Shaft selection help.
- Thread starter Big C
- Start date
Look down the shaft and make sure the grain runs straight. This is the biggest quality factor, in my opinion.
Hopefully ALL of a custom cue maker's shafts will be of the highest quality possible. With mass produced cues, this is rarely the case. Some will be good, some will be so-so, since they can't really be as picky.
OB1, Dominiak, Predator and others make laminated shafts. Opinions will vary on whether they are better or not. Lamination can help with consistency a little bit, but what makes most of them play differently, is the weight. The most common ones are hollow. (At least at the tip end)
Hopefully ALL of a custom cue maker's shafts will be of the highest quality possible. With mass produced cues, this is rarely the case. Some will be good, some will be so-so, since they can't really be as picky.
OB1, Dominiak, Predator and others make laminated shafts. Opinions will vary on whether they are better or not. Lamination can help with consistency a little bit, but what makes most of them play differently, is the weight. The most common ones are hollow. (At least at the tip end)
Ok, here's what I am really asking.
But let me give you a little history of my experiences. I have played with many different cues before I bought my first custom cue from Jerry McWorter. I loved it and I played with it for many years and it has paid for itself many times over. During this time I kept experimenting with other cues and still loved my McWorter, until 2004. That is when I bought my first Predator 314. I screwed in on to this Excaliber cue that I won when playing in a Click's league and it flat out performed better than my McWorter. It was hard for me to put it away as I was so familiar and emotionally attached to it.
So I play with this new 314 for a couple of years and my game improves. In 2006 I run across a great deal on a new Schon, so I buy it thinking that if I don't like the way it plays, I can always get a 314 for it. I find out immediately that I do not like the way the Schon shaft plays. I found it to be heavy and having much more cue ball defelction than my 314. Also in July of 2006 I met with Rocye of OB1 during a tournament here in Austin. I had my McWorter with me as I was looking to sell it. He lets me hit with one of his OB1 shafts on my McWorter and I really liked it. So I bought it and I gave it a fair amount of play before gravitating back to the 314. I liked the feel and sound of the OB1, but that 314 just played better. I wind up trading the OB1 for another 314 for my Schon and it's been my player since then. I went looking for an extra shaft and settled on a Z2. It played just as good as my 314, but I just couldn't get used to the smaller diameter. Now I have my sights on a new 314-2, but I am looking for feedback on custom cue builders out there that can make a better playing shaft. Anyone?
But let me give you a little history of my experiences. I have played with many different cues before I bought my first custom cue from Jerry McWorter. I loved it and I played with it for many years and it has paid for itself many times over. During this time I kept experimenting with other cues and still loved my McWorter, until 2004. That is when I bought my first Predator 314. I screwed in on to this Excaliber cue that I won when playing in a Click's league and it flat out performed better than my McWorter. It was hard for me to put it away as I was so familiar and emotionally attached to it.
So I play with this new 314 for a couple of years and my game improves. In 2006 I run across a great deal on a new Schon, so I buy it thinking that if I don't like the way it plays, I can always get a 314 for it. I find out immediately that I do not like the way the Schon shaft plays. I found it to be heavy and having much more cue ball defelction than my 314. Also in July of 2006 I met with Rocye of OB1 during a tournament here in Austin. I had my McWorter with me as I was looking to sell it. He lets me hit with one of his OB1 shafts on my McWorter and I really liked it. So I bought it and I gave it a fair amount of play before gravitating back to the 314. I liked the feel and sound of the OB1, but that 314 just played better. I wind up trading the OB1 for another 314 for my Schon and it's been my player since then. I went looking for an extra shaft and settled on a Z2. It played just as good as my 314, but I just couldn't get used to the smaller diameter. Now I have my sights on a new 314-2, but I am looking for feedback on custom cue builders out there that can make a better playing shaft. Anyone?
Do you think that a quality shaft is the same as a good playing shaft? Will a good playing shaft made out of high quality wood? Like Shaldon said, good wood will be wood with a lot of straight grains. But when playing with this kind of wood, I don't think it will has low deflection. I think that, good wood will be heavier than cheap wood. But heavier wood has more mass, so more deflection. Why do a lot of peoples like the 314, it's made out of low quality wood? But it's so flexibel, that it eliminate a lot of deflection. I don't think there is good or bad quality wood when making shafts. It all depend on what you are looking for. But that's my own opinion.
What plays best?
Play with whatever 'you' feel ("think") plays best to 'you'. Experiment with new products and combinations of materials(tips, ferrules, fiberpads etc.). Only then will YOU be able to answer Your questions. Other peoples opinions are just that, opinions based on THEIR experiments. They are not you. They may have different feelings and needs. If all you care about is what do I play best with. Then experiment and find out. That's where cue repairmen and cue builders come in. As players we ALL have to PAY DUES to play better. There are very few shortcuts.
Tom Gedris, Triple Cross Cues
Play with whatever 'you' feel ("think") plays best to 'you'. Experiment with new products and combinations of materials(tips, ferrules, fiberpads etc.). Only then will YOU be able to answer Your questions. Other peoples opinions are just that, opinions based on THEIR experiments. They are not you. They may have different feelings and needs. If all you care about is what do I play best with. Then experiment and find out. That's where cue repairmen and cue builders come in. As players we ALL have to PAY DUES to play better. There are very few shortcuts.
Tom Gedris, Triple Cross Cues
Big C said:
Big C,
You've pretty much answered your own question through hands on independent trials. Predator plays better....period.
All of us on the Predator side of the fence appreciate your unsolicited testimonial. I don't work for Predator but have probably built (mated & matched), more Predator shafts to a very wide variety of cues, than anyone else in the country. I'm a cue-builder whose primary focus is on performance rather than art. While my own shafts play very well, I have yet to find a shaft that plays better than a Predator. On my personal player, I play a 314 (30+"). Your stated experience has given credit to what $1,000,000 worth of engineering has set out to accomplish.
I've been totally honest with you and am about to take that one step further. I get paid the same whether I'm building an OB, 314 or Z. I'm going to strongly suggest that you actually play with a 314-2 before you buy one. That may be tough to do, I know but the reason I say this is that some long time 314 users have reported that the 314-2 plays a little different. They may play different IN your favor or they may not. You owe it to yourself to try one first and find out for yourself.
Another fact that may or may not concern you is that the 314-1 partials came at a length in excess of 30" while the 314-2 partials are 29 3/4" max. 314-1 partials are ALMOST non-existent anymore.
If I can be of further assistance, please let me know.
Just my personal opinion:
I used to play with predator shafts years ago before I found out how much better a quality wood shaft plays than Predator for me. When you do find the right shaft, the tone and feel is so much better than any predator/ob shaft out there.
I'm not a pro player so can't really comment on what you can and can't do with a certain shaft like Predator when it come to deflection etc vs what a a quality shaft can do. Personally, I find it easier to play with a predator shaft when I was using them but when I had a chance to play with a Southwest which uses some of the best shafts wood in the industry...I couldn't stop shooting. The tone and feel of a good shaft is just so much better...don't know how I would be able to explain other than to say it more natural to me.
Alex P. won the world championship and US Open using his schon and predator shaft...when I ask if he would switch..he said he can't...because he been using it for so long it hard to go back to regular shaft. I think if he had a chance to start out playing with a southwest (any good quality shaft) etc..that it would be hard for him to play with a predator. Than again he and maybe 50% of pro that play with Predator probably know something that I done
Regardless, I still like my weinstock with one of the straightest grain shaft on it.
There are some builders that don't pay as much attention to shaft quality but there are lot of custom cue builders that do pay attention to these details that make their cues play that much better than any predator out there.
Regards,
Duc.
I used to play with predator shafts years ago before I found out how much better a quality wood shaft plays than Predator for me. When you do find the right shaft, the tone and feel is so much better than any predator/ob shaft out there.
I'm not a pro player so can't really comment on what you can and can't do with a certain shaft like Predator when it come to deflection etc vs what a a quality shaft can do. Personally, I find it easier to play with a predator shaft when I was using them but when I had a chance to play with a Southwest which uses some of the best shafts wood in the industry...I couldn't stop shooting. The tone and feel of a good shaft is just so much better...don't know how I would be able to explain other than to say it more natural to me.
Alex P. won the world championship and US Open using his schon and predator shaft...when I ask if he would switch..he said he can't...because he been using it for so long it hard to go back to regular shaft. I think if he had a chance to start out playing with a southwest (any good quality shaft) etc..that it would be hard for him to play with a predator. Than again he and maybe 50% of pro that play with Predator probably know something that I done
Regardless, I still like my weinstock with one of the straightest grain shaft on it.There are some builders that don't pay as much attention to shaft quality but there are lot of custom cue builders that do pay attention to these details that make their cues play that much better than any predator out there.
Regards,
Duc.