Right Brain Only Teaching Method -- Will it work??? (Long post)

fd_colorado

fd_colorado

Go Pack Go!!!
Silver Member
The Value of Positive Imprinting?

Original Problem

Not running out from the break as often as I used to while playing 9 ball.


Core Concept

Which training method produces quicker results:

1) Analysis -- Educating your left brain as to what it (your body) is doing wrong, what it needs to change and how to translate those changes into your physical performance.

or,

2) Imprinting – Feeding your right brain with only positive images, feelings, successful muscle memory maps and the confidence that would come from always viewing perfect shots.

Let me explain what I mean by using golf as an example.... Let’s assume that your physical makeup is the same as Tiger Woods. And, say we had a magical Tiger Woods suit that you could simply zip yourself into and whenever you hit the ball you would hit it just like Tiger. After several hundred swings you would simply know how to swing correctly without thinking about it much at all. At this point you are positively imprinted with all of Tiger's right brain feel.


Background

I noticed that I was running out from the break less and less in 9 ball. The only thing I could tell that I had been doing differently, was NOT watching 9 ball matches on TV or DVD's. (...my 7 y.o. has filled up the Comcast DVR to 100% with Sponge Bob and other junk)


Primary Theory

So, I created the following theory:

A pool player will play better pool after observing one or both of the following:

a) better players playing live

AND/OR

b) by watching better players play on video


Secondary Theory

If you never see any missed shots, you won't think about missing.


Rationale behind the Theory

If a player is constantly watching good players run racks, his own mind will be wired for success and he will run out more often.


How I plan to test my theory

The purest way to test this theory seems to be to use my usual high runs in straight pool as a baseline.

BASELINE=25

Then I will watch a bunch of DVD's or youtube videos showing people playing straight pool and running lots of balls without missing.

During this "positive imprinting" period, if my theory is correct, I will begin to break out of my BASELINE=25 and start to run more balls.

FWIW, some 35 years ago my high run was something like 56, but I haven't even been close to that in years.


Why I like this test

Control over almost all the variables...

The only variable should be my watching a bunch of videos.

I don't expect my physical skill level to miraculously change anytime soon.

The test should isolate my mental state and enhance it through repetitive viewing of all shots being made and never missed.


Some questions

How many good shots will it take to erase the negative imprinting of one bad shot?

Is there more instructional value in seeing "perfection" than seeing mistakes and thinking how to correct those mistakes?

Do we get better results using by letting the right brain develop into a shooting machine through positive imprinting as the sole means of instruction?

How does this compare with the traditional teaching method of…

1) Here is what you're doing wrong.
2) Here is what you should and shouldn't be doing.
3) Now think about all of that stuff as you make your shot.
4) Apply all that you have learned in steps 1-3, and hope your game becomes better.​

Final Thoughts

I only get one chance to come from this low of a BASELINE. After the first say 40 hours of viewing high runs, I should've imprinted enough improvement into my game and my mind that I could never go back to that original level.


How you can help

I need good video to watch. Preferably with multiple camera angles, good pacing and a run of over 100.

Do you know of any vid that fits this description on youtube, or a for purchase DVD?

I am open to any and all suggestions and/or critiques of my theory, the testing method, etc.

Tell me, what are you thinking?

If you are going to try this test, then please provide feedback as to whether it worked or not.

If you’re not sure whether you’re left-brained or right-brained, then take a look at the picture below. If she’s spinning clockwise then you’re a right-brained creative. If you see her as spinning anti-clockwise then you’re left-brained logical type.

leftbrainrightbrain1.gif


If the girl is not spinning CLICK HERE
…and go to bottom of page.
 
There was a company based on this concept in the 80s. I can't think of the name, but when I was a collegiate athlete (skiing) we watched hours and hours of perfect turns on the tapes they made for skiers visualization. It really helped.

I don't think the company is around anymore and a quick google search didn't turn anything up, but I can't remember the exact name for sure. I think it was cybervision or something like that.

Great idea.

Also, a good player there in Denver who I used to know would train players by only letting them shoot and make easy shots. They just shot balls in the hole for a month or more every day before he would even show them anything about position, english or strategy.

He took some players from never played to played ok within very short timeframes.

~rc
 
Point of reference: RRoO

A conjecture is a (well conceived) explanation without facts to back it up. A conjecture can be refied into an hypothesis by observing data (facts) and making (or noting that) the conjecture fits the facts.

An hypothesis is an explanation for a limited set of data, used to create experiments to gather more data (facts==observations). Given enough experiments and refinements, an hypoothesis becomes refined into a theory

A theory is a model based on facts that allows on to make predictions as to what hapens in the future.
 
MitchAlsup said:
Point of reference: RRoO

A conjecture is a (well conceived) explanation without facts to back it up. A conjecture can be refied into an hypothesis by observing data (facts) and making (or noting that) the conjecture fits the facts.

An hypothesis is an explanation for a limited set of data, used to create experiments to gather more data (facts==observations). Given enough experiments and refinements, an hypoothesis becomes refined into a theory

A theory is a model based on facts that allows on to make predictions as to what hapens in the future.
Click to expand...

I knew there was a reason that I shouldn't have dropped out of HS in the first semester of 10th grade! Thanks for the clarification :-)
 
sixpack said:
There was a company based on this concept in the 80s. I can't think of the name, but when I was a collegiate athlete (skiing) we watched hours and hours of perfect turns on the tapes they made for skiers visualization. It really helped.

I don't think the company is around anymore and a quick google search didn't turn anything up, but I can't remember the exact name for sure. I think it was cybervision or something like that.

Great idea.

Also, a good player there in Denver who I used to know would train players by only letting them shoot and make easy shots. They just shot balls in the hole for a month or more every day before he would even show them anything about position, english or strategy.

He took some players from never played to played ok within very short timeframes.

~rc
Click to expand...

Thanks SixPack! Great anecdotal evidence to move my conjecture to hypothesis :embarrassed2:
 
fd_colorado said:
The Value of Positive Imprinting?

Original Problem

Not running out from the break as often as I used to while playing 9 ball.


Core Concept

Which training method produces quicker results:

1) Analysis -- Educating your left brain as to what it (your body) is doing wrong, what it needs to change and how to translate those changes into your physical performance.

or,

2) Imprinting – Feeding your right brain with only positive images, feelings, successful muscle memory maps and the confidence that would come from always viewing perfect shots.

Let me explain what I mean by using golf as an example.... Let’s assume that your physical makeup is the same as Tiger Woods. And, say we had a magical Tiger Woods suit that you could simply zip yourself into and whenever you hit the ball you would hit it just like Tiger. After several hundred swings you would simply know how to swing correctly without thinking about it much at all. At this point you are positively imprinted with all of Tiger's right brain feel.


Background

I noticed that I was running out from the break less and less in 9 ball. The only thing I could tell that I had been doing differently, was NOT watching 9 ball matches on TV or DVD's. (...my 7 y.o. has filled up the Comcast DVR to 100% with Sponge Bob and other junk)


Primary Theory

So, I created the following theory:

A pool player will play better pool after observing one or both of the following:

a) better players playing live

AND/OR

b) by watching better players play on video


Secondary Theory

If you never see any missed shots, you won't think about missing.


Rationale behind the Theory

If a player is constantly watching good players run racks, his own mind will be wired for success and he will run out more often.


How I plan to test my theory

The purest way to test this theory seems to be to use my usual high runs in straight pool as a baseline.

BASELINE=25

Then I will watch a bunch of DVD's or youtube videos showing people playing straight pool and running lots of balls without missing.

During this "positive imprinting" period, if my theory is correct, I will begin to break out of my BASELINE=25 and start to run more balls.

FWIW, some 35 years ago my high run was something like 56, but I haven't even been close to that in years.


Why I like this test

Control over almost all the variables...

The only variable should be my watching a bunch of videos.

I don't expect my physical skill level to miraculously change anytime soon.

The test should isolate my mental state and enhance it through repetitive viewing of all shots being made and never missed.


Some questions

How many good shots will it take to erase the negative imprinting of one bad shot?

Is there more instructional value in seeing "perfection" than seeing mistakes and thinking how to correct those mistakes?

Do we get better results using by letting the right brain develop into a shooting machine through positive imprinting as the sole means of instruction?

How does this compare with the traditional teaching method of…

1) Here is what you're doing wrong.
2) Here is what you should and shouldn't be doing.
3) Now think about all of that stuff as you make your shot.
4) Apply all that you have learned in steps 1-3, and hope your game becomes better.​

Final Thoughts

I only get one chance to come from this low of a BASELINE. After the first say 40 hours of viewing high runs, I should've imprinted enough improvement into my game and my mind that I could never go back to that original level.


How you can help

I need good video to watch. Preferably with multiple camera angles, good pacing and a run of over 100.

Do you know of any vid that fits this description on youtube, or a for purchase DVD?

I am open to any and all suggestions and/or critiques of my theory, the testing method, etc.

Tell me, what are you thinking?

If you are going to try this test, then please provide feedback as to whether it worked or not.

If you’re not sure whether you’re left-brained or right-brained, then take a look at the picture below. If she’s spinning clockwise then you’re a right-brained creative. If you see her as spinning anti-clockwise then you’re left-brained logical type.

leftbrainrightbrain1.gif


If the girl is not spinning CLICK HERE
…and go to bottom of page.
Click to expand...

I like to make her spin in both directions. BTW, I agree that watching high level players will help you play better. It's osmosis. Ok, maybe that's my conjecture.

It is one of the reasons that I urge everyone to attend as many pool tournaments as your wife will let you. :smile:

JoeyA
 
I've never understood that picture. If you look at from the top, she's going one way, but from bottom another way. So, which way are you supposed to use lol?

Not to mention, if you look away and back a couple times, it will start going the other way so wtf?
 
She spins both ways for me too

JoeyA said:
I like to make her spin in both directions. BTW, I agree that watching high level players will help you play better. It's osmosis. Ok, maybe that's my conjecture.

It is one of the reasons that I urge everyone to attend as many pool tournaments as your wife will let you. :smile:

JoeyA
Click to expand...


Joey,

She spins both ways for me too. I suspect that means that good looking girls engage my whole brain, even a spinning silhouette!

As for the OP's concept, what he is trying to do is reprogram what his "normal expectation" is. Two people can have exactly the same stat's and one sees himself as highly successful and the other sees himself as a loser. Purely a matter of personal perception. When I do something poorly I always consider that abnormal. When I do something well, I usually just feel I perform as expected.

John Schmidt has an excellent 245 run on video but I don't know if I like his commentary for your purposes fd, too analytical and self critical for your intended use I believe. A great DVD to own but you need video of people being successful and any commentary bolstering the footage.

My belief is that assuming you have basically the same physical skills and know how that you had when you performed better you can alter your expectations and alter how you play. Bottom line, I think within reason your right brain concept is very valid. You may not be able to pull yourself up by your bootstraps physically but you can metaphysically as I have proven to myself many times.

Good luck and do report on your results once you feel ready to quantify them.

Hu
 
Perhaps these ideas may be of use in your thinking.

In general learning theory leads to the conclusion that you should have many successful attempts during practice and when learning, 90% is a good number.

Other research leads to the conclusion that imagery (visualizing successful practice in your head) can add up to 30% improvement.

So it follows that watching successful players will improve your play, especially if you play along with them in your head. When they shoot imagine your body doing the same thing. I have found that this does work with helping people in physical rehabilitation learn new skills. However the latter is not a documented (well researched) finding.

In general we need to verbalize a new skill and study it in detail with the use of logic. When we have learned the elements then it is a matter of turning the behavior over to automatic control.

To rid yourself of old bad habits see this article. http://www.sunburstselect.com/PBReview/ChangingBadHabits.htm

Not sure if this is true for others but when I am being creative she (the figure) turns one way. When I am thinking through a problem she turns the other way. Perhaps the type of thinking is something that some(?) people can turn on and off. I paint in oils, create much in woodworking and I also wrote research articles, computer programs, textbooks and similar things. I perceive playing pool as a combination of creative and logical processes. Maybe that is why I am not a pro player.

It has always seemed to me that people can turn on or off the logic / creative processes and while a person may be more or less dominant in one style we all exhibit both styles to some extent. Most children are very creative (cowboys and indians etc) later we learn to use logic and thus both types of thinking are usually available.
 
Last edited:
With regard to visualizing physical practice, try this exercise. Watch a friend hit a nail with a hammer or any similar activity such as playing a draw shot.

While you are watching him imagine that you are hitting the nail with your hammer and go though the cycle with him. You need to imagine the hammer in your hand and lifting and hitting as needed. You may be surprised to find that you can feel your muscles slightly tense and release as needed. More importantly, you are engaing that part of your brain that controls the hammer for an accurate strike and your mind / brain does learn under these circumstances.

Visualized practice is also of use without a model. It only requires you to try to see and visualize the shot ad all the muscle activity that is required. You never have to physically move anything and it is probably better if you do not physically move. Just let your brain go through all of the motions. There is a substantial amount of reseach which leads to the conclusion that imagined practice for those who know what to do is highly adventageous. That 30% improvement number is real.
 
while never downplaying the power of both positive thinking and visualization, there are other areas to consider as well, before just laying everything on the mental side of the game. is your decline in break and runs due to the natural aging process? what is stopping the run out? what part of your game isnt as sharp as it was-shot making, position, pattern play? and have you completely ruled out that you have developed a bad habit in your machanics?

if the decline your experiencing is related to some of those areas i am not sure that just imprinting will help. i hope you keep us posted on your outcomes.

brian===just realized that whole concept in addition the helping your game is also an excellent excuse to sit on the sofa and watch pool on TV :)
 
The spinning girl has nothing to do with the left/right brain domination that is just a myth.
 
fd_colorado said:
Thanks SixPack! Great anecdotal evidence to move my conjecture to hypothesis :embarrassed2:
Click to expand...

When I took some time off and focused on becoming a scratch or better golfer, I watched any swing I could of Tiger Woods. I also went to the gym and practiced golf incessantly.

I believe that I figured out the secret to Tiger's swing and where his power comes from. The catch is that it requires such strength and flexibility that only he can do it. But I was able to get close, getting my drive distances up over 300 (at Denver altitude - so 275 or so carry at sea level)

The problem was that I couldn't maintain the level of flexibility and strength required to keep swinging like that. And I eventually developed some chronic injuries which prevented me from going any further. But I was shooting right around par most of the time and even went deep a few times (5 under in 9 holes was my best)

I guess what I'm saying is that the visualization is absolutely key. I don't think you can become a top performer without it. At business, sports, arts, anything.

The key is knowing that you have to work on the details too. So if you want to watch players make balls and get the good feeling of making balls, that's great, but it's only part of it. You also need to visualize their setup, swing, fell of the cue hitting the ball, the infinitesimal differences in power that they can deliver to get pinpoint position. You know what I'm saying.

I posted a thread a while back called "mental game: the status game" or something similar in which I talked about the power of mental attitude and the role of emulation of a lot of different aspects of successful pool players in order to elevate your game. It generated some interesting conversation and might be worth taking a gander at.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=145521

I think watching as much great pool as possible will do good things for your game. I think visualizing not only the ball going in the pocket, but also the way it feels in your hands, the way you're standing, the way you act when you are making balls like that, etc... will help you play GREAT pool.

By putting together the whole package, you'll develop mental keys that will tell your body and mind what it feels like to play great as well as what you do when you play great.

When you put those together, you'll be able to set triggers to put yourself in the zone and get top performance even when you don't feel good, are tired, are sick, etc...

~rc
 
I'm not going to say watching great players doesn't help your game. But 99.99999% of pool is the speed and direction of your tip. If you can't see exactly where their tip is going, you really cannot see the shot at all.

There is a logical process involved to figure out the cause of your errors, whether incorrect aim or speed. It is not quite obvious to most people. Especially if they are not aiming their tip but trying to aim the balls, which, imo, is impossible.
 
I agree that watching good play can be helpful.

But as Sixpack and others have said, to optimize the visualization process, you need to include all the relevant aspects of the stroke including tip placement, the sense of pace etc. The problem is that you can only do this if you know exactly what shot the player is going to play and how he is going to play it. Even in rotation games, this is not always easy (especially with some players ...).

Perhaps this suggests that the best strategy is to choose a relatively small number of tapes and watch them over, having previously learned what shots the players take on.
 
JoeyA said:
I'm curious. What does the spinning girl have to do with?

JoeyA
Click to expand...

The image is 2D and not 3D it shifts back and forth creating illusion of spin.
You can make her 'spin' in whatever direction you want by simply changing the position of your head to the left or right of the image. There are other tricks to achieve the same result.
 
the only problem i see with your experiment is that you are conducting it on yourself and you have already made decisions on what you think the outcome may be.

What you really need is other people who don't know your theory, train them in different methods and look at the result. This would have to be done with a fairly large group because everyone is going to improve at different rates according to their natural ability.

Nevertheless, very interesting ideas. I have found that whenever i sit and watch some top guys play, I almost always go out and play better :thumbup:
 
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