# Shaft weight matter? My jacoby black arrived.

#### Bavafongoul

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not my intention to compose a poke in the eye post so don’t take it that way.

When you have a cue butt weighing 15.15 ozs and shaft weighing 4.0 ozs.,
the shaft represents 20.9% (pretty ideal in my opinion), not 26%.....bad math.

24% tends to be the best max weight ratio and as I earlier wrote, 20-22% seems
to be the best ratio based purely on my own experience with having cues made.

15.15 ozs. + 4.0 ozs = 19.15 ozs. (the actual play weight of the assembled cue)
4.0 divided by 19.15 = 0.20887728 or 0.2089 (move decimal to the right 2 spaces)
.2089 = 20.9%...........double check.......19.15 ozs x .209 (20.9%) = 4.00235 ozs.

Folks, any cue maker that doesn’t recognize and appreciate that there is a weight
relationship between the shaft & butt and factor it in when building cue is a dunce.

#### Bavafongoul

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not my intention to compose a poke in the eye post so don’t take it that way.

When you have a cue butt weighing 15.15 ozs and shaft weighing 4.0 ozs.,
the shaft represents 20.9% (pretty ideal in my opinion), not 26%.....bad math.

24% tends to be the best max weight ratio and as I earlier wrote, 20-22% seems
to be the best ratio based purely on my own experience with having cues made.

15.15 ozs. + 4.0 ozs = 19.15 ozs. (the actual play weight of the assembled cue)
4.0 divided by 19.15 = 0.20887728 or 0.2089 (move decimal to the right 2 spaces)
.2089 = 20.9%...........double check.......19.15 ozs x .209 (20.9%) = 4.00235 ozs.

Folks, any cue maker that doesn’t recognize and appreciate that there is a weight
relationship between the shaft & butt and factor it in when building cue is a dunce.
If you tell Seybert’s they shipped a cue shaft that is not what you ordered
and you indeed ordered a CF shaft that should have been 12.3mm, Seyberts
owes you reimbursement or store credit for your return shipping cost. You are
not required to have to pay double the normal shipping cost in order to get
what you originally ordered. Seybert’s either shipped the wrong shaft or else
has a claim against Jacoby for a flawed shaft (wrong mm size) or wrong item.

#### smoochie

##### NotLikeThis
If you tell Seybert’s they shipped a cue shaft that is not what you ordered
and you indeed ordered a CF shaft that should have been 12.3mm, Seyberts
owes you reimbursement or store credit for your return shipping cost. You are
not required to have to pay double the normal shipping cost in order to get
what you originally ordered. Seybert’s either shipped the wrong shaft or else
has a claim against Jacoby for a flawed shaft (wrong mm size) or wrong item.
Yes I just received an email from seyberts they checked the receipt of mine and it states that I ordered a 12.3mm shaft, then they checked and all their jacoby shafts are 12.7, so they indeed sent me a wrong shaft that I did not order because they don't have 12.3mm according to the person who emailed me, I really don't get why they sent me the 12.7mm shaft its a waste of shipping money. so therefore I feel that its all went down to a waste of shipping money and waste of time imo, I still will pay for shipping back.

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#### ShootingArts

##### Smorg is giving St Peter the 7!
Gold Member
Silver Member
I think it was probably a lack of knowledge on the part of the person pulling and shipping items. While Seyberts is first class to deal with and most on here will stick up for them as I will, their error, their shipping both ways.

I have been in a double handful of businesses over the years. Few mistakes made so that was one reason I could go with my policy, unless it was the customer's fault, full refund even if that meant I went out of pocket. Sometimes it was my fault or my employee's fault, sometimes a suppliers fault, sometimes nobody's fault, didn't matter. I have had more than one unhappy customer come in all set for a major battle and surprised when I said no problem we will make it right. Unless you have already agreed to pay shipping let them pay. Get tracking even if that is on your dime. "Murphy" is always looking over our shoulders and laughing. If there is any package likely to go astray it is your return. I suspect you still have original materials but a final note, never ship in something round on the outside.

Hu

#### Bavafongoul

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Before you send the shaft back, ask Seybert’s how they intend to reimburse for shipping costs both ways
since you had to pay for the wrong item (Seybert’s blame) to reach you and now you incur return cost too.

If Seybert had originally said they didn’t have the shaft you wanted (12.3mm), you never would have placed
the order which was done in good faith. Without any doubt whatsoever, they literally stole your money, albeit
likely from an innocent mistake on their part. Nonetheless, they need to reimburse shipping costs both ways.

You could also contact Jacoby directly. Tell them what Seybert’s did, that Seybert doesn’t have any 12.3mm
CF shafts and could you directly swap shafts with them. Jacoby may feel sympathetic since it was one of
their distributors that created this problem . Now you are out shipping costs and still don’t have what you want.

It is a lousy situation but you did not do a single thing wrong. Seybert’s owes you an apology and a refund on all
Don’t be a pushover either because you are completely in the right to get reimbursed 100% for Seybert’s mistake.

Matt B.

#### 9ball5032

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I bought a used Jacoby black (5/16x14). It weighed 4.308 ounces on a calibrated scale. It measured 12.5mm. Normally I would be very happy since I use heavier shafts (4.6 & 4.7) on the butts I was gonna use it on. But it seems that this Jacoby shaft had all the weight distributed evenly throughout the shaft. Every time I hit a ball with it it felt heavy. At least I got a good deal on it.

#### PoolBum

##### Ace in the side.
Silver Member
24% tends to be the best max weight ratio and as I earlier wrote, 20-22% seems
to be the best ratio based purely on my own experience with having cues made.
That's interesting. I just calculated the % on my playing cue (James White) and got 21.025%.

#### Bavafongoul

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have been preaching this for years. The great names in cue making all know this.
The legendary cue makers pioneered this and others came along and emulated it.

I have never found any cue with original maple shafts under 18% to play decently.
And the higher the %, the better the cue felt to me. So I spoke with lots of cue makers.

Selection of woods for a cue is the most important start of any cue build. Meeting the
client’s specifications, if any were given, is the cue maker’s mission & shafts are critical.

Let’s always remember what one pool player likes another might not care for at all. Cue
specs, cue tips, cue wraps (or none), joint type, ferrule size & composition. It’s a lot to consider.

I am just offering this as food for thought for any folks thinking or having a cue built. You do not
order a new auto & let the dealership choose the color & options. So too it is with a custom cue.

Matt B.

#### smoochie

##### NotLikeThis
I agree with who said that seyberts should take care of the shipping back, but sadly I already paid the shipping back cost, I also paid the shipping to here from the start, then also I will pay 3rd time for shipping to me yet again after they received it.

I think I'm clueless when it comes to ordering online but that what happened. I paid \$30 to ship here, now I paid \$35 to ship back, then ill pay another \$30 to ship to here again when I change the cue that I ordered, this time I will go with predator instead of the jacoby that I sent back.

##### Registered
I agree with who said that seyberts should take care of the shipping back, but sadly I already paid the shipping back cost, I also paid the shipping to here from the start, then also I will pay 3rd time for shipping to me yet again after they received it.

I think I'm clueless when it comes to ordering online but that what happened. I paid \$30 to ship here, now I paid \$35 to ship back, then ill pay another \$30 to ship to here again when I change the cue that I ordered, this time I will go with predator instead of the jacoby that I sent back.
Why would you pay to ship it originally? They have free shipping on orders over \$99. I would also think that would apply on the new shaft they send you

#### jtompilot

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hello, you know my other thread when I was looking to buy a cf shaft, ended up buying a Jacoby black shaft, prior to buying I asked around and found that mostly the Jacoby black is 3.4 to 3.6 oz, which is nice a low, as low as my Meucci pro shaft.

Also, I know for a fact that the lower the weight, the lower the deflection.

So my Jacoby black arrived from Seybert's but it weights more than 4.1oz, keep in mind its the default length, i.e. 29

So mine is higher in weight, why the inconsistency? does this mean my CF is higher in deflection too? Should I speak to Mr.Jacoby about this, thanks.

EDIT: So I measured the diameter of shaft, I ordered a 12.3mm, my measurement with caliper showed 12.6 to 12.7 around these numbers, so I figure that what added the extra weight, most jacoby blacks are 3.4 to 3.5oz, but mine 4.1oz, so what to do now, should I just keep it even though I ordered a 12.3mm?
I can’t find the other thread but I finally got to weigh and measure four shafts.

Jacoby Black 12.3
Weight. 3.8
Size 12.39

6 month old Revo 12.4
Weight 4.0
Size 12.41

2+ year old Revo 12.4
Weight 3.7
Size 12.39

314-3
Weight 3.7
Size 12.69

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#### jtompilot

##### AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I updated the info with more shafts. All shafts are radial pin