread on 'how to get a ding out of a shaft'. Ug. That used to be me posting. It might have only been a couple of times a year, but it felt like I was always wetting my cue, taping it up, sanding it off. Or paying someone to do it. Or playing with dings. Or all of the above.



Then, after 10 years of playing my shaft seemed to have thinned out a bit. It was always a thin shaft, but it had gotten even thinner making the tip very narrow diameter. Striking the cue ball accurately felt it was getting more difficult, for example if I was close to a ball shooting to a distant pocket the slightest mishit could result in unwanted spin which would twist the ball out of the pocket. Getting a different 314-2 didn't appeal as each one seemed to hit slightly differently and I'd still contend with these other issues. Bottom line, the idea of having the last shaft of my life which wouldn't ding or wear down was very appealing.



How it hits: Interestingly enough the Revo has more deflection than my 314-2 did. Maybe my 314-2 was thinned out and deflecting less (it was as close to no deflection as I've ever used). I don't know. But I don't much care. Centerball doesn't deflect at all, and with a wider diameter tip I can strike center more easily, so in that way it's lower deflection (I understand this would be a benefit of any wider diameter but it's part of my overall comparison). Using moderate sidespin and moderate speed (less than one tip and at an average speed of delivery) it deflects a little, but not much. It is consistent and easy to account for. At high speed with extreme sidespin it deflects quite a bit more than my old shaft. Fortunately I don't hit warp speed strokes with extreme english on difficult shots very often. When I do my success rate is equally dismal regardless of shaft type. I have learned to adjust and make these shots with the closest thing to consistency I'll ever achieve. So overall I wasn't thrilled with the low deflection, but it wasn't too disappointing.



What I do enjoy is the solid feeling of the hit. I have deleted this sentence a number of times because it's hard to explain. Let me just say on 3/4 table shots I feel like I am pointing and clicking. I line up, bring the cue stick back straight, and smooth forward with a smooth delivery, and that cue ball goes right where I'm staring. OK, shouldn't all cue sticks do that? Of course. But with my last cue stick it felt like there was more distance to the object ball, or more adversity to be overcome to do exactly that. Point and click is the best way I can explain it. On shots where I have a flat angle and have to use a firmer pace to stun the cue ball my accuracy has gone up tremendously. These are very crucial shots in rotation games and I love it.



Finally (this could just be due to tip size, nothing particular with the Revo), I am able to get more on the cue ball. Shots where I cut a ball down the side rail with low outside I can get a full diamond further up the other side rail. You know the shot. It's like I can really grab the ball and twist it in the hole, and the draw on the ball bends the cue ball back, then the english grabs the rail and flings me up table. It's almost like before I could stun with a twist of outside, now I'm getting draw action with real spin.



Overall switching experience: The first few days I was excited to try and only noticed the positives. Then after a few weeks I went through a depression. Certain finesse shots seemed challenging. Gentle half masses, throw shots, touch shots. The greater deflection on hard spin shots. It was really a challenge, and for a couple of weeks I felt like giving it up. Then I looked over at my worn 314-2 with dings and decided to stick it out.



Ever since then I've grown to love it. I've gotten used to the feel of it and can now handle all of the little finesse and touch shots. My masse shots are still a hair off, this is the only thing that hasn't fully come back. But everything else is easier. I have a cue that feels brand new every day, that hits the cue ball where I'm looking, and allows me to generate more speed and power with a thrilling degree of accuracy. I feel more solid at the table and am playing better than ever. I don't credit the cue stick for being magic. I am the one doing the shooting. But it is nice to have a shaft that delivers what I ask of it.



Let me know if you have any questions and I'll be happy to share my thoughts. I should mention I play mostly 9/10 ball, then a mix of bar table 8 ball, one pocket, straight pool, and three cushion billiards in descending order of frequency.



Since I met you at Derby, I too have converted to the Revo. I have the 12.4 Radial. My experience matches yours almost *exactly*.

Definitely more deflection than I was expecting. Definitely more than my 314-3 that I've turned down slightly to about 12.5mm.

The way I would describe the "point and click" sort of thing you describe is "consistency of hit". I feel like with the Revo, if I hit the same spot on the cueball I get the *exact* same output every time. With my wood shafts I sometimes feel like I can catch the ball "just right" and get more or less than what I am expecting. This change more than any other is the highlight of the Revo for me. My speed control has become noticeably better, and the *consistency* breeds tremendous confidence in my position play.

I'm extremely happy with the Revo, and it is very much delivering on my hope that it would elevate my game. I won my first tournament I ever played with it! 55 players 10 ball with Fargo handicaps. I was the highest rated in the tourney, and just outran the nuts all day long.

This is the future for me!!

Tinman I'd love to compare notes with you some more!!

KMRUNOUT


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KRM! Thanks for introducing yourself at the DCC!

Congrats on the tournament win. That’s a big field and tough action. Nothing like giving up 3 games to 8 against someone that opens up with 2-3 racks off the lag!

Glad to hear you are starting to enjoy the Revo. Keep up the great shooting and I look forward to crossing paths again. I’ll be at the super billiard expo, after that it’s all up in the air. Anyway, congrats again and thanks for the post!
 
revo

everyone saying it has more deflection must have broken REVOs lol I have a Vantage,Z3 and 314-3 and the REVO is less deflection by far
 
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