Scotch Doubles Advice?

Pidge

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
So ive got a doubles game coming up. I've played many times but not against the calibre of players me and my partner will come up against in the next few months. Usually we don't communicate because the players we come up against don't put up any real challenge. This time though I've checked the teams and all the teams consist of players I've played against at some point or another and are very good players. I'd say I have the beating of them in a singles match but they've been playing with their partners for way longer than we have.

So, down to the nitty gritty;
- English 8 Ball, this doesn't really matter all that matters is its 8 ball.
- first to 3 frames for now
- alternate breaks
- no discussions after either has touched the table

The way we've always played is I've broke and then I play on until I miss. The problem comes is when my break is dry. I break like no one else in English 8 ball. I hammer the crap out of it. Leaves things wide open, which against this standard of player can either win or lose you the match. I'm thinking of letting my partner break. His chances of clearing the table after the break are lower than me, but he 'safety' breaks as he calls it. I think I'd rather run the risk of a long drawn out match and win than the opposite.

I'd like to hear on what people think about the order players should go in, if you should have a safety player and a player who just pots.
Any advice is appreciated.

Cheers,
 
Scotch Doubles alternates players between every shot. The strategy I've seen (APA 2/3 & APA 7) is the lower handicap player's goal is to make the ball and leave the cue ball makeable for the next shot. The higher level player's goal is the make the shot and easy leave for the lower handicap player.
 
Scotch Doubles alternates players between every shot. The strategy I've seen (APA 2/3 & APA 7) is the lower handicap player's goal is to make the ball and leave the cue ball makeable for the next shot. The higher level player's goal is the make the shot and easy leave for the lower handicap player.
Yeah I realised I messed up the title! I meant standard doubles but typed scotch like a numpty :(

I subconciously wanted to drink some scotch I think :)
 
I believe that's a Double scotch, not Scotch Doubles :-) I wonder if you're Scottish (like Jayson Shaw), playing Scotch Doubles (playing with Earl would probably drive him to drink scotch as well), would that make it Scotch Triple?

Yeah I realised I messed up the title! I meant standard doubles but typed scotch like a numpty :(

I subconciously wanted to drink some scotch I think :)
 
I play Scotch with my wife. When I first started playing, I too was quite disappointed to learn that it had nothing to do with alcohol. Altho with me, the name could be changed to Beer Doubles. I guess I'm safe as my father was Scottish and English so I have a little in me.

Pidge, the type of Doubles that you're referring to is what we would call regular Bar Doubles. It is what we play at the bar if your table is challenged and your challengers don't play by World Rules. If they know the rules, we will play Scotch.

I don't know if there is any special strategy involved with this fashion beyond playing 8 Ball like you'd normally play. Shoot until you miss, safety play if you need to do one on your last shot.

Myself, I prefer Scotch and alternating shots. It can get quite interesting when your Team mate and yourself get to know each others game well.
 
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I play Scotch with my wife. When I first started playing, I too was quite disappointed to learn that it had nothing to do with alcohol. Altho with me, the name could be changed to Beer Doubles. I guess I'm safe as my father was Scottish and English so I have a little in me.

Pidge, the type of Doubles that you're referring to is what we would call regular Bar Doubles. It is what we play at the bar if your table is challenged and your challengers don't play by World Rules. If they know the rules, we will play Scotch.

I don't know if there is any special strategy involved with this fashion beyond playing 8 Ball like you'd normally play. Shoot until you miss, safety play if you need to do one on your last shot.

Myself, I prefer Scotch and alternating shots. It can get quite interesting when your Team mate and yourself get to know each others game well.
Yeah I turned down a whiskey doubles to play scotch doubles. I've learned from my mistake :)

Generally we would find out which is the better player and my partner would play after him then the worse player plays after my partner and so on. Doubt there are going to be any weak players though.

I think we need to communicate as much as we can and agree on a plan of action before one of us touches the table. Kinda sucks that once you touch the table you can't communicate until you miss.
 
I don't know if this is standard all over in Scotch but we are allowed a one minute Time Out per game.

But still, I think that is pretty liberal to allow communication until one of you gets to the table.

It depends on who we play. Many nights our opponents talk as much as they want and we do the same. Our league is fairly competitive, but for the most part its a fun night out, everyone gets along well, and no one feels the need enforce the rules that much.

There was only one team that abused the privileges. They pissed everyone off as they felt the need to discuss every shot. For 5 minutes.
 
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One semester the tournament director did not allow someone to play if they had already placed in the current semester. After winning the first singles tournament, I made the offer that if I picked a girl who was known to play, could I play in the doubles. He let me in. I chose a random partner, but did not let her shoot any balls in (except for one time). I did not want her to make some of the easy shots and leave the table harder to get out.

We went undefeated up to the point that we were in the top three. She had to leave for a meeting. She was thrilled with the $10 prize.

On scotch doubles, I think it is best to have one player take the lead and the other just make shots. I have seen two brothers discuss everything. I have been partners with a very good player, we were the top bid in the calcutta by double the second highest and did not place. I should have taken the secondary role, because it was against my partners personality to listen to suggestions.
 
IMO B and up players playing doubles in rotation games need to talk less. Watching top players in the MC tell each other how to play position on every shot is a joke. They do more harm to each others focus than anything else. Johnnyt
 
IMO B and up players playing doubles in rotation games need to talk less. Watching top players in the MC tell each other how to play position on every shot is a joke. They do more harm to each others focus than anything else. Johnnyt
I would never tell him how to play position or anything like that.

There are times when I'm completely stuck and I wish I could get his view on it. And there are times when I'm wondering wtf he is doing.

Normally when its his shot I'd just ask what you thinking? He usually replys "ill pot that then that then that. If I'm screwed on that ill play safe into that". Ill reply "ok". Very basic, but its more of a way to get him to think, and me, about what we're about to do.

I've played teams that stand there for 3 minutes both pondering about a straight yellow, then after another 2+ mins of strenuous discussion they play a stop shot. Play like that is KILLING the game.
 
I would never tell him how to play position or anything like that.

There are times when I'm completely stuck and I wish I could get his view on it. And there are times when I'm wondering wtf he is doing.

Normally when its his shot I'd just ask what you thinking? He usually replys "ill pot that then that then that. If I'm screwed on that ill play safe into that". Ill reply "ok". Very basic, but its more of a way to get him to think, and me, about what we're about to do.

I've played teams that stand there for 3 minutes both pondering about a straight yellow, then after another 2+ mins of strenuous discussion they play a stop shot. Play like that is KILLING the game.

I played in a BB comp the other day, where my opponent took at least 2 mins over every single shot. I went in-off, and he had 3 balls over the bags with the black in the middle of the table. After about 5 mins thinking time, he turned to me and said "I don't know what to do here". I rolled my eyes and sat down.

The trouble with slow play is...it works. I sped up to compensate for his slowness, lost my cool and lost the match, even though he was completely useless. There's something else I've noticed about very slow players - they're lucky. I have a theory that the more time you spend at the table, the more luck you get. I'd have a 10 sec shot clock, with extensions only if you need the rest.

Anyway, if you're all good players, why are you playing a race to three? That could be all over in 10 mins.
 
Normally when its his shot I'd just ask what you thinking?

Thats what I meant when I mentioned that once you and your mate get to know each others game, its not necessary to communicate much unless you feel the need to.

The game just flows along nicely.
 
I played in a BB comp the other day, where my opponent took at least 2 mins over every single shot. I went in-off, and he had 3 balls over the bags with the black in the middle of the table. After about 5 mins thinking time, he turned to me and said "I don't know what to do here". I rolled my eyes and sat down.

The trouble with slow play is...it works. I sped up to compensate for his slowness, lost my cool and lost the match, even though he was completely useless. There's something else I've noticed about very slow players - they're lucky. I have a theory that the more time you spend at the table, the more luck you get. I'd have a 10 sec shot clock, with extensions only if you need the rest.

Anyway, if you're all good players, why are you playing a race to three? That could be all over in 10 mins.
I play pretty slow in some games, and in practice VERY slow.
8 ball I'm probably a little on the speedy side, and my partner is ridiculously fast around the table. Nothing worse than being made to play quick because your opponents have been staring blankly at the table for the past 3 mins without hitting a ball. Some of the players in this comp feather the ball 15-20 times before striking it. That's border line taking the piss a little.

Nothing we can do about the race to 3 for now. The tournament lasts for 6 months, with a match night every month rather than having it held over a few days. Its a knock out format so you lose and you're out. We will play 3 matches on the first game night then its 4 matches every game night until the final. Pretty big comp but the early rounds are brutal because they're so short. Makes it so important to win your teams break.
 
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