Runout 8-ball - Getting out of position?

Billy_Bob

Billy_Bob

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
This is a problem in general of "forcing myself" to stick with my original runout plan when this might not be a good idea later in the runout. Need advice and suggestions on this...

I'm sometimes playing with "the bigger boys" now (8-ball). With these guys, I lose if I lose the lag many times because they will break and runout. So I just sit in the chair and hope they will mess up.

I'll get one chance (sometimes) to runout and that is it. So I had better not mess up!

Today I played a guy who broke and ran 5 balls, then missed a shot. So I had all 7 balls and the 8 to shoot in - wide open, no clusters, easy runout. (A gift from heaven!) I found my key ball to get on the 8, and the ball before that, then planned how I would shoot the other balls to get on that second to last ball.

Well I ran 5 balls and the cue ball rolled a few inches too far back leaving me in a difficult situation to shoot in the second ball so I would be able to make the last ball in a way which would leave me in good position on the 8. Then I attempted a difficult shot and missed. My opponent ranout.

After I got home, I was thinking about this and realized that I didn't *have* to shoot that second ball per my original plan. I could have shot the last ball first (easy shot) and got good position on the other ball (shoot them in backwards order from original runout plan).

Duuuuhhhh! Slap me upside the head....

So I made a plan, then forced myself to follow it even though it might have been better to switch things when I got out of position.

So what do you folks do when you run into trouble like this? Do you re-evaluate your runout as you proceed? Or re-evaluate things when you get out of position?
 
Its clear, you must re-evaluate you plan, if you're out of position or something else. Sometimes I consider to play safety.
 
I re evaluate the table after almost every shot to be sure I haven't missed anything. Don't take a long time to do it but enough time to look around.

In eight ball I think you must think defense all the time. When you have 6-7 balls on the table and your opponent has 1-3, you have a great opportuniy to move your balls around to great runout position and leave him with no shot several times.
 
2 Keys for me in 8 ball.....

1.) I work backwards from the 8 as you do.

2.) In that plan, I work how can I make this runout and if I miss still leave him safe.

2 way, 2 way, 2 way. If I have a choice and the safety is harder than the shot, I always take the shot. I feel it is always better to go down firing than watching.

The top eight ball player here, plays about 10 safetys each rack. I love to see him get beat. Not only the safetys but the smarter shot.

Hope this helps

Ken
 
Try to get a copy of Larry Schwartz's book, "The 8-Ball Handbook for Winners". He goes into all the problems you mentioned and shows how to deal with the situations. It's not too long, about 32 pages 8 1/2 X 11, with diagrams. Very good stuff. Changed my thinking on how to play 8-ball.

Flex
 
Changes...

You have to have a game plan, but you reevaluate after each shot. Why?
Because you have to evaluate where the cue ball stopped, and if it is on the right side of the next shot or not, and what you have to do in the way of english for the shot after that. Always plan 2 shots ahead. Remember: The most important thing is the run overall, not having a ball close to the 8 to shoot right before the 8. Yes, it is nice to do that, but NOT if it ends up making you not being able to run out. A good player can get on the 8 no matter where the last solid or stripe is before it. And sometimes, it is more advantageous to have the last ball at the other end of the table so the cue ball can come around with natural angles to get on the 8 ball.
 
Runout

I like everyone else reevaluate the table after every shot even if I have the shape I was looking for the next shot. Getting out of line just a little may not create a problem on the next shot , but 2 shots down the road you may be in trouble. ---Smitty
 
One piece of advice to go with, always try to run the balls in groups with minimal cueball movement. And when you need to move the cueball from one group of balls to the next one, plan your position play and the angle you'd like to have before playing position for the last ball of the current group. Many times easy layouts are screwed up, because you don't bother checking out the angle to play easy position for the next ball. Use "natural angle" as much as possible, you don't want to force the cueball around the table for position.
 
GADawg said:
In eight ball I think you must think defense all the time. When you have 6-7 balls on the table and your opponent has 1-3, you have a great opportuniy to move your balls around to great runout position and leave him with no shot several times.
Click to expand...

Making a spectacular shot can be a thrill, but a good safe may win you the game, and maybe even the match.
 
The responses here agree that you re-evaluate as you proceed rather that just when you run into trouble. So I don't have anything to add about that. I don't think it is stretching the subject to far by talking about when your down to the last three balls, since that is where you are at in your example. And the planning of those three shots.

Something it took me a long time to make sure I didn't do. Up till maybe a year ago this cost me more games than I care to think about. Your talking about being down to the last three balls (including the 8 ball). When re-evaluating this close to the end of the rack, don't make it more difficult than it is by thinking you need perfect position on the 8 ball. I use to miss a shot before or the second ball before the 8 because I made it more difficult than I needed to just so I could get a straight in 8 ball. So now if I'm coming to the end of the run and can make a very natural position shot for a nice cut on the 8, I don't do anything extra trying to make the 8 easier. Just play the natural shot to make sure to make the ball. Then pot the 8.
 
mjantti said:
One piece of advice to go with, always try to run the balls in groups with minimal cueball movement...
Click to expand...

I don't know if you can see my embarrassed face or not...

My first shot was a stop shot into the corner to get position on the next shot which was into the side. And I *could* have shot that with stop as well and been in perfect shape for that 2nd to last ball which I had trouble getting position on!

Maybe I should write this on the blackboard 100 times....
Always try to run the balls in groups with minimal cueball movement!
Always try to run the balls in groups with minimal cueball movement!
Always try to run the balls in groups with minimal cueball movement!
...

Thanks everybody for the excellent advice (as always).
 
Someone mentioned Larry Schwartz' book. I also would like to recommend Phil Capelle's exhaustive study of 8 ball. He goes into precisely the situation you described. He recommends having a "Plan B" worked out BEFORE you start your run; just in case you get out of line.

In other words, you're thinking VARIATIONS here... "If I don't get on this ball the way I want to, I could always play this sucker over here and get around two rails to get the same angle on the lead ball to the key ball." etc. etc...

Excellent posts.
 
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